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Offline stymo1

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HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« on: January 24, 2009, 11:11:50 pm »
Blair Holt, Other Gun-control Efforts, on Horizon

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/crime/693

Written by Alan Scholl   
Monday, 19 January 2009 18:02

No sane person wants innocent people victimized, maimed, or murdered, nor to see the perpetrators escape justice. This is true, whether the perpetrators use their hands or objects — like baseball bats, rocks, knives, vehicles, or a host of other readily available inanimate objects of endless variety — or a firearm. It is the intent and the will of the criminals, and not the inanimate objects they use, that are responsible for the criminal acts and the harm done to victims.

From the dawn of man, violent acts have been a sad aspect of life in nearly every civilization and culture. The violence in prisons shows how ineffective even close confinement, total control, and total surveillance can be in preventing this.

Many heavily restrictive governments have failed to prevent violence. In fact, history has shown that powerful, unrestrained governments commit murder and other acts of violence against their own citizens. According to careful statistical analysis by Professor R. J. Rummel of the University of Hawaii, in his detailed work Death By Government, "The more power a government has, the more it can act arbitrarily according to the whims and desires of the elite, and the more it will make war on others and murder its foreign and domestic subjects." On the other hand, "The more constrained the power of governments, the more power is diffused, checked, and balanced, the less it will aggress on others."

Regardless of who commits the crimes, brutality and murder are moral issues, and the means or equipment used is really immaterial to the root problem, which is the condition of the human heart and mind. In our system of government, an important check against immoral acts of violence — whether committed by individuals acting alone, gangs, or unrestrained government — is the Second Amendment, which guarantees "the right of the people to keep and bear arms."


Yet today in America, the proponents of civilian disarmament often insist that inflicting a grievous wrong on all citizens — removing their most effective means of defense against the violence, in contradiction of the Second Amendment — will somehow correct the underlying moral problem.

Many Americans fear that despite the evidence, we are about to witness a broad array of gun-control efforts to limit or completely disenfranchise Americans' right to keep and bear arms.

After last November's elections changed the political climate at the national level and in a number of states, a huge surge in gun sales has been reported among retailers and dealers. FOX News' Catherine Herridge reported that the month Barack Obama was elected, the number of background checks was 42 percent greater than in November 2007. "It's not a hard tea leaf to read," said Jim Shepherd, publisher of the news service Outdoor Wire, which claims Obama's election has "frightened consumers into action."

Obama has repeatedly stated that he supports Second Amendment rights and will not crack down on gun owners, and in June he said he agreed with the Supreme Court when it overturned the District of Columbia handgun ban. But gun owners are not convinced. Obama's legislative record in support of gun control, and his offhand remark during the primaries that small-town Americans are "bitter" and "cling to their guns," suggest a very different approach to firearms regulation during his presidency. A December poll from Southwick Associates found that 80 percent of hunters and shooters expect the new administration and a Democratic Congress will make purchasing firearms more difficult.

An electronic news service that covers outdoor news has even named Obama its "Gun Salesman of the Year." "It's clear that gun owners and prospective gun owners are concerned about the incoming Obama administration and Congress," said Ted Novin, spokesman for the National Shooting Sports Foundation.

As a sentaor, incoming Vice President Joe Biden was a strong supporter of the assault-weapons ban, which was signed into law by President Clinton in 1994. As a state legislator in Illinois, Barack Obama backed a ban on semiautomatic weapons.

Obama will likely use the heavily liberal legislative bodies in Washington and in statehouses across the nation to help them accomplish this disenfranchisement of Americans piecemeal over the next few years. Unwittingly, or intentionally, many of our elected leaders are working hard to remove the ability of Americans to effectively defend themselves corporately — as our forefathers did — or individually against crime.

Touted as measures to prevent crime or capture criminals, they completely ignore the concept of individual rights on several levels. Nearly all will insert state or federal government very powerfully and dangerously deep into the personal and property rights and daily activities of law-abiding American people.

Nearly every one of these efforts will instead either disarm or make criminals of a wide spectrum of law-abiding citizens by means of a dizzying array of new regulations, laws, taxes, and rules.

The Obama administration will almost certainly lead the charge. A federal bill, H.R. 45, also known as "Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009," is a good example of an Obama-endorsed bill that threatens all of the ill effects mentioned above.

This bill was named after teenaged Blair Holt, a Julian High School student killed on a city bus in Chicago.

The bill requires a "Blair Holt" license, involving a detailed application including photo, thumb print, written test, release of mental health records, and new fees. Firearms owners would also be required to report all gun transfers (even those to other family members) to the attorney general's database. It would also be illegal for a licensed gun owner to fail to record a gun loss or theft within 72 hours or fail to report a change of address within 60 days. H.R. 45 is a relaunch of H.R. 2666 in 2007, co-sponsored by 15 other representatives including Barack Obama's new chief of staff, Rahm Emmanuel.

The Northeast, a major battleground in this fight over the right to keep and bear arms, is home to monuments dedicated to men who two centuries ago fought and died to keep British soldiers from removing cannon, powder, and shot from storehouses in Lexington and Concord. They knew tyranny would follow disarmament.

As a nation our elected leaders and many in law enforcement have lost sight of the significance of that series of events and their purpose and the importance of arms to preserving liberty. In efforts supposedly intended to stem the moral problems that spawn the violence, they have turned to restricting liberty and denying law-abiding Americans a means of self-defense.
" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q

Offline Zed

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HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2009, 11:28:28 pm »
Blair Holt, Other Gun-control Efforts, on Horizon

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/crime/693

Written by Alan Scholl   
Monday, 19 January 2009 18:02

No sane person wants innocent people victimized, maimed, or murdered, nor to see the perpetrators escape justice. This is true, whether the perpetrators use their hands or objects — like baseball bats, rocks, knives, vehicles, or a host of other readily available inanimate objects of endless variety — or a firearm. It is the intent and the will of the criminals, and not the inanimate objects they use, that are responsible for the criminal acts and the harm done to victims.

From the dawn of man, violent acts have been a sad aspect of life in nearly every civilization and culture. The violence in prisons shows how ineffective even close confinement, total control, and total surveillance can be in preventing this.

Many heavily restrictive governments have failed to prevent violence. In fact, history has shown that powerful, unrestrained governments commit murder and other acts of violence against their own citizens. According to careful statistical analysis by Professor R. J. Rummel of the University of Hawaii, in his detailed work Death By Government, "The more power a government has, the more it can act arbitrarily according to the whims and desires of the elite, and the more it will make war on others and murder its foreign and domestic subjects." On the other hand, "The more constrained the power of governments, the more power is diffused, checked, and balanced, the less it will aggress on others."

Regardless of who commits the crimes, brutality and murder are moral issues, and the means or equipment used is really immaterial to the root problem, which is the condition of the human heart and mind. In our system of government, an important check against immoral acts of violence — whether committed by individuals acting alone, gangs, or unrestrained government — is the Second Amendment, which guarantees "the right of the people to keep and bear arms."


