Russia flexes its military muscle

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Offline voodo0

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Russia flexes its military muscle
« on: January 04, 2009, 08:09:36 PM »
As Russia once again resorts to aggressive economic tactics in its latest dispute over gas supplies with neighbouring Ukraine, its official state documentation is raising the spectre of future military conflict over energy resources. Russia's security council prepared a draft document on national security strategy until 2020. At a joint security council and state council meeting held in Moscow on 25 December and chaired by Russia's president, Dmitry Medvedev, the document in question was to be discussed, but this was postponed at the last minute, instead concentrating on Russian policy in the Commonwealth of Independent States (CIS).

President Medvedev ordered a new security strategy in June 2008, and its draft form has been discussed among all its regions. The "strategy of national security of the Russian Federation until the year 2020" – written under the direction of Nikolay Patrushev, secretary of the security council, is expected to be adopted at a state council meeting on 20 February 2009. In early December 2008 Patrushev toured Russia's federal districts promoting the new security strategy. Following a meeting on national security in the far eastern city of Blagoveshchensk he said the proposed draft was pragmatic and practical, and lists specific measures to ensure Russia's national security.

The document itself begins with the claim that Russia has overcome the "consequences of the systemic political and socioeconomic crisis of the late 20th century" and has now restored its capacity to promote its national interest through "multipolar international relations". After predictably designating the United States as Russia's main rival, it then turns to how Russia may maintain its position in the world in future and describes rivalry for controlling global energy resources as a longer term source of conflict. The regions where such confrontations are expected to sharpen is also defined: "The international policy will focus on the access to the energy sources of the world, including the Middle East, Barents Sea, the Arctic Region, Caspian Sea and Central Asia. The struggle for the hydrocarbon resources can be developed to the military confrontation as well, which can result with violation of balance on the Russia's borders with the allies and increasing of the nuclear countries". It also suggests existing conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan, Middle East, some of the South Asian and African countries, as well as in Korean peninsula will have a continued negative impact on the international situation over the next 12 years.

Emphasising possible future Nato enlargement, the new strategy promises to resist US plans to develop its missile defence capabilities, which the Russian elite claims are being aimed against Russia, rather than North Korea or Iran. Furthermore, Russia will pursue a "pragmatic foreign policy" which eschews a new arms race, which clearly the country cannot afford in any case.

Despite widespread disagreement among Russian academics and security experts, the document assumes the possibility of future military conflict erupting over energy resources. Its current gas dispute with Ukraine compelled the Russian government to downplay fears within the EU of any possible disruption to energy supplies, has triggered speculation of increased gas prices in the UK and recently disclosed British government documents confirm that during the last Russo-Ukrainian energy dispute in 2006 the UK energy minister Alan Johnson was briefed eight times on threats to energy security emanating from Russia.

Russia's pursuit of the "multipolar world order" will involve support from its allies in the CIS and its partners elsewhere. It pledges deeper participation within the G8, G20, RIC (Russia, India, China) and BRIC (Brazil, Russia, India, China). Although referring positively to its allies within the collective security treaty organisation, there is no doubt that drawing on the lessons of its experience of the Georgia war last August, Russia will rely more on its own devices and especially its armed forces, which are promised financial and other resources "sufficient" for the creation of a new image of the armed forces while retaining its strategic nuclear potential. The strategy also calls for establishing a "highly professional community of Russian secret services" as a means of ensuring the external and internal security of Russia and developing a "national framework of dealing with international terrorism, extremism, nationalism, and ethnic separatism". All this implies that Russia will continue to use its intelligence services at home and abroad to exaggerate Russia's power and its image in the world.

Almost bombastic in its tone, once again portraying an "image" of a resurgent Russia, the new security strategy neglects real risks stemming from falling production and social hardship – these are not risks based on an imaginary enemy attacking Russia for its energy resources. The price of oil has fallen sharply, the world's economy is slowing down and the financial crisis is hitting Russia hard: the country's political leadership must adjust to new harsh economic realities, but instead chooses to flex military "muscle".

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/jan/04/russia

Offline chris jones

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2009, 08:44:23 PM »

It seems to me that Russia has been a bit provoked as of late. Please correct me if I'm out of step here.

I'm confused,are they felxing their musles or are they attempting to defend themsleves.

I could be reading this the wrong way, but pray tell, who is the conducting the genocide in two nations. Setting up bases in neighboring areas, sending military advisors into recent trouble.

I'm not defending anyone, be they Russian, or the USA, just a few facts that call my attention to Russias reversal in their political stance.

Looking back they seemed prety quiet untill our rulers starting commiting genocide, illegal invasions,  and playing games with Russias neighbors.

Just a passing thought. they did break down that wall, and I beleive they are not communists at this present time. 

Its seem to me they are getting in a defensive mode, not an attack one. One might say they learned quite a bit from their incursion into Afghanistan. I don't think their looking for more of the same.

Your thoughts, has there been some provocation, or am I off the channel here??

Offline Monkeypox

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2009, 08:53:24 PM »
It seems to me that Russia has been a bit provoked as of late. Please correct me if I'm out of step here.

I'm confused,are they felxing their musles or are they attempting to defend themsleves.

I could be reading this the wrong way, but pray tell, who is the conducting the genocide in two nations. Setting up bases in neighboring areas, sending military advisors into recent trouble.

