HR1388 (Expanding National Service)-Collateral for the Federal Reserve Debt

[Dig]

sane, this isn't about whether congress is a bunch of whores or not. it's about people on this site or listening to the show not knowing whether the bill has passed the senate or not. it's about patriots ready to lay down their life and not knowing what a cloture vote is before today. i'm just saying a little more education and a little less blowhard would be beneficial.

well please contribute rather than criticizing as others do.

just please educate us on what this means instead of calling us stupid for not knowing.

and just an fyi...I am a jackhammer chipping away at the matrix wherever I see it.  i get shit wrong, often, please double check anything I post (others are more thorough).  so please do not get offended by my rough edges (I do hold the same opinion though that this is a dog and pony show, but i do not want to cut off your self expression when it comes to educating us about the protocol for the play we are watching).

[sociostudent]

sane, i didn't say alex was waaay off, just... off. he used the "fact" the bill had "passed" to jump to all other kinds of conclusions, such as that congress was a bunch of whores. that airtime might have been used to explain the committee conference process and how everyone should get the word out so the secret tactic gets exposed. i don't deny the tyranny, but frankly, for all his use of "documentation," alex is nowhere near the journalistic standards of the professionals. but at least he'll try to cover the stories that matter. hey, i'm a listener. i just get bored of the hyperbole and would like to hear something resembling the reality on the ground.

Alex isn't the one in the wrong, here, the NYT is!
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/03/23/national-service-corps-bill-clears-senate-hurdle/

[Lilly Bighorn]

just please educate us on what this means instead of calling us stupid for not knowing.

if the senate version removed the section on "duties" that included compulsory service, then the bill has to go to a conference committee, where just about anything can be snuck in without anyone ever discovering who did it. that looks like the route this is going to take. i think a clear understanding of how a bill becomes a law would be a real asset to alex's efforts.

sociostudent: the NYT doesn't say the bill passed, it says the senate "voted 74 to 14 on a procedural move." i'm not trying to call people stupid, and i certainly make mistakes, too, i just think a firm understanding of the legislative process and other realities of government have to be a part of the freedom movement or else it's just an inarticulate rabble.

[Dig]

sociostudent: the NYT doesn't say the bill passed, it says the senate "voted 74 to 14 on a procedural move." i'm not trying to call people stupid, and i certainly make mistakes, too, i just think a firm understanding of the legislative process and other realities of government have to be a part of the freedom movement or else it's just an inarticulate rabble.

so what is the protocol

what is the process

how does it occur

what needs to happen

what are the procedures

how does it get done

what are the next steps

what should people be aware of

how can you help us learn what to look for

etc

[independentWV]

Lilly are you the one underestimating this was an important vote? This vote determined whether bill moved forward in Senate. Most patriots here seemed to understand and worked diligently to post pertinent information including various bills with similar language. It would seem reasonable rather than pointing to inarticulate rabble if someone seems not to understand be a patriot and explain rather than judge. Each of us has different backgrounds and gifts we all are not legislative experts however we can learn and help one another.

[Lilly Bighorn]

puh-leeze!

i didn't say i was the insider expert, but i know what a cloture vote is. i also know that when the house and senate pass versions of a bill that are different (assuming the bill passes the senate), then it goes to conference committee, where a select few members of each body meet in secret to negotiate the final language of the bill. if the negotiations succeed and an agreement is reached, it goes back to both chambers for a vote and then on to the president. apparently, any senator can object to any additional language inserted, so it would be important to let your senator to know you would object to a reinsertion of the mandatory service study language. it was in conference committee that the controversial language allowing the aig bonuses was put in. and, as i'm sure you know, chris dodd blames that on faceless, nameless bureaucrats of the treasury dept, and ultimately geithner took responsibility for it. but this is a rare occurrence, and usually the conference committees come and go in complete anonymity as far as the public is concerned.

agentblue makes some good points in this thread. if he's right, this bill might end up not being any more than a link in a bigger circuit, with the "switch" being thrown in some other piece of legislation we haven't studied yet.

i think those are two good areas to look at.

[tritonman]

I also understood this to be a study on manditory service and not the actual bill..  I also believe it is th full intention of our handlers to foist this legislation upon us at a future date once they can get the masses to argue about it long enough to lay down for the (least damaging) legislation.