Yet today in America, the proponents of civilian disarmament often insist that inflicting a grievous wrong on all citizens — removing their most effective means of defense against the violence, in contradiction of the Second Amendment — will somehow correct the underlying moral problem.

Many Americans fear that despite the evidence, we are about to witness a broad array of gun-control efforts to limit or completely disenfranchise Americans' right to keep and bear arms.

After last November's elections changed the political climate at the national level and in a number of states, a huge surge in gun sales has been reported among retailers and dealers. FOX News' Catherine Herridge reported that the month Barack Obama was elected, the number of background checks was 42 percent greater than in November 2007. "It's not a hard tea leaf to read," said Jim Shepherd, publisher of the news service Outdoor Wire, which claims Obama's election has "frightened consumers into action."

Obama has repeatedly stated that he supports Second Amendment rights and will not crack down on gun owners, and in June he said he agreed with the Supreme Court when it overturned the District of Columbia handgun ban. But gun owners are not convinced. Obama's legislative record in support of gun control, and his offhand remark during the primaries that small-town Americans are "bitter" and "cling to their guns," suggest a very different approach to firearms regulation during his presidency. A December poll from Southwick Associates found that 80 percent of hunters and shooters expect the new administration and a Democratic Congress will make purchasing firearms more difficult.

An electronic news service that covers outdoor news has even named Obama its "Gun Salesman of the Year." "It's clear that gun owners and prospective gun owners are concerned about the incoming Obama administration and Congress," said Ted Novin, spokesman for the National Shooting Sports Foundation.

As a sentaor, incoming Vice President Joe Biden was a strong supporter of the assault-weapons ban, which was signed into law by President Clinton in 1994. As a state legislator in Illinois, Barack Obama backed a ban on semiautomatic weapons.

Obama will likely use the heavily liberal legislative bodies in Washington and in statehouses across the nation to help them accomplish this disenfranchisement of Americans piecemeal over the next few years. Unwittingly, or intentionally, many of our elected leaders are working hard to remove the ability of Americans to effectively defend themselves corporately — as our forefathers did — or individually against crime.

Touted as measures to prevent crime or capture criminals, they completely ignore the concept of individual rights on several levels. Nearly all will insert state or federal government very powerfully and dangerously deep into the personal and property rights and daily activities of law-abiding American people.

Nearly every one of these efforts will instead either disarm or make criminals of a wide spectrum of law-abiding citizens by means of a dizzying array of new regulations, laws, taxes, and rules.

The Obama administration will almost certainly lead the charge. A federal bill, H.R. 45, also known as "Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009," is a good example of an Obama-endorsed bill that threatens all of the ill effects mentioned above.

This bill was named after teenaged Blair Holt, a Julian High School student killed on a city bus in Chicago.

The bill requires a "Blair Holt" license, involving a detailed application including photo, thumb print, written test, release of mental health records, and new fees. Firearms owners would also be required to report all gun transfers (even those to other family members) to the attorney general's database. It would also be illegal for a licensed gun owner to fail to record a gun loss or theft within 72 hours or fail to report a change of address within 60 days. H.R. 45 is a relaunch of H.R. 2666 in 2007, co-sponsored by 15 other representatives including Barack Obama's new chief of staff, Rahm Emmanuel.

The Northeast, a major battleground in this fight over the right to keep and bear arms, is home to monuments dedicated to men who two centuries ago fought and died to keep British soldiers from removing cannon, powder, and shot from storehouses in Lexington and Concord. They knew tyranny would follow disarmament.

As a nation our elected leaders and many in law enforcement have lost sight of the significance of that series of events and their purpose and the importance of arms to preserving liberty. In efforts supposedly intended to stem the moral problems that spawn the violence, they have turned to restricting liberty and denying law-abiding Americans a means of self-defense.

GREAT Article!
"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." 101 Things to Do 'Til the Revolution

Offline stymo1

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HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2009, 11:32:58 pm »
The War on Guns

http://waronguns.blogspot.com/2009/01/guest-editorial-hr-45-assault-weapons.html

Tuesday, January 20, 2009
Guest Editorial: HR 45, the Assault Weapons Ban, and the Hegelian Dialectic
by Dominus Defensor

The Obama administration wants to craft a new assault weapon ban and make it permanent, and it wants to end the private sale of all firearms, among other things. This announcement from the potential attorney general is one of the most important events for the gun rights community in a long time. This is the first public expression of Obama's plans by an identifiable individual within the Obama administration.

At the 1-16-2009 Senate Judiciary Hearings Eric Holder said the following: "I also think that making the assault weapons ban permanent would be something that would be permitted under Heller, and I also think [it] would be good...."

The announcement by Holder is likely the real plan of the administration. The previously announced HR45 is likely a diversion as part of the implementation and execution of the Hegelian Dialectic. HR45, as recently discussed at WOG and at examiner.com outlines the draconian plans to require licenses to own firearms, the passing of a written exam, government access to your private medical records, and a central registry of all gun owners, etc. All of this just for the exercise of a fundamental human right.

HR45 is probably not their real agenda for the moment (not that they would be upset if they did achieve it). It was announced with perfect timing right before the Holder confirmation hearings. The drafting and announcement of HR45 was likely designed to achieve the following goals:

1. Execution of the Hegelian Dialectic. They intentionally create a sense of panic with the proposed draconian legislation (HR45) that the boot is about to stomp our heads. Then, when they subsequently release their slightly less draconian plans at the confirmation hearings for Holder (assault weapon ban, end all private transfers of guns, etc.), we breathe a sigh of relief that things are not as bad as we thought and voluntarily accept lesser infringements. (NOTE: it could be argued that the real plan is just the opposite in that HR45 is the goal and not another assault weapon ban. Either way, their ultimate goal is to deny us our fundamental human right to keep and bear arms, and the main thing for us is to understand the tactics behind their actions.)

We must counter this by knowing the nature and origin of our rights and refusing to surrender them in the most loud and raucous way possible. Never voluntarily surrender any rights. We must reinforce the idea that attempting to take these rights will come at a great cost for the enemy because we will never voluntarily submit to their abuses or their tricks. This is not a call to violence

Summary of the Hegelian Dialectic:

This has been explained before, but here is another summary.

The basic premise of the Hegelian Dialectic is to incrementally move in the desired direction to the detriment of a group of people with the voluntary consent of the aggrieved people. This is done through fear and release. First, a terrifying plan is leaked out that would mean catastrophe or a gross violation of the target people's rights. Then, a less extreme plan is proposed as a compromise to the more extreme plan. This makes the target feel relieved that things will not be as bad as originally thought, creating a sense of release, and the target voluntarily chooses to submit to the less extreme plan under the false hope that the bad guys will be satiated and under the false belief that a crisis has been averted by choosing the lesser of two evils. The bad guys are NEVER satiated, and they will be back for more in the future. In addition, choosing the lesser of two evils as dictated by the bad guys is never the solution. We must dictate our own solutions that confront evil.

