Author Topic: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated  (Read 9862 times)

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Offline φυδγε

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Justice Stevens reads police interrogation dissent aloud from the bench

A decision by the Supreme Court on Tuesday easing rules on police interrogations led the oldest member on the bench to read his dissent aloud in front of the court, the first time that's happened this term.

"The Supreme Court on Tuesday made it easier for the police and prosecutors to question suspects, lifting some restrictions on when defendants can be interrogated without their lawyers present," David Stout reports for the New York Times.

The Times adds,

    In a 5-to-4 ruling, the court overturned its 1986 opinion in a Michigan case, which forbade the police from interrogating a defendant once he invoked his right to counsel at an arraignment or a similar proceeding.

    That 1986 ruling has not only proved “unworkable,” Justice Antonin Scalia wrote for the majority, but its “marginal benefits are dwarfed by its substantial costs” in that some guilty defendants go free. Justice Scalia was joined by Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. and Justices Anthony M. Kennedy, Clarence Thomas and Samuel A. Alito Jr.

However, the paper notes, "In an angry dissent, Justice John Paul Stevens, who wrote the 1986 decision, said that contrary to the majority’s assertion, that decision protected 'a fundamental right that the court now dishonors.'”

The Associated Press reports, "The Michigan v. Jackson opinion was written by Justice John Paul Stevens, the only current justice who was on the court at the time. He and Justices David Souter, Stephen Breyer and Ruth Bader Ginsburg dissented from the ruling, and in an unusual move Stevens read his dissent aloud from the bench. It was the first time this term a justice had read a dissent aloud."

Stevens said that the "police interrogation in this case clearly violated petitioner's Sixth Amendment right to counsel," and that overruling the 1986 Michigan v. Jackson ruling "can only diminish the public's confidence in the reliability and fairness of our system of justice."

"The Obama administration had asked the court to overturn Michigan v. Jackson, disappointing civil rights and civil liberties groups that expected President Barack Obama to reverse the policies of his Republican predecessor, George W. Bush," the AP notes.   >:(

At The National Law Journal, Marcia Coyle observed, "The timing and contrast were striking: As President Barack Obama introduced Judge Sonia Sotomayor to the nation as his U.S. Supreme Court nominee, Justice Antonin Scalia, sitting on the high court bench, read parts of a 5-4 decision overruling a 23-year-old precedent on the right to counsel."

"It was business as usual for the justices Tuesday but also a reminder of the importance of one vote on a Court still closely divided in key areas of the law," Coyle noted.

http://rawstory.com/blog/2009/05/justice-stevens-reads-police-interrogation-dissent-aloud-from-the-bench/

Amendment V

No person shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law.

Amendment VI

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.

Amendment IX

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.


original story - NYT
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/27/us/27scotus.html?_r=1&ref=politics

Washington Post
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/26/AR2009052601097.html?hpid=moreheadlines

The National Law Journal
http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1202430979440&As_Nominee_Is_Announced_High_Court_Issues_Police_Interrogation_Ruling_Two_Others

Offline φυδγε

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*mayday*mayday*Americans no longer have the right to an attorney!
« Reply #1 on: May 27, 2009, 06:40:38 pm »
Indeed, Americans no longer have the right to counsel when they are picked up and interrogated by the police.

Offline Freeski

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #2 on: May 27, 2009, 07:08:59 pm »
Maybe we have to wait for the masses to get bit, personally, by the-powers-that-be, before we'll have any sort of mass awakening? Every time they up the ante, we get closer to our critical mass.
"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.

Offline φυδγε

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NYT hid this story in the back of the paper.  This ruling leaves the door open for police abuses of detainees during the initial interrogation.  Whereas before the ruling a police interrogation stopped once the detainee invoked their right to have a counsel present, now the police can keep you indefinitely, I guess, until they get their confession.

Offline Freeski

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NYT hid this story in the back of the paper.  This ruling leaves the door open for police abuses of detainees during the initial interrogation.  Whereas before the ruling a police interrogation stopped once the detainee invoked their right to have a counsel present, now the police can keep you indefinitely, I guess, until they get their confession.


It's like the military commissions act.
"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.

Offline φυδγε

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Police no longer recognize your right to counsel before interrogations
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2009, 10:52:39 pm »
Am I crazy, or does this story spell out bad news?

Police have their way of making a suspect talk....so good luck trying to remain silent without the Supreme Court backing your decision.


It's like the military commissions act.

I agree.

Offline kevlar442

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #6 on: May 27, 2009, 11:07:12 pm »
This decision along with another recent one: http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=80179.0
 
Helps tyranny along nicely.  It's happening fast people.
"So make your move and plead the fifth cuz you can't plead the first"  -Rage Against the Machine

Offline φυδγε

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2009, 02:07:25 am »
Bumpity Bumpo.....