[Lilly Bighorn]

Lilly are you the one underestimating this was an important vote? This vote determined whether bill moved forward in Senate. Most patriots here seemed to understand and worked diligently to post pertinent information including various bills with similar language. It would seem reasonable rather than pointing to inarticulate rabble if someone seems not to understand be a patriot and explain rather than judge. Each of us has different backgrounds and gifts we all are not legislative experts however we can learn and help one another.

no, i'm not underestimating the vote, but i'm not popping off on the air about how it's passed and having a fit either. i'm not really blaming alex though, because he was in the middle of a show and just got bad information. i'm just lamenting that more meaningful action can't take place when something like this happens. burlguy talks about heading this off now. it seems this is all being kept just beyond the light of day so it doesn't spark too much public debate. the best thing that could happen is if this does become an issue for national debate. because tritonman is right, this was never about instituting mandatory service, it was about studying it. and come on, if they want to study it, they don't need a law from congress to do that.

[sociostudent]

no, i'm not underestimating the vote, but i'm not popping off on the air about how it's passed and having a fit either. i'm not really blaming alex though, because he was in the middle of a show and just got bad information.

I know I'm probably to blame for that bad info, sorry guys (especially Alex)

[911aware]

so they voted 74 to whatever for colture, which says "wrap it up"

[xTruthSeekerx]

Shoot everyone has been saying it for the last 3 days.... I had a sitdown with truthseeker and we both went over the info and came to the conclusion that this may not be the end but they are wanting the draft back asap. They need 400,000 troops to go to Afghanistan, get ready for servitude.

get on instant messenger lul bermas and alex are going opver it now

[sociostudent]

I'm listening now.

[911aware]

hey, we were half right.  a vote for this procedure means they intend on passing this i believe.. i got the spelling wrong the first time around, the procedure is Cloture.. sorry for the mistype.  this will end any attempt at filibusters, and therefore, will ensure passage of the bill.

[Elvis]

what is the process

"the Senate tonight voted 74 to 14 on a procedural move that essentially guarantees a major expansion of a national service corps,"
The "procedural move" was a vote for cloture, to close discussion on the bill.
http://www.answers.com/topic/cloture

Actual text:

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-1388

Ammendment 11:

"Amendment numbered 10 printed in House Report 111-39 to create a National Service Reserve Corps and requires an annual service requirement of at least 10 hours and/or annual training. A member of the National Service Reserve Corps is one who has completed a term of national service, fulfilled training, and will respond to national disasters and other emergencies. These individuals will be listed in a national database for the ease of immediate deployment in case of emergency."

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h111-1388&tab=amendments

[sociostudent]

To get the general idea of what's about to happen, please watch this about 1 minute in:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4XFbLtaCUg&feature=related]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4XFbLtaCUg&feature=related[/s]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zeNja6SuXc&feature=PlayList&p=CD0E898BA07E88E5&index=11

This one's even better...I especially like what Mao's kids did to their own parents and teachers. 

[Neco]

Here is an Above Top Secret article about it.

HR 1388 passed senate

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread448839/pg1

[OldSchool]

So 5 out of the 7 in Colorado voted for. Makes me ashamed to live in Colorado.

All 3 of our reps in WV voted yes. Sad...........sad........

[jofortruth]

National Service A Strategic Necessity - US Army War College:
http://www.strategicstudiesinstitute.army.mil/pdffiles/ksil379.pdf

[independentWV]

All 3 of our reps in WV voted yes. Sad...........sad........

I was dismayed by Rahall, Rockefeller and Byrd votes as well. Wish our citizens would wake up and get rid of these satanists

[Neco]

National Service A Strategic Necessity - US Army War College:
http://www.strategicstudiesinstitute.army.mil/pdffiles/ksil379.pdf

I've never seen that before.  Wow. 

[OldSchool]

I was dismayed by Rahall, Rockefeller and Byrd votes as well. Wish our citizens would wake up and get rid of these satanists

I would have bet my paycheck (whatever that is...) that Rockefeller would vote yes on it. He's a socialist, and a powermonger.

[independentWV]

WHY PASSED HERE?

http://www.stoptheliberalsnow.com/archives/902


http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h1388/show

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2210006/posts

Looked at one of the links House of Representative vote. Senate passed cloture vote, passage vote will be soon with no or very limited discussion.

[StemCell]

I searced the bill for the key words "Compulsory" and "Mandatory" and came up with nothing. Can someone please point out the part that says this in the text of the bill?

Thanks!

[menace]

Is this the change you really voted for?

President Obama has only been in office for two months. Now we have HR 1388. The Bill was sponsored by Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY) with 37 others. The Bill was introduced to the floor of the House of Representatives where both Republicans and Democrats voted 321-105 in favor. Next it goes to the Senate for a vote and then on to President Obama.

This bill’s title is called “Generations Invigorating Volunteerism and Education” (GIVE). It forms what some are calling “Obama’s Youth Brigade.” Obama’s plan is require anyone receiving school loans and others to serve at least three months as part of the brigade. His goal is one million youth! This has serious Nazi Germany overtones to it.