2. Divert attention from the Holder hearings so gun owners and freedom lovers will not pay attention to the planned infringements that are being publicly announced during the hearings. They are not hiding their plans from us. However, they are using simple tricks to make us look the other direction. Everything we need to know about their plans is right in front of our faces. They are simply creating the psychological opportunity for us to ignore reality.

We must counter this by facing reality, accepting what has been exposed right before our eyes, and getting the issues to the forefront. Also, we must publicly expose their actions and their plans in the most loud and raucous way possible. This does not mean we should ignore HR45. In fact, the recent efforts by David and and gun rights activists at examiner.com were very impressive, and they should serve as a model for how to agitate against Obama's plans as announced by Holder. We must understand their tactics and keep them under steady pressure on all fronts.

Here are the recent efforts at examiner.com:
-"Qualifying Firearms"
-"Kill (the) Bill"

3. Condition the target (us) to eventually accept the more draconian plan in the future and test the target for compliance and submissiveness. By constantly barraging the target with threatened attacks and incremental infringements, the hope is that the target will eventually grow weary of threats to the peace and will decide that the constant threats of warfare are not worth the price. They also want to use numerous small attacks to make it seem like they have an impossibly large number of supporters. The enemy believes that if they keep this up long enough, one of their attacks will eventually reveal us as totally submissive and compliant to their plans. They also hope that we will feel overwhelmed and give up. The war will be over at that point, and they are gradually trying to move us in that direction.

We must counter this by refusing to submit in a loud and raucous manner at every opportunity. We must push back at every attack point because we will find that their forces are spread very thin and offer very little in the form of dedicated, deep resistance at any point. This is obvious whenever we take an aggressive stand against them - all opposition melts away, and we are left standing alone and victorious. The perfect examples are the recent battles over at examiner.com on HR45. In every case, the enemy threw in the towel in the presence of our onslaught and disappeared into the night. We must make it clear that we will never grow weary of the fight, and we must be prepared to back up our words with the relevant actions. Not a call for rebellion or violence

4. Provide plausible deniability for the Obama administration in that they did not publicly propose the more draconian HR45. Obama and his administration can point the finger at "extremists" outside of their administration who drafted HR45. Obama can then play the role of a great compromiser (and a moderate, to boot) by proposing a less extreme agenda than what is found in HR45. The "less extreme" agenda will actually be filled with extremist plans (e.g.; permanent assault weapon, end of private transfer of firearms, etc.), but these plans will seem tame compared to what is in HR45.

We must counter this by exposing the fraud of their behavior, and we must never let the Obama administration successfully play the moderate/compromiser card. We must "name names", and never let anyone off the hook for their actions.

Conclusion

The tactics of the enemy reveal that he is weak. If he were strong, he would launch a direct attack against us and crush us with a single blow. He is not strong enough to beat us with a single blow, nor does he have the broad public support that the media deceptively portrays. The other side of this coin is that we are strong. The only way the enemy can beat us is if we voluntarily submit to his simple tricks. His tricks have now been revealed to everyone. Now, we must use our knowledge and continue to fight back. The war is clearly on, and so are we.
" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q

Offline stymo1

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HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2009, 11:49:46 pm »
'Qualifying firearms'

http://www.examiner.com/x-1417-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m1d13-Qualifying-fireams


January 13, 8:10 AM
by David Codrea, Gun Rights Examiner


It has begun.

Despite assurances to the contrary, some democrats are champing at the bit to institute citizen disarmament, and like impulsive children, can't even wait for their guy to be inaugurated.

Ladies and gentlemen, I give you H.R.45, Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009, introduced in the House one week ago today by Rep. Bobby Rush (D-IL).

Per Jeff Knox of The Firearms Coalition:

    If passed, this bill would require that anyone wishing to purchase, own, or possess a "qualifying firearm" - that's any handgun, and any long gun capable of accepting a detachable magazine - would have to be licensed by the state or the federal government in a licensing program managed by the Attorney General. To get a license you would have to prove you're you, provide a passport-style photo, a thumbprint, and take a written exam which includes questions about firearms safety, safe storage, the risks of firearms ownership, and anything else the Attorney General deems appropriate. All transfers would be required to go through a licensed dealer with the exception of occasional gifts or bequests between parents, children (18 or over), and grandparents, or loans of not more than 30 days between "persons who are personally known to one another." (It actually says that. I'm not making this up.) And all transfers would have to be recorded in a "Transfer Record" established and maintained by the Attorney General.

    The bill also makes it a crime for a dealer to have shoddy records or fail to appropriately cooperate with any inspectors. It makes failure to report the loss or theft of a firearm within 72 hours a felony punishable by up to 2 years in prison. Failure to keep a firearm locked up in such a way as to keep it inaccessible to anyone under 18 becomes a federal felony too.

Read the bill for yourself .

As of now, it has no co-sponsors. Some will tell you that means there's no cause for alarm. Some may even tell us this has no chance of passing (now), and to expend effort opposing it will weaken future political efforts.

One mass shooting in a "no guns" zone from now, (Florida Shootings) that could change, and this could come to the front burner. Along with the anticipated push to permanently ban (that means no "sunset clause" this time) all semiautomatics by both name and characteristic.

Here's the important part: It will make it illegal for you to possess guns you currently legally own unless you go jump through their hoops, register yourself and obtain a license. All under the watchful oversight of Eric Holder--another grave danger to gun rights our lobbyists see no need to expend "political capital" on.

This is what the gunhaters mean by "common sense gun control" and "reasonable restrictions."  So much for "shall not be infringed."

This is nothing less than a declaration of war on American gun owners.

Naturally, I'll have more as things develop. Come to think of it, I'll have more over the coming days.

I intend to go through everything this tyrannical edict proposes, and expose it for the evil and ridiculous affront to Liberty that it is.

" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q

Offline stymo1

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2009, 07:16:38 pm »
Congress Fires First Shot : H.R. 45 Filed on First Day



From one of our own member's site.

http://waronyou.com/forums/index.php?topic=5654.0

Representative Bobby Rush (D-IL) filed a comprehensive anti-gun wish-list bill in the 111th Congress on its first day in session.  No sooner were the new members of Congress sworn in than Mr. Rush, a former Black Panther leader, file his bill which he calls the "Blair Holt's Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009".  The bill has no cosponsors and was automatically referred to the House Judiciary Committee.

   If passed, this bill would require that anyone wishing to purchase, own, or possess a "qualifying firearm" - that's any handgun, and any long gun capable of accepting a detachable magazine - would have to be licensed by the state or the federal government in a licensing program managed by the Attorney General.  To get a license you would have to prove you're you, provide a passport-style photo, a thumbprint, and take a written exam which includes questions about firearms safety, safe storage, the risks of firearms ownership, and anything else the Attorney General deems appropriate.   All transfers would be required to go through a licensed dealer with the exception of occasional gifts or bequests between parents, children (18 or over), and grandparents, or loans of not more than 30 days between "persons who are personally known to one another." (It actually says that.  I'm not making this up.)  And all transfers would have to be recorded in a "Transfer Record" established and maintained by the Attorney General.

