Author Topic: Roth Steyer Antique Destroyed in Cleveland "buy back" (Ohio)  (Read 2390 times)

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Offline windyacres

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Roth Steyer Antique Destroyed in Cleveland "buy back" (Ohio)
« on: December 19, 2016, 04:12:05 am »
  Roth Steyer Antique Destroyed in Cleveland "buy back"


 Gun Watch
 13 December, 2016
 Dean Weingarten






Roth Steyr pistols are highly desired by collectors, with prices running up to $2,000.

It is a curio/relic listed by the ATF, so it does not have to run through the normal FFL license.  It has many advanced features for 1907, reminiscent of the Glock pistol today. Both were designed in Austria. Both are striker fired, instead of using a hammer.  Both have no traditional safety, instead opting for a partial or half/cocked striker system.  Both the Glock and the Roth Steyr partially cock the striker, with the trigger then pulled to finish cocking and firing the pistol. The pistol shown belonged in the 11th Landwehr Infantry Regiment, as the 73rd one issued, as shown by grip inset nut/medallion.

The Roth Steyr fires the obsolete 8X18.5 M7 Roth cartridge. The cartridge is occasionally manufactured in Europe  by Fiocchi, in limited runs. The ballistics are a 113 grain full metal jacketed bullet at about 1070 feet per second. The stripper clips are hard to come by.  One seeker was willing to pay $75 for one.  It is unknown if he found one or not.





The stripper clips hold 10 rounds, making the pistol, in 1907, a direct competitor with the 1896 Mauser, which was also fed with 10 round stripper clips. All the pistols were manufactured by the Austro-Hungarian government in Hungary or Austria. The Roth Steyr was the first semi-auto to be adopted by a major army anywhere.

It is sad that no one at the Cleveland gun "buy back" recognized the historic nature of this antique.  Given the difficulty of obtaining ammunition, it seems a very unlikely crime gun.  I would love to have one in my collection.

The pistol was used extensively in WWI. The Austrians lost the war. Most wartime exploits with the Roth Steyr would not be recorded in English. About 90,000 were used during the war. I have not come across any accounts similar to Winston Churchill's adventures with his trust Mauser. The accounts are probably there, maybe in an old wartime diary in German, or Hungarian. Some of the pistols were used in WWII.

Gems like the Roth Steyr are routinely found at gun "buy backs". They are not found in quantity, but they are found. All the more reason for private buyers to monitor these gun turn ins, and to rescue the valuable items from the smelter.

Perhaps the better tactic is to have the state forbid the waste of destroying valuable resources for political propaganda. Arizona  and in some other states require the guns to be sold through normal commercial channels. The funds resulting from the sale ere used to reduce the tax burden.

©2016 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice is included.

Link to Gun Watch -

http://gunwatch.blogspot.com/2016/12/oh-roth-steyer-antique-destroyed-in.html



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Offline windyacres

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Re: Roth Steyer Antique Destroyed in Cleveland "buy back" (Ohio)
« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2016, 04:17:06 am »
Private Buyers Compete with Police for Choice Guns at Cleveland "buyback" 


 Gun Watch
 13 December, 2016
 Dean Weingarten



Cleveland is going against the trend on gun "buy backs". They are having one every year, whether they do any good or not. In 2016, they had one on the 4th of December. Very little notice was given. At least one Second Amendment support group, Ohioans for Concealed Carry, predicted a low turn out for the event. From cleveland.com:

    Jeff Garvas, founder of the group, said the short notice for the Sunday event may not motivate people to exchange their weapons for gift card incentives.

    The Ohioans for Concealed Carry have protested the event in years past, but Garvas said there are no plans to hold an organized protest this year. Garvas said that he guarantees gun-rights advocates and collectors will be there trying to buy firearms before citizens exchange them.

Garvas was right.  Last year, in 2015, the "buy back" gun turn in event collected about 200 guns.  It is unknown how many were purchased by private buyers. In 2015, this Winchester Model 94 lever gun was turned in. It caught my eye because it has a nice scope with a side mount on the right side. Nearly all sidemounts for Model 94s are on the left side. This was obviously done by a sinister (left handed) individual who knew what he wanted.  Now it has been melted down.  I have never seen a story of street crime with a scoped Model 94.

In 2014, the turn in organizers got 270 guns. At the same event, private buyers got 100 of the best brought in.

This year, 2016, there were private buyers working at saving the best guns, even though turnout was down.  Police collected 168 guns. From wksu.org:

    As in years past, several private buyers lined up nearby with signs reading “Cash 4 Guns,” looking for interesting or historical pieces. Dan Smith from Streetsboro was there, and says gun buybacks should be operated a little differently so rare pieces are not destroyed.

    "We operate police auctions all the time; they sell cars and everything else. There's no reason they shouldn't be able to dispose of firearms at an auction at fair market value and make some money for the city and get these guns to people who are actually going to take care of them and be responsible with them."

It is unknown how many guns the private buyers saved from being melted down.

Maybe next year the police will give more notice.  It seems to work out better for both the private buyers and the police.

Real cooperation would be to encourage private buyers to "work the line". It takes more guns "off the streets" and stretches the resources for police to take guns  that no one else is willing to pay the $100 or $200 value of the gift card for.

©2016 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice is included.

Link to Gun Watch -

http://gunwatch.blogspot.com/2016/12/private-buyers-compete-with-police-for.html

Be Prepared