The Bill would forbid any student in the brigade to participate in “engaging in religious instruction, conducting worship services, providing instruction as part of a program that includes mandatory religious instruction or worship, constructing or operating facilities devoted to religious instruction or worship, maintaining facilities primarily or inherently devoted to religious instruction or worship, or engaging in any form of religious proselytization.” That means no church attendance or witnessing.

Again, is this what America voted for?

Here is part of the HR1388 Bill’s wording:

SEC. 1304. PROHIBITED ACTIVITIES AND INELIGIBLE ORGANIZATIONS.

Section 125 (42 U.S.C. 12575) is amended to read as follows:

SEC. 125. PROHIBITED ACTIVITIES AND INELIGIBLE ORGANIZATIONS.

(a) Prohibited Activities- A participant in an approved national service position under this subtitle may not engage in the following activities:

(1) Attempting to influence legislation.

(2) Organizing or engaging in protests, petitions, boycotts, or strikes.
…

(7) Engaging in religious instruction, conducting worship services, providing instruction as part of a program that includes mandatory religious instruction or worship, constructing or operating facilities devoted to religious instruction or worship, maintaining facilities primarily or inherently devoted to religious instruction or worship, or engaging in any form of religious proselytization.

http://www.thevoicemagazine.com/politics/512-obama-youth-brigade-church-attendance-forbidden.html

[Jackson Holly]

My understanding is that the cloture vote ended discussion/filibuster ... it goes to a select committee to produce new wording (look out!) acceptable to both House and Senate, that is to 'merge' with the House version. Then, a final vote (probably a quickie voice vote) to rubber stamp it for the Pres.

There will no doubt be other, related bills pushed through right away to set up the forced service apparatus. This thing was on the back burner, ready to sign, seal and deliver at the most opportunistic moment for their agenda.

National Service A Strategic Necessity - US Army War College:
http://www.strategicstudiesinstitute.army.mil/pdffiles/ksil379.pdf

Here's the CONCLUSION from this PDF paper from 2006:

It is essential that military and government leaders take an in-depth look at and perform a
critical analysis of the strategic impact of supporting the AVF concept as it relates to creating a
negative culture gap between the military and civilian society.  This culture gap may have a
significant impact on the nation’s will to meet future manpower requirements for the military.
Several examples of the Nation’s will were identified in this paper, including support from local
community leaders, political leaders and veteran organizations.  A new mandatory military
service policy, one without deferments, should be required for all eligible young Americans.
Military and political leaders must transform this strategic conceptual policy into a practical and
concrete program to ensure that Americans, from all levels of society, are required to serve in
their nations’ military.  Federal aide and recruitment programs should be leveraged to best
support bonuses, incentives, and educational aide programs within this new policy.22  A
combined military and National Service Program can provide better education and career
opportunities for individuals over the required obligation period.  This combination of programs
should strengthen both organizations with quality participants that are adequately compensated.
The character building quality of this type of National Service experience will do much to
educate subsequent generations on the importance of social responsibility and community
involvement.  A National Service experience has the potential to bridge the growing
culture gap between the military and civilian society at all social levels across this nation.

[independentWV]

This was yesterday in Senate:

Such a divided vote is bad start 74-14

Today's Senate Floor Log
TUESDAY, MARCH 24, 2009
The Senate will convene at 10:00 AM and will be in morning business for one hour. At 11:00 AM, the Senate will resume consideration of the Motion to Proceed to H.R. 1388 (Reauthorize National Service Laws). The Senate will recess from 12:30 to 2:15 PM for the weekly party lunches.
The Senate convened and proceeded with Morning Business.
The Senate proceeded with a Legislative Session.
Motion to Proceed to H. R. 1388 (Reauthorize National Service Laws).
At 12:25 PM, the Senate recessed for party caucuses.
At 2:15 PM, the Senate reconvened.
The Senate proceeded with a Legislative Session.
Motion to Proceed to H. R. 1388 (Reauthorize National Service Laws). Sen. Mikulski motion to yield back all post cloture debate time was agreed to. Sen. Mikulski motion to agreed to the Motion to Proceed to the bill was agreed to.
H. R. 1388 (Reauthorize National Service Laws).
Mikulski amend #687 (To provide for a complete substitute).
Crapo amend #688 (Increase the borrowing authority of the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation). Laid aside.
Johanns amend #693 (Ensure that organizations promoting competitive and non-competitive sporting events involving individuals with disabilities may receive direct and indirect assistance to carry out national service programs). Laid aside.
Baucus amend #692 (Establish a non-profit capacity building program). Laid aside.
The Senate proceeded with a period of Morning Business.
Executive Cal. #33, Gary Locke to be Secretary of Commerce. The nomination was confirmed by voice vote.
S. Con. Res 12 (recognizing and honoring the signing by President Abraham Lincoln of the legislation authorizing the establishment of collegiate programs at Gallaudet University). Agreed to by voice vote.
S. Res. 83 (Designating March 25, 2009 as “National Cerebral Palsy Awareness Day”). Agreed to by voice vote.
S. Res. 37 (Calling on officials of the Government of Brazil and the federal courts of Brazil to comply with the requirements of the Convention on the Civil Aspects of International Child Abduction and to assist in the safe return of Sean Goldman to his father, David Goldman). Agreed to by voice vote, as amended.
The Senate will convene 9:30 AM on Wednesday, March 25, 2009. There will be one hour of Morning Business. The Senate will then resume consideration of H. R. 1388 (Reauthorize National Service Laws). At 12:00 PM, the Senate will proceed to an Executive Session to consider the nomination of David S Kris to be Assistant Attorney General at the Department of Justice. The Senate will then proceed to a vote on the nomination. The Senate will recess from 12:30 – 2:00 for a democratic caucus meeting.
The Senate adjourned at 6:37 PM.

Keep calling

[Kain]

Is there a schedule for what the Senate is voting on in the current week?

This thing has got to be extremely close to an actual vote.

[Jackson Holly]

If there was any real, meaningful opposition they would have blocked the cloture vote.

[Shadowsenshi]

i was looking at the list of cosponsors and i noticed a familiar name

H.R.1388
Title: To reauthorize and reform the national service laws.
Sponsor: Rep McCarthy, Carolyn [NY-4] (introduced 3/9/2009)      Cosponsors (37)
Related Bills: H.RES.250, S.277
Latest Major Action: 3/24/2009 Senate floor actions. Status: Measure laid before Senate by motion.
House Reports: 111-37
COSPONSORS(37), ALPHABETICAL [followed by Cosponsors withdrawn]:     (Sort: by date)


      Rep Altmire, Jason [PA-4] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Andrews, Robert E. [NJ-1] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Bordallo, Madeleine Z. [GU] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Clarke, Yvette D. [NY-11] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Courtney, Joe [CT-2] - 3/9/2009
      Rep DeLauro, Rosa L. [CT-3] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Driehaus, Steve [OH-1] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Fattah, Chaka [PA-2] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Grijalva, Raul M. [AZ-7] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Hare, Phil [IL-17] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Heinrich, Martin [NM-1] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Hinojosa, Ruben [TX-15] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Hirono, Mazie K. [HI-2] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Holt, Rush D. [NJ-12] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Jackson-Lee, Sheila [TX-18] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Kaptur, Marcy [OH-9] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Kildee, Dale E. [MI-5] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Klein, Ron [FL-22] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Kucinich, Dennis J. [OH-10] - 3/12/2009 <----- isn't he supposed to be a "good guy"
      Rep Maloney, Carolyn B. [NY-14] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Matsui, Doris O. [CA-5] - 3/16/2009
      Rep McDermott, Jim [WA-7] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Miller, George [CA-7] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Payne, Donald M. [NJ-10] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Perriello, Thomas S.P. [VA-5] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Polis, Jared [CO-2] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Price, David E. [NC-4] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Rangel, Charles B. [NY-15] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Sablan, Gregorio [MP] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Sestak, Joe [PA-7] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Shea-Porter, Carol [NH-1] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Sutton, Betty [OH-13] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Tonko, Paul D. [NY-21] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Van Hollen, Chris [MD-8] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Welch, Peter [VT] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Woolsey, Lynn C. [CA-6] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Wu, David [OR-1] - 3/16/2009

say it ain't so......

[Dig]

i was looking at the list of cosponsors and i noticed a familiar name

H.R.1388
Title: To reauthorize and reform the national service laws.
Sponsor: Rep McCarthy, Carolyn [NY-4] (introduced 3/9/2009)      Cosponsors (37)
Related Bills: H.RES.250, S.277
Latest Major Action: 3/24/2009 Senate floor actions. Status: Measure laid before Senate by motion.
House Reports: 111-37
COSPONSORS(37), ALPHABETICAL [followed by Cosponsors withdrawn]:     (Sort: by date)