   The bill also makes it a crime for a dealer to have shoddy records or fail to appropriately cooperate with any inspectors. It makes failure to report the loss or theft of a firearm within 72 hours a felony punishable by up to 2 years in prison.  Failure to keep a firearm locked up in such a way as to keep it inaccessible to anyone under 18 becomes a federal felony too.

   There's more, but it's just more nonsense and I'm getting a headache.  You can read the bill by clicking here then entering "HR 45" in the search box, click "Bill Number" and hit "Search."

   The inescapable irony here is that the bill is named for a young man who gave his life shielding a girl on a city bus in Chicago.  Of course Illinois already has a licensing law and Chicago has laws against possession of almost any firearm, but still a 16-year old gang-banger got a semi-auto pistol from a 15-year old gang-banger and told students waiting at the bus stop what he was going to do before the bus arrived.  This sad story is just proof positive that gun control works.  The fact that the bill was introduced by Bobby Rush, former Black Panther, is just more irony than I can stand.

   The good news is that I don't think this bill is going to go anywhere, but it does clearly indicate the direction our opponents want to take things.  Note that the bill keeps stacking more responsibility and authority on the Attorney General.  Don't let this anti-gun pipe-dream distract you from the immediate task at hand - fighting the appointment of Eric holder as Attorney General.

   Whenever you see discussion of this or any other legislation on the gun forums this week, please be sure to post a comment reminding folks to send e-mails and make calls to the Senate demanding that the nomination of Eric holder be rejected.
   While H.R.45 is ugly, it is not imminent - Holder is.
" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q

Offline stymo1

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2009, 07:34:41 pm »
HR45 – More feel good gun control legislation sponsored by the Democrats

http://www.themindoftefft.com/blog/2009/01/19/hr45-more-feel-good-gun-control-legislation-sponsored-by-the-democrats/

By mtefft • on January 19, 2009

It’s that time of year again. Another House Resolution designed to further erode our 2nd amendment rights is being introduced by Democratic Congressman Bobby Rush of Illinois. HR45, also called Blair Holt’s Firearm Licensing and Record of Sale Act of 2009, is another bill designed to make it more difficult for law-abiding citizens to obtain a firearm while doing nothing to keep firearms out of the hands of criminals.

You can read the details of the resolution here but a few of the highlights are:

    * It will be “unlawful” to own a firearm without a license.
    * Be required to submit a picture and thumbprint.
    * Provide certification that the firearms are properly stored.
    * Pass a written firearms exam which tests a persons knowledge of the safe storage of firearms in the presence of children, safe handling of firearms, risks associated with firearms, legal responsibilities of a firearm owner, and anything else the Attorney General deems fit.
    * A release of any mental health records.
    * Makes private sales illegal.
    * Establishes a Federal Record of Sale system which records make, model, serial number, license of the transferee and name and address of the transferor.
    * Provides for inspection of your home (fourth amendment violation)
    * Reporting of lost or stolen firearms
    * Notice of change of address
    * Numerous other fun nuggets.

I find it particularly repugnant that the title of the bill refers to Blair Holt. Blair Holt was a young man who was fatally shot while trying to defend some passengers on a bus from being shot by a 16 year old gang-banger. The fact that the shooter was a 16 year old gang member who could not possibly legally own a firearm does not stop Congressman Bobby Rush from using it to add an emotional aspect to the legislation. There are certainly no logical reasons for a bill like this to be passed. Perhaps if one of the passengers on the bus had been armed with a legal firearm the whole tragedy could have been averted.

A large part of the bill has to do with licensing and registration. The Federal government is always trying to add more paperwork to legal gun ownership. I am sure there will be fees involved with all this, making it another source of revenue for the government.

Another section of the bill has to do with safety and training. While the 1,500 annual accidental deaths due to firearms are certainly tragic, giving the fact that there are 80 million firearms in the United States the statistics prove that the vast majority of gun owners already know how to safely store and use firearms. All firearms that are sold today are mandated to have gun locks included. Most people that purchase a handgun voluntarily take courses on their safe storage and operation. Passing a federally mandated firearms exam will do nothing to ensure that irresponsible gun owners will start acting responsibly any more than laws against drunk drivers will prevent some people from driving drunk.

I have heard some liberal gun control advocates argue the car ownership analogy. It goes something along the line of:

    * Need a license to drive a car.
    * Need a photo on file to drive a car.
    * Need to pass two tests to drive a car.
    * Have to get the car inspected regularly.
    * Have to have the car licensed.

So why should anyone complain about similar requirements for gun ownership? The problems with this analogy are many. You don’t  need a license to buy an automobile. You can own any car you choose as long as you don’t take it on a public road. You only need to register your car if you plan on driving it on a public thoroughfare. Anyone (including violent criminals) can purchase a car. A drivers license is valid in all 50 states. There is no waiting period to purchase an automobile. There is no limit on how many cars you can own or how many you can buy per month.

There is nothing in HR45 that will further prevent criminals from illegally obtaining guns. Likewise there is nothing in HR45 that will significantly reduce the number of accidental gun deaths. The only thing that HR45 will accomplish is a further erosion of the rights of citizens to legally own firearms as provided for by the Constitution. In fact, it has been shown time and again that legal ownership of firearms reduces violent crime as well as other types of crimes such as robbery, burglary, etc. Washington DC had some of the most stringent gun control laws on the books yet had one of the highest homicide rates in the United States.

I urge everyone who is concerned about the constant erosion of our civil liberties and rights to write your congressman in opposition to this resolution. Signing away your rights in order to exercise your 2nd amendment rights is not an option.

" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q

Offline stymo1

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HR 45 MUST READ
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2009, 08:03:23 pm »

This one is a must read. Best explanation I have found to date...
Don't ban the guns, just ban ownership!!!!


Jan. 21, 2009. Gun Rights Licensing Planned (HR 45) PLUS -- SHOT Show 2009


http://www.gunlaws.com/GunLawUpdate4-SHOTnHR45.htm


Illinois congressman Bobby Rush, from Obama's home state and with a voting record on gun ownership as bad as Obama's, introduced a bill on the first day of the 111th Congress that shows what we can expect. If we don't defeat this bill, and others expected to follow it, gun owners will lose guns and the industry will suffer harm beyond description.

Under HR 45, if you can't pass a complex test written by the U.S. Attorney General (described in detail below), pay the tax, give up fingerprints and a biometric-capable photo of yourself (that can be turned into a digital facial-recognition number and used as a de facto national ID), every gun you own will become contraband and subject to confiscation, while you stand trial before imprisonment. You'd think Bobby, a former black panther, would know better.

Your rights will have an expiration date, and if you screw up and miss it, you'll be in the same mess as people who can't pass the test. Can you say "unconstitutional"? Do you think these "gun bigots" care?