Hello?  Americans no longer have the right to counsel before police interrogation.

Any other comments about our new freedom?

Mike Philbin

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2009, 02:11:12 am »
I hope you guys are spreading this far and wide, to all your networks, all your mailing lists, all your contacts, too.

:)

Offline φυδγε

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #9 on: May 28, 2009, 01:20:43 pm »
Bump.  This is a sad sad verdict by the Supreme Court.

Offline KI4BNC

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #10 on: May 28, 2009, 01:28:41 pm »
wow.they killed 2 amendments birds with one stone! >:(
those that would give up a little liberty to obtain a little security,deserve neither and will lose both.

Offline lordssyndicate

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #11 on: May 28, 2009, 01:39:09 pm »
So, we now no longer oficially have a 6th amendment.

How the f**k does the supreme court have the right to abolish the 6th amendment?

IT DOESN'T ! THIS  DECISION IS TREASON ANY ONE WHO VOTED FOR IT NEEDS TO BE ARRESTED TRIED AND EXECUTED!
"Biotechnology it's not so bad. It's just like all technologies it's in the wrong HANDS!"- Sepultura

Offline Freeski

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #12 on: May 28, 2009, 01:50:24 pm »
Bumpity Bumpo.....

Hello?  Americans no longer have the right to counsel before police interrogation.

Any other comments about our new freedom?

Maybe we're becoming accustomed to it. So sad and scary.
"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.

Offline φυδγε

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #13 on: May 28, 2009, 02:10:40 pm »
Yes, this topic is HUGE - like a few amendments are negated with Obama and the Supremes.

mayday*mayday*mayday

wvoutlaw2002

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It's like the military commissions act.

It's like the Military Commissions Act? It IS the Military Commissiona Act. People like AJ warned that the Military Commissions Act would be used against the citizens.

GakunGak

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #15 on: May 28, 2009, 02:24:40 pm »
Good bye to the: "I'd like to speak to my lawyer"... :'(

Offline marra

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2009, 02:05:44 pm »
White is right
If we simply got together and used our heads, we could have whatever our hearts desired

Offline Freeski

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It's like the Military Commissions Act? It IS the Military Commissiona Act. People like AJ warned that the Military Commissions Act would be used against the citizens.

Absolutely. And not nearly enough people are paying attention.
"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.

Offline Geolibertarian

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2009, 11:07:09 am »
What disgusts me even more than this latest treasonous assault on the Bill of Rights is the fact that there are literally tens of millions of brainwashed sheeple in this country who still cling to the fairy-tale that Muslim extremists hate us for our "freedoms."  ::)

--------------------------------

http://www.prisonplanet.com/police-state-study-ranks-us-as-6th-worst-in-the-world.html

Police State Study Ranks U.S. As 6th Worst In The World

UK in 5th, behind only the most ardent dictatorships

Steve Watson
Infowars.net
Tuesday, May 12, 2009


A study designed to rank countries in terms of how aggressively they monitor their populations electronically, has placed the US as 6th and the UK as 5th on a global index.

The two countries lag behind only China, North Korea, Belarus and Russia in terms of governmental surveillance.

The report, titled The Electronic Police State, (PDF link) was compiled from information available from different organizations such as the Electronic Privacy Information Center, Reporters Without Borders, Freedom House, the Ludwig von Mises Institute and The Heritage Foundation.

52 countries were rated on 17 criteria with regard to how far down the line they are toward a total electronic police state.

[Continued...]

--------------------------------
"Abolish all taxation save that upon land values." -- Henry George

"If our nation can issue a dollar bond, it can issue a dollar bill." -- Thomas Edison

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Offline Mr.C

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2009, 11:28:46 am »
This is what our country men fought died and shed blood for ?

im disgusted
The rich. You know why they're so odd. Because they can afford to be
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I've been too many places. I'm like the bad penny.
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This Country Needs An Enema !

wvoutlaw2002

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2009, 11:37:00 am »
What disgusts me even more than this latest treasonous assault on the Bill of Rights is the fact that there are literally tens of millions of brainwashed sheeple in this country who still cling to the fairy-tale that Muslim extremists hate us for our "freedoms."  ::)

Exactly. The sheeple either don't realize that their government is the real terrorists, or they know and don't give a rat's ass.

Offline Fuzzyone

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #21 on: June 01, 2009, 11:43:13 am »
Ahhh  Freedom....  It was nice while it lasted.

Offline φυδγε

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #22 on: June 01, 2009, 11:48:19 am »
I think a few more people will wake up when they are sitting in the interrogation room for a dime bag and instead of being given counsel, they'll be given the royal gitmo treatment for the sake of some drug war.