      Rep Altmire, Jason [PA-4] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Andrews, Robert E. [NJ-1] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Bordallo, Madeleine Z. [GU] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Clarke, Yvette D. [NY-11] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Courtney, Joe [CT-2] - 3/9/2009
      Rep DeLauro, Rosa L. [CT-3] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Driehaus, Steve [OH-1] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Fattah, Chaka [PA-2] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Grijalva, Raul M. [AZ-7] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Hare, Phil [IL-17] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Heinrich, Martin [NM-1] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Hinojosa, Ruben [TX-15] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Hirono, Mazie K. [HI-2] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Holt, Rush D. [NJ-12] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Jackson-Lee, Sheila [TX-18] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Kaptur, Marcy [OH-9] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Kildee, Dale E. [MI-5] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Klein, Ron [FL-22] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Kucinich, Dennis J. [OH-10] - 3/12/2009 <----- isn't he supposed to be a "good guy"
      Rep Maloney, Carolyn B. [NY-14] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Matsui, Doris O. [CA-5] - 3/16/2009
      Rep McDermott, Jim [WA-7] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Miller, George [CA-7] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Payne, Donald M. [NJ-10] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Perriello, Thomas S.P. [VA-5] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Polis, Jared [CO-2] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Price, David E. [NC-4] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Rangel, Charles B. [NY-15] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Sablan, Gregorio [MP] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Sestak, Joe [PA-7] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Shea-Porter, Carol [NH-1] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Sutton, Betty [OH-13] - 3/16/2009
      Rep Tonko, Paul D. [NY-21] - 3/9/2009
      Rep Van Hollen, Chris [MD-8] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Welch, Peter [VT] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Woolsey, Lynn C. [CA-6] - 3/12/2009
      Rep Wu, David [OR-1] - 3/16/2009

say it ain't so......

3 pages of pp menbers' outrage: http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=94099.0

[independentWV]

Wednesday, Mar 25, 2009

9:30 a.m.: Convene and begin a period of morning business.

Thereafter, resume consideration of H.R.1388, the National Service bill.

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=senate_calendar&docid=sc001

 UNANIMOUS CONSENT AGREEMENT

                        H.R. 1388 (ORDER NO. 35)

    Ordered, That upon the conclusion of Morning Business on Wednesday,
March 25, 2009, the Senate resume consideration of H.R. 1388, an act to
reauthorize and reform the national service laws. (Mar. 25, 2009.)

http://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/legislative/b_three_sections_with_teasers/active_leg_page.htm

Currently Active
Bills that may receive floor action this week.  
Senate chamber
National service, expand programs S.277 H.R.1388
House chamber
Lands bill, omnibus   H.R.146


Vote soon!

 

[Optimus]

Senate Calendar
http://democrats.senate.gov/calendar/2009-03.html

March 25
Convenes: 9:30am 
Morning Business for up to 1 hour, with senators permitted to speak for up to 10 minutes each. The Majority will control the first 30 minutes and the Republicans will control the second 30 minutes. Following morning business, the Senate will resume consideration of HR1388, the national service legislation.
The Senate is now considering H.R.1388. The following amendments are pending to the bill:
Mikulski #697 (Substitute)
Crapo #688 (FDIC)
Johanns #693 (Special Olympics)
Baucus #692 (Nonprofit Capacity Building Program)
Murkowski-Dorgan #691 (Native Americans)

Under an agreement reached earlier this evening, the Senate will vote tomorrow at 12:00 noon on confirmation of the nomination of David S. Kris, to be an Assistant Attorney General. Upon disposition of the Kris nomination, the Senate will resume consideration of HR1388. That will be the first roll call vote of the day.

The Senate will recess from 12:30pm until 2:00pm to allow for the Democratic caucus luncheon.

Roll call votes in relation to amendments to HR1388 are expected to occur throughout the afternoon.
 

[911aware]

looks like abovetopsecret.com even fell for the misinfo.

they are still debating in senate.
watching on c-span.org

[rawiron1]

I say draft all the effing Liberals first!!  LOL!

Jason

[Kain]

They are voting on nominating David Kris for Assistant Attorney General.

Vote thus far for confirmation is 100% Aye. Will update when voting finishes.

[Kain]

Kris is confirmed. Vote isn't done yet, but they've already got 3/5ths. Have heard no 'nay' votes at all.

[independentWV]

Land bill in House, government grabbing land

[sickntired]

House bill H.R. 1388
The "Give Act" puts school children and silver-haired seniors in the official uniform of the new State.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=92288

[Neco]

WtF?  This guy comes out and supports 9/11 truth but sponsors a slavery bill?

[Kain]

This isn't passed yet folks. They voted for 'cloture' yesterday.(To end debate, and move forward on a vote) The bill will be up for vote within the next day or so, I'd think.