Now that the Supreme Court has made it clear in the Heller case that government can't ban guns, the Brady's have stopped saying they want to ban guns. So the virtually treasonous Bobby Rush bill doesn't ban guns, it bans gun owners, maybe by the millions. How many gun owners read poorly or don't test well? How many can't explain local, state and federal gun laws? They'd become prohibited possessors under HR 45. Are there any limits to what the AG can put on the test? The bill doesn't mention any -- it gives the AG a free hand to include anything.

Had enough? HR 45 has an innocent-looking line that says 'strike the second sentence of 18 USC 926(a)'. That's the line that says the federal government cannot make a central registry of gun owners.

The anti-rights people have to repeal that line, because Bobby's bill flat-out creates a central gun registry. Every gun owner must be registered to keep on possessing the guns they already own, and any transfer of any kind must be registered as well. The mark of the beast is upon us, to apply a metaphor.

 
Here's my detailed analysis of the bill, in plain English.
HR 45

The bill starts with a statement of purpose that says: " because the intrastate and interstate trafficking of firearms are so commingled, full regulation of interstate commerce requires the incidental regulation of intrastate commerce." Basically, this eliminates the Tenth Amendment and the Interstate Commerce Clause. The Constitution can't legally be amended by statute. Is that enough to seek Mr. Rush's removal from office? I won't bore you with the other "purposes" which are as bad or worse.

Only "qualifying firearms" are affected. That means any handgun, or any semi-auto firearm that has a removable magazine (what they call a " detachable ammunition feeding device").

After the bill becomes law (IF it becomes law), it's illegal for you to have or get those firearms, even if you already own them, without a special federal license. There are grace periods up to two years to register yourself once the law is passed.

Do you see how clever this is? You cold-dead-fingers guys can keep your guns if you like, refuse to register yourselves, and then you're subject to arrest on the spot. If you go anywhere with your guns -- to the range, a store, a gunsmith, a friend's house, hunting, competition -- and you're spotted, you go straight to jail. If you're already on a list (can anyone say "carry permit" or "hunting license"?) and you don't sign up, well, just connect those dots. Where does the cold-dead-fingers part come into play? I'll bet the ranges will start requiring you to show your papers before you can hit the line.

To get the license you must "submit to the Attorney General" (they chose that phrase right by golly): a passport-type photo, identifying info, any name you have ever used or ever been known by (I have nicknames, pen names, stage names, omitting any presumably violates the statute) a thumbprint, certification that any firearms will be "safely" stored and out of possession of people under 18, authorization to give up any mental health records, and a certificate that you passed a government-run test.

The test must include knowledge of: safe storage, safe handling, use of firearms at home, the risks of firearms at home, local state and federal legal requirements for firearms, reporting requirements for firearms, and ANY other subjects the AG decides are appropriate. You date and sign the submission, making it perjury if your info is inaccurate.

I'm skipping some details on who can accept the form, time periods for filing it and similar red tape on this 4,600 word bill. The AG "shall" issue the license if you pass the test and do everything else, and also "shall" charge you a tax for the privilege of getting your rights licensed, up to $25 at present. This gets you a tamper-resistant photo ID card with your official number, address, date of birth, signature and the expiration date of your "rights" (about five years, it's complicated). There's a renewal procedure (it's complicated) and no apparent limit on the renewal tax you will be charged (the AG gets power to control the details).

The license can be revoked for cause of course, and the AG "shall" make sure you give it up if it's revoked.

Once this thing is in place, it's illegal to transfer or receive any affected firearm (all handguns and any semi-auto with a magazine) without the license. Transfers can only be made to or from a licensed dealer, who has to jump through hoops and file papers, and has 14 days to get that done (a waiting period on the dealer's shoulders), to get government approvals and authorization numbers.

The dealer must send the feds the gun name and/or model number, maker, serial number, your license number, name, address and transfer date, which the feds must store in a "Federal Record of Sale System," a permanent national gun registry.

This needs to be said verbatim: "(c) Elimination of Prohibition on Establishment of System of Registration -- Section 926(a) of title 18, United States Code, is amended by striking the second sentence." That sentence says the feds can't register the firearms Americans own:

"No such rule or regulation prescribed after the date of the enactment of the Firearms Owners’ Protection Act [1986] may require that records required to be maintained under this chapter or any portion of the contents of such records, be recorded at or transferred to a facility owned, managed, or controlled by the United States or any State or any political subdivision thereof, nor that any system of registration of firearms, firearms owners, or firearms transactions or dispositions be established." The Bobby Rush bill says kiss that sentence and its extremely crucial protections goodbye.

There are a few small exceptions for an undefined "infrequent" firearm gift, bequest or intestate succession among parents, their kids and grandparents and grandkids, and also for lending a firearm " for any lawful purpose for not more than 30 days between persons who are personally known to each other." Sloppy language in this part of the bill bans the transfer of any firearm (not just "qualifying" firearms) between anyone without going through the hoops.

If you lose a handgun or magazine-fed semi-auto, or if one is stolen from you -- you've broken the law if you don't report that to the AG within 72 hours.

If you own such guns, change your address and don't notify the AG within 60 days -- you've committed a crime. In other words, they track you non-stop or you're subject to arrest. No victim, no harm, no foul, no evil, just government placing you in jail for failure to comply. Bobby Rush thinks this is good law, a legitimate use of government.

If you keep in your home a loaded firearm, or an unloaded firearm and ammo for it, and a person under 18 gets it and harms someone with it -- you've committed a crime. There are some flimsy exceptions (like you know or should reasonably know federal and state gun law for kids) and of course, all the "proper" authorities -- federal, state, local, military, elected, appointed, even employees of government on the job are exempted -- twice. Bobby Rush says OK for thee but not for me, tee hee.

Lengthy penalty sections include two-, five- and ten-year sentences and fines for paperwork violations, possession violations, transfer violations, child-access violations, safe-storage violations and of course, failure to pass the test if you still keep your guns.

The bill ends with sweeping powers for the Attorney General that could be interpreted to mean almost anything, so the details I've described might be little more than a smokescreen! For instance: "The Attorney General may issue an order prohibiting the sale or transfer of any firearm that the Attorney General finds has been transferred or distributed in violation of this Act, an amendment made by this Act, or a regulation issued under this Act."

There's plenty of that in here, plus endless inspection powers, injunctive powers and even, "shall issue regulations... as the Attorney General determines to be reasonably necessary to reduce or prevent deaths or injuries resulting from qualifying firearms..." Is the AG someone we can trust? Or is it someone with utter contempt for the right to keep and bear arms? If it's Eric Holder, Obama's nominee, we get a guy who told the Supreme Court that a total gun ban in your own home is just fine and doesn't violate the Bill of Rights.

Oh, and one final kick in the ribs. Federalism, the idea that states have powers the feds don't, could get in the way. So the bill makes it clear that "...this Act may not be construed to preempt any provision of the law of any State or political subdivision of that State... except to the extent that the provision of law is inconsistent with any provision of this Act or an amendment made by this Act..." I am not making this up. The hubris and audacity of this bill's author is monumental. My lawyer friends will tell me that legal mumbo-jumbo has become SOP, as the feds usurp any remaining crumbs of your state's legitimate powers.