Offline Overcast

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Re: 2009 RIP American Civil Liberties "It was a novel idea"
« Reply #23 on: June 03, 2009, 06:11:21 pm »
What disgusts me even more than this latest treasonous assault on the Bill of Rights is the fact that there are literally tens of millions of brainwashed sheeple in this country who still cling to the fairy-tale that Muslim extremists hate us for our "freedoms."  ::)


Yeah, and in reality it's our own "leaders" (loosely) that have problems with our Freedoms.
And dying in your beds, many years from now, would you be willin' to trade ALL the days, from this day to that, for one chance, just one chance, to come back here and tell our enemies that they may take our lives, but they'll never take... OUR FREEDOM!

Offline Elvis

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #24 on: June 03, 2009, 07:18:17 pm »
Just wanted to stop by to offer my condolences. Sorry for your loss. He will be dearly missed. He may be gone but will live on in our hearts, in our memories. He's in a better place now.

(sob) Oh, Scotus ... Scotus ...
"A great civilization is not conquered from without until it has destroyed itself from within." - Will Durant


Offline Voskhod3

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #26 on: June 04, 2009, 03:00:36 pm »
Change you can believe in.

I believe we're screwed.

Bye bye liberty unless the people rise up.

luckee1

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #27 on: June 04, 2009, 03:44:38 pm »
I have sent to all my people.  They will send to theirs.  I know there is some other groups going to scream bloody murder about this one.

Offline rawiron1

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2009, 08:58:33 am »
Here are the legal terms for ya'll...

5th gives you the right to council during adversarial proceedings.

6th gives you the right to council during custodial interrogations.

Jason
Jason the Fed

Offline DireWolf

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2009, 09:31:54 am »
Seeing as they are dismantling the Law of the Land, the Constitution, will it now be laws being made on demand to fit a paticular situation? If no true protection is afforded us then to submit to the ruling authorities is tantamount to suicide.

Contaplating what is taking place it would seem that rather than submit to the unknown one is faced with either running or fighting.
Using the Military Commissions Act against us leaves little room for negotiating.
Freedom and Liberty, or slavery and death, your choice, choose wisely.

Offline Voskhod3

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #30 on: June 05, 2009, 09:45:02 am »
Obama is all in favor of "Prolonged Detention".

No counsel and imprisonment indefinitely without trial because for "future crimes".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uuWVHT1WUY

America is screwed.

Offline Geolibertarian

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #31 on: June 05, 2009, 10:22:15 am »
Quote
Obama is all in favor of "Prolonged Detention".

No counsel and imprisonment indefinitely without trial because for "future crimes".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uuWVHT1WUY

Say it with me, Obama cultists: "Chaaaange!"  ::)
"Abolish all taxation save that upon land values." -- Henry George

"If our nation can issue a dollar bond, it can issue a dollar bill." -- Thomas Edison

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http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=203330.0

Offline Elvis

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #32 on: June 05, 2009, 10:43:36 am »
Say it with me, Obama cultists: "Chaaaange!"  ::)
Heard Alan Watt talking about all these new laws they have been busy writing up for the past eight years. What was legal yesterday they will come and cart you off to jail for tomorrow. "Ignorance of the law we wrote yesterday is no excuse - what do you need a lawyer for?"

Kind of like taxes - everyone's guilty! weeeeeeeeeee!!!
"A great civilization is not conquered from without until it has destroyed itself from within." - Will Durant

shirteesdotnet

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #33 on: June 09, 2009, 10:25:37 pm »
Is it time to usurp this government yet?

Offline Georgiacopguy

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #34 on: June 09, 2009, 10:33:38 pm »
Yes, I'd like to make a reservation for a revolution...Table for 600 million.
The resistance starts here. Unfortunately, the entire thing is moving beyond the intellectual infowar. I vow I will not make an overt rush at violent authority, until authority makes it's violent rush at me and you. I will not falter, I will not die in this course. For that is how they win.

KarnEvil9

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #35 on: June 15, 2009, 01:12:44 pm »
Bookmark Bump/important topic

Offline White Rose Sophie

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #36 on: June 28, 2009, 10:15:46 am »
Bookmark Bump/important topic

Yes, indeed.  I guess there is no such thing as 'due process of law' anymore. 

UNBELIEVABLE.  They are really stepping it up. ...I guess too many people are waking up.

 >:(

Offline bokoo143

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Re: SCOTUS - No right to have an attorney present when interrogated
« Reply #37 on: June 28, 2009, 12:45:46 pm »
a million or so needed for a protest/march on Washington for July 4th! >:(