Maybe you've noticed that virtually none of this addresses criminals or crimes. Innocent gun owners are the target. This is about controlling the public and its private constitutionally protected property. Criminals are guaranteed to ignore the entire plan, and in fact, criminals CANNOT apply, since they can't possess firearms in the first place. Even if criminals could apply, they're protected from incriminating themselves by the Fifth Amendment, so they never would apply.

The bill of course makes no mention of this. That's my job. And people tell me I'm paranoid, that gun bans are just a delusional fantasy of the wacko fringe. What does that say about Bobby Rush from Illinois, the perpetrator of this travesty. He and every co-sponsor he can find should be removed from office. Wherever he appears, people should rise and turn their backs on him as a gesture of disgrace.
" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

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Offline freedom7

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2009, 08:14:00 pm »
This is insane, lets hope this doesn't go far, no make that move at all. Ill be writing my rep asap.

wvoutlaw2002

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HR45 to be used to force all states to comply with the REAL ID Act
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2009, 10:16:42 pm »
http://darthchaosofrspw.wordpress.com/2009/01/25/hr45-to-be-used-to-force-all-states-to-comply-with-the-real-id-act/

111TH CONGRESS
1ST SESSION H. R. 45
To provide for the implementation of a system of licensing for purchasers
of certain firearms and for a record of sale system for those firearms,
and for other purposes.
AND:
To withhold certain highway funds if a State does not comply with certain requirements in issuing a driver's license or identification card, and for other purposes. (Introduced in House)

Do you know what this means? It means that states which refuse to go along with the REAL ID Act program will lose their federal funds. I KNEW they would eventually do that. The federal government wanted a nationwide minimum alcohol age of 21 and a nationwide blood-alcohol limit, so they passed some laws calling for that and threatened to withhold highway funds from states who failed to meet those provisions. During his term as West Virginia governor, Bob Wise refused to make .08 the BAC level and kept it at .10, and the state lost highway funds, so one of Joe Manchin's first acts as the new governor was to comply like a good little slave and lower the BAC level to 0.8 in total compliance with the feds.

If HR45 passes, every state will be forced to comply with the REAL ID Act or face losing federal highway funding. This means if your governor refuses to go along with the REAL ID Act, your state will lose federal highway funds. The state's road infrastructure will fall into disarray. And then the sheeple will elect a new governor who will readily comply with the REAL ID Act. Problem-Reaction-Solution.

wvoutlaw2002

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2009, 10:25:07 pm »
This is insane, lets hope this doesn't go far, no make that move at all. Ill be writing my rep asap.

Hell, I'm even contacting the ACLU about this. However, I doubt they'll take it seriously or find someway to f*** it up. As AJ says, the ACLU usually makes bad case law, making it seem the ACLU conspires with the government's anti-constitution agenda.

If you want to give it a shot, you can email them at realnightmare@aclu.org

Offline adissenter2

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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ! Molon Labe! Come and take them!

Offline Nailer

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2009, 06:19:17 am »
Ted Nugent Goes Off On Obama And Hillary! holds firearm in air saying suck on this Obama during a concert. LOL go TED.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=757_1187963465
I am a realist that is slightly conservative yet I have some republican demeanor that can turn democrat when I feel the urge to flip independant.
 
The truth shall set you free, if not a 45ACP round will do the trick.. HEHE

Offline Dig

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2009, 08:35:19 am »
Ted Nugent Goes Off On Obama And Hillary! holds firearm in air saying suck on this Obama during a concert. LOL go TED.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=757_1187963465

Ted Nugent is like Mike Savage.  Kill all the Arabs, blah blah blah.

Great for gun rights, but very confused when it comes to illegal occupations and genocide.
All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline stymo1

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2009, 08:49:57 am »
Ted Nugent Goes Off On Obama And Hillary! holds firearm in air saying suck on this Obama during a concert. LOL go TED.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=757_1187963465


I saw him last July in concert. He did it there too. He did it the year before too. I love this guys music, been a fan since the 70's. I like his stand on the 2nd, but he is real quick to support our being in "the sand box". He isn't with us all the way yet.
" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

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Offline Dig

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2009, 09:02:11 am »
The Hidden Weapon of "Gun Control" Advocates
http://www.jpfo.org/kirby/kirby-hidden-weapon.htm
By Kirby Ferris


Advocates of victim disarmament in today’s American politics owe their tactics and techniques to a man whose name is becoming more and more familiar: Saul Alinsky. Hillary Clinton actually sat at his feet. Barack Hussein Obama was spoon fed his teachings. Bill Clinton was Saul’s ideological son. And you can bet that freshman Senator Kirsten Gillibrand (Dem. NY) has been well versed in Alinskyism by her own mentor … Madam Hillary.

For decades gun owners have shaken their head in wonder as lie after lie from the gun grabbers results in more and more anti firearms ownership legislation. We can conservatively estimate that there are at least sixty five million gun owners in America today. That is an immense “interest group”. And yet, gun registration (and outright confiscation) schemes have never, in the entire history of our nation, loomed so ominously on the horizon.

How has this been done? The evolution of an America in the sixties, when kids took shotguns and rifles to school so they could go out hunting after classes, to a climate wherein today a kid draws a picture of a gun in class and gets hustled off to a shrink and likely suspended.

Lunacy reigns. But it didn’t happen accidentally. We’ve arrived at the endgame of a process, a process that Saul Alinsky, if he didn’t invent it, polished, packaged, and taught with unbelievable skill and cynicism.

Alinsky’s last book, published in 1971, a year before he died, is titled “Rules For Radicals”. These tactics are the “hidden weapon” of the more sophisticated “gun control” advocates.

Here are Alinsky’s thirteen basic rules. I’ve commented on each, and how they are used by the victim disarmament crowd. The old saw, “know thine enemy”, is ably served if you first understand what your enemy has been taught. The next time you see an anti gun politician or spokesperson spouting off about “responsible gun ownership”, or “keeping guns out of the hands of criminals”, or “the rights of hunters” understand that it is all deception based upon Alinsky’s tactics.


Rule 1: Power is not only what you have, but what the enemy thinks you have. If your organization is small, hide your numbers in the dark and raise a din that will make everyone think you have many more people than you do.

Josh Sugarmann, Sarah Brady, Charles Schumer, Dianne Feinstein, and their ilk, are superlative grandstanders. Like verbally vomiting vultures, they immediately appear in front of the cameras whenever a Stockton, California or Columbine, Colorado shooting spree takes place. They actually seem pre-prepared, almost as if they knew something was going to happen. In the horror of the aftermath, they shamelessly silence pro gun advocates with a flood of emotionalized, illogical, irrational, and manipulative buzz phrases and clichés that a rabidly anti gun media presents to the American public with somber aplomb. Some of them, like that morally perverse harridan from New Jersey, Carolyn McCarthy, actually rise to power by irrationally and hysterically pandering their personal losses to the crowd. The queen of passive aggressiveness, Sarah Brady, used the same tactic.

Rule 2: Never go outside the experience of your people. The result is confusion, fear, and retreat.

Sadly, the gun grabbers are better organized than most pro gun groups. Alinsky taught his students moral relativism. The end justifies the means. Look at the political killer instinct demonstrated by the leadership and active base of the “guns are bad” sub culture. The NRA operates on schmooze, backslapping, and insidious ground losing compromise. Handgun Control Inc. runs on secrecy, back stabbing, and unwavering betrayal of agreement. They are winning. We are losing.

Twenty years ago, JPFO (unaware of Alinsky’s teachings, it might be added) was founded with the realization that it was time someone countered the lies of the gun grabbers using some of the enemy’s tactics. Thankfully, JPFO doesn’t have to lie … ever. Watch JPFO’s documentary “Innocents Betrayed”,(trailer - - store purchase of full DVD) the graphic and unnerving chronicle of disarmed citizens and genocides in history.

There is a crucial difference between JPFO and our adversaries: We don’t need moral relativism because we don’t have to lie.

Rule 3: Whenever possible, go outside the experience of the enemy. Here you want to cause confusion, fear, and retreat.

This is easy for the Carolyn McCarthys, the Chuck Schumers, and the Dianne Feinsteins. They are liars. And gun owners are perhaps inculcated with a more fundamental, innate, honesty than any other easily definable social group. So when Feinstein or Schumer fights dirty, our side tends to cringe in disgust and confusion and disbelief. How many times have your heard a gun owner ask: “How can they lie like that?!” They lie because it is working!

Rule 4: Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules. “You can kill them with this, for they can no more obey their own rules than the Christian church can live up to Christianity.”

The alleged pacifism of the Jewish and Christian faiths, is used relentlessly against gun owners, many whom have deep religious beliefs and “old fashioned” moral constructs. Have you ever noticed that there is always a pastor, priest, or rabbi at an anti gun ownership rally? Always. Their message to gun owners is subtle and corrosive: “Thou shalt not kill. How can you even think of owning a gun?” The underlying subliminal context? Self defense is a sin. This is an insane lie.

And, by the way, the accurate translation of the Sixth Commandment is “Thou shalt not murder. It is not “Thou shalt not kill”. Think on that. (see: “2A Today for the U.S.A.”, JPFO’s crystal clear explanation of the Second Amendment.).


Rule 5: Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon. It’s hard to counter-attack ridicule, and it infuriates the opposition, which then reacts to your advantage.

Gun owners are “hillbillys”, “rednecks”, “macho”, “gun nuts”, “extremists”, “paranoid”, and, if the gun owner is male “in fear of their sexual inadequacy”. Come on, admit it, how many times have you wanted to kick smirking Chuckie Schumer. Bingo! He won. You just lost.


Rule 6: A good tactic is one your people enjoy. “If your people aren’t having a ball doing it, there is something very wrong with the tactic.”

At the time Alinsky wrote this, the late 1960s, he was teaching mostly college age youths (most specifically Hillary Clinton, who he dearly wanted as his protégé) the secrets of “activism”. The leadership of our devious opposition has a flair for drama and theater. The true believers in Handgun Control Inc., the day in and day out worker bees, are mostly younger folks. They are energetic idealists with bagels for brains.

Meanwhile the staunch pro gun ownership activist is usually forty or older. Sadly, in the realm of pure energy, they’ve got us beat. This is why it is so important to get youngsters into shooting and gun safety and the moral issues involved with that most basic human right, the right to self defense. JPFO’s “Grampa Jack” series of educational comic books is the perfect way to introduce youngsters to our cause.


Rule 7: A tactic that drags on for too long becomes a drag. Commitment may become ritualistic as people turn to other issues.

Here is where we can beat them. The pro gun ownership activist knows, with grim certainty, what waits at the end of gun confiscation. This somber understanding keeps our shoulders to the plow. Our foundational tactics are: Truth and history. It is that plain and that simple.

Rule 8: Keep the pressure on. Use different tactics and actions and use all events of the period for your purpose.

They never stop, do they? Every sordid event that involves a firearm draws them like flies. That is, unless the event is the morally righteous use of a firearm that leaves a violent criminal dead or crippled, and an innocent citizen alive, instead of dead. Then you don’t hear a peep from Chuckie or Sarah or Dianne, do you?


Rule 9: The threat is more terrifying than the thing itself.

Alinsky used to arrange civil obstructions that would be financially damaging to a city. He’d call for a “sit in” or demonstration and then shake down the city politicians and get them to fund his pet socialist projects. Watch for the gun grabbers to call in their pimp politicians like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton when the “Big Threat”, the race card, needs to be played in a situation.


Rule 10: "The major premise for tactics is the development of operations that will maintain a constant pressure upon the opposition. It is this unceasing pressure that results in the reactions from the opposition that are essential for the success of the campaign."

Our adversaries never directly confront an issue. They can’t! Their entire premise is a lie! They outflank, snipe from cover, and retreat. They’ll push a cliché until it wears thin and then change pace, like a skilled quarterback switching back and forth from ground game to passing game.


Rule 11: "If you push a negative hard and deep enough, it will break through into its counterside... every positive has its negative."

This encapsulates Alinsky’s foundational cynicism and amorality. The victim disarmament crowd deep down believes that lying to achieve their goals is okay.

“A lie told often enough becomes the truth.” Vladimir Lenin.


Rule 12: The price of a successful attack is a constructive alternative. Avoid being trapped by an opponent or an interviewer who says, “Okay, what would you do?”

Ladies and Gentlemen, this is where we can pin them between Heaven and Earth like wriggling worms. Because deep in the heart of every gun grabber is the dream of complete gun confiscation. They won’t admit it, but it is the truth. Many of these people are actually mentally ill. (see: Dr. Sarah Thomson’s article, “Raging Against Self Defense”. It is highly instructive.)

JPFO waves the lessons of history in the duplicitous faces of the victim disarmament advocates. JPFO is a solution oriented organization. It provides you with the intellectual ammunition to counter the lies of the gun grabbers. FACT: Repeatedly in the 20th Century, firearms registration preceded firearms confiscation preceded horrific mass murder by governments against their own people - see JPFO's Genocide Chart). Sarah Brady and Chuckie and the rest of them, because they are venal liars, we can never let it go there. Never.

Rule 13: Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, polarize it. Don’t try to attack abstract corporations or bureaucracies. Identify a responsible individual. Ignore attempts to shift or spread the blame.

This is why Michael Moore targeted Charlton Heston in “Bowling for Columbine”. Moore’s use of Alinsky’s tactics (specifically ridicule) is insidiously brilliant. We should learn from him.

Yes, study Saul Alinsky. Because therein we can learn how to spot the tactic, arm ourselves with the counter-tactic, and then ruthlessly and effectively retaliate and neutralize. It’s time to take the gloves off. It is brass knuckles time, friends. The future of our freedom, and the freedom of our children and grandchildren, depends on it. We must fight fire with fire. Nothing else will work.
All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline adissenter2

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2009, 10:11:30 am »
newer video from JPFO

"2AToday for The USA"
http://www.jpfo.org/filegen-a-m/2a-today-download.htm

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ! Molon Labe! Come and take them!

wvoutlaw2002

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2009, 03:08:42 pm »
Another aspect of HR45 is this: If you live in a state which refuses to participate in the REAL ID Act program, you are automatically disqualified from owning a firearm. This isn't just about gun confiscations. This is about bullying the states into submitting to the REAL ID Act and bullying the sheeple into BEGGING the states for REAL ID. With this aspect of the bill as well as federal highway funds will be withheld from states which refuses to participate in REAL ID, the sheeple will practically be begging for the national ID card.

Offline menace

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2009, 03:21:41 pm »
what part of the bill is the Real ID Act in?

Offline adissenter2

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2009, 10:07:49 pm »
break it down for us Darth Chaos
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ! Molon Labe! Come and take them!

wvoutlaw2002

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #19 on: February 02, 2009, 12:09:09 am »
I saw it somewhere on another forum. But now I can't seem to find it. I'll keep looking.

Offline stymo1

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #20 on: March 11, 2009, 08:07:33 am »
This is why we have had the recent shootings.....Illinois, Alabama.....this is what it is all about.... to make people think that banning or controlling who gets to keep a firearm and what kind will make them safer. It is only a further attempt to demonize firearms and destroy our second amendment rights, their ultimate goal being the disarmament of the American people.
" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

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Offline DireWolf

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #21 on: March 19, 2009, 08:17:13 am »
These are but two more draconian measures designed to subjugate and further enslave us. These and many other so called laws may indeed have the color of law but are wholly Unconstitutional in scope, practice and detail.

As explained in the SIXTEENTH AMERICAN JURISPRUDENCE SECON EDITION sec 256 we need not obey nor are any courts bound to enforce these non-laws.

 These and other measures are actually dual in purpose for they seek to bully the uniformed and are in fact an attempt to goad the knowledgeable into a phyical confrontation where they then can showcase their need for their twisted false reasoning on the national controlled media.
Freedom and Liberty, or slavery and death, your choice, choose wisely.

Offline trailhound

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H.R.45 Gun Bill
« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2009, 10:38:18 am »
 
 

     
     
    GET THIS OUT!

    Here it comes..."
     Date: Monday, April 13, 2009, 9:02 PM

        HR 45 Blair Holt Firearm Licensing & Record of Sales Act of 2009
        Please send this to everybody on your list... this is Obama guncontrol by secrecy. Contact your Representatives in your State and tell them HELL NO!

     
    Very Important for you to be aware of a new bill HR 45 introduced into the House.
    This is the Blair Holt Firearm Licensing & Record of Sale Act of 2009.
    We just learned yesterday about this on the Peter Boyles radio program.
    Even gun shop owners didn't know about this because it is flying under the radar.
    To find out about this - go to any government website and type in HR 45 or Google HR 45 Blair Holt Firearm Licensing & Record of Sales Act of 2009. You will get all the information.


    Basically this would make it illegal to own a firearm - any rifle with a clip or ANY pistol unless:

    ...It is registered
    .You are fingerprinted
    .You supply a current Driver's License
    .You supply your Social Security #
    .You will submit to a physical & mental evaluation at any time of their choosing
    . Each update - change or ownership through private or public sale must be reported and costs $25
    - Failure to do so you automatically lose the right to own a firearm and are subject up to a year in jail.

    .There is a child provision clause on page 16 section 305 stating a child-access provision. Gun must be locked and inaccessible to any child under 18.

    The Government would have the right to come and inspect that you are storing your gun safely away from accessibility to children and fine is punishable for up to 5 yrs. in prison.

    If you think this is a joke - go to the website and take your pick of many options to read this..
    http://www.opencong ress.org/ bill/111- h45/text

    It is long and lengthy. But, more and more people are becoming aware of this. Pass the word along.
    FAILURE TO DO SO AT YOUR PERIL!

    Any hunters in your family - pass this along.

    Peter Boyles is on this and having guests. Listen to him on KHOW 630 a.m. in the morning.

    He suggests the best way to fight this is to tell all your friends about it and "spring into action".
    Also he suggests we all join a pro-gun group like the Colorado Rifle Association, hunting associations, gun clubs and especially the GOA.

    This is just a "termite" approach to complete confiscation of guns and disarming of our society to the point we have no defense - chip away a little here and there until the goal is accomplished before anyone realizes it.
     


    This is one to act on whether you own a gun or not.
     
    The Second Amendment... . America's original homeland security
     
     

"Do not let your hatred of a people incite you to aggression." Qur'an 5:2
At the heart of that Western freedom and democracy is the belief that the individual man, the child of God, is the touchstone of value..." -RFK

Offline stymo1

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Re: H.R.45 Gun Bill
« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2009, 10:52:04 am »
" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q

Offline trailhound

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Re: H.R.45 Gun Bill
« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2009, 10:55:04 am »
dammit i searched for it! merge or delete mods, i knew somebody probably already made a post but couldnt find it. Thanks stymo

"Do not let your hatred of a people incite you to aggression." Qur'an 5:2
At the heart of that Western freedom and democracy is the belief that the individual man, the child of God, is the touchstone of value..." -RFK

Offline stymo1

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Re: H.R.45 Gun Bill
« Reply #25 on: April 24, 2009, 11:05:23 am »
^^ Thank you for bringing it up again, lest we forget.  ;)
" It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q

Offline trailhound

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #26 on: April 24, 2009, 11:31:24 am »
BUMP

"Do not let your hatred of a people incite you to aggression." Qur'an 5:2
At the heart of that Western freedom and democracy is the belief that the individual man, the child of God, is the touchstone of value..." -RFK

Offline Anti Federalist

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Re: H.R.45 Gun Bill
« Reply #27 on: April 24, 2009, 02:13:57 pm »
dammit i searched for it! merge or delete mods, i knew somebody probably already made a post but couldnt find it. Thanks stymo

That's happened a couple of times to me as well.

I'm making a conscious effort not to make the mods job's more difficult but a couple of threads I started came up blank on search, but were already covered.

Offline KoWBoY

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #28 on: April 25, 2009, 12:01:14 am »
Placement is Key.
Violence Begets Compliance.
Ignorance is Temporary. Stupid is Forever.
I HUNT! Because the voices in my head tell me to.
http://waronyou.com/forums/index.php

PullMyFinger

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #29 on: October 20, 2009, 01:34:23 pm »
Friend of mine just got an e-mail about this today and it needs to be bumped,imo.Even if you don't own a fire arm many things in these bills could be used to apple to YOU as well(mental health screenings).

Offline DireWolf

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Re: HR 45 and HR1022 are bad for our FREEDOMS
« Reply #30 on: October 29, 2009, 12:19:52 pm »
Is just me or did anyone else notice that the bills happen to coincide with a popular caliber of pistol and a very popular make of .22Lr?
Freedom and Liberty, or slavery and death, your choice, choose wisely.