I'm not defending anyone, be they Russian, or the USA, just a few facts that call my attention to Russias reversal in their political stance.

Looking back they seemed prety quiet untill our rulers starting commiting genocide, illegal invasions,  and playing games with Russias neighbors.

Just a passing thought. they did break down that wall, and I beleive they are not communists at this present time. 

Its seem to me they are getting in a defensive mode, not an attack one. One might say they learned quite a bit from their incursion into Afghanistan. I don't think their looking for more of the same.

Your thoughts, has there been some provocation, or am I off the channel here??

It amazes me how people here like you instantly leap to defend the Russians.
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lovealexjones

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2009, 09:09:53 PM »
i'd take a holiday in Russia before the USA, i know it's not the American folks causing all the deaths
in the world today but their government and at that there only doing the bidding of the NWO.


bob

Offline heavyhebrew

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2009, 10:38:14 PM »
It amazes me how people here like you instantly leap to defend the Russians.


I sometimes defend the Russians. But what happens between Russia and the Ukraine is a problem for citizens of the Ukraine and Russia.

In other words, we Americans should mind our own business. We have our own problems and, frankly, these two nations have been going at it since the days of the muscovites.

"Clean up your own back yard before you go knocking on your neighbors door".
We work jobs we hate to pay for stuff we don't need to impress people we don't like. Am I the crazy one here?

Offline Monkeypox

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2009, 10:45:32 PM »
I sometimes defend the Russians. But what happens between Russia and the Ukraine is a problem for citizens of the Ukraine and Russia.

In other words, we Americans should mind our own business. We have our own problems and, frankly, these two nations have been going at it since the days of the muscovites.

"Clean up your own back yard before you go knocking on your neighbors door".

But the Russians have their own ambitions on the worldwide stage too.
War Is Peace - Freedom Is Slavery - Ignorance Is Strength


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Offline heavyhebrew

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2009, 10:53:33 PM »
But the Russians have their own ambitions on the worldwide stage too.

Good for them. If we followed the Constitution like we were supposed to, we would have the moral high ground if and when the Russians decided to play Imperialist.
As it stands, it would be the two big kids on the block fighting over the carcass of the world.

But I know what you mean. The Pravda crew bleats out a "America is bad because of its capitalist bankers!" and some here love it. Oh and they had AJ on the news.
Just because the Russian leadership hates our so called leaders doesn't make the Russians our friends.

What the hell would it have been like in the days of the Soviets when the Russians daily did what they do now?

Other than Alaska, what threat would they be to us? They don't have the manpower of the -istans to hold for an occupation. North America is huge and while Red Dawn was a fun movie, it was laughably implausible.
We work jobs we hate to pay for stuff we don't need to impress people we don't like. Am I the crazy one here?

Offline chris jones

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2009, 04:07:00 PM »
It amazes me how people here like you instantly leap to defend the Russians.


Your a funny guy. Usualy, thats not funny, thanks.

Freind, did you hear squat out of them untill the regime started their games, did you. If so let me know about it.

Usually your one liners are funny, this one was not. if you think they have not been provoked by our Bushmasters bullshitte, tell me, fill me in, I need to understand your remark.

This is what I posted:  I'm not defending anyone, be they Russian, or the USA, just a few facts that call my attention to Russias reversal in their political stance.

Thanks.. CJ


Offline chris jones

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2009, 06:16:28 PM »
I sometimes defend the Russians. But what happens between Russia and the Ukraine is a problem for citizens of the Ukraine and Russia.

In other words, we Americans should mind our own business. We have our own problems and, frankly, these two nations have been going at it since the days of the muscovites.

"Clean up your own back yard before you go knocking on your neighbors door".

Hi. HH.

I did not expect this from you. Tell me was there a problem with Georgia recently? Who provoked the situation; according to this site, Georgia started the problem, and advisors from our armed forces were known to have been there, including Blackwater Mercs.
Or who is setting up so called missle shields within their proximety.

I don't give one shiite about their problems with the gas, thats their problem, not shiite to do with us yet.

My point missed here is they to my knowledge  have not provoked us, have we them?

By the responce here on a point made, truthfully, I had not expected.

If you beleive I was waving the Russian flag, you didn't get my message at all. Nor the fact I depend on this site for the truth, if what I have read here on this site is not factual, let me know.

If I get your message the US regime has not in any way provoked this nation, neither in Georgias acts, nor their missle program. True or false, because bro, I depend on this site for facts, truthfull facts. If the regime was not involved in these two acts for example, then tell me. Ya in my oppinion this has a lot to do with us, not knocking on our neighbors door . Let me know if this site has made  an error in these facts..

I'm well aware of the attrocities commited by the Soviets, I was raised in fear of their BS. I'm well aware what they are capable of, on a par with our regime.

Last but not least, I understand completely the bullshiite that any Gov. is capable of, be it Russain ,Georgian, Israel, or whatever. Kinda bothers me that my reasoning got twisted, tell me they have not been provoked, or was our regime squeky clean in these areas.

I'm never claimed to be Russian  defender, as has been written in by a few here, in fact stipulated in my post that I am not defending them. Just trying to get at the truth here. Can I trust this site for factual news, let me know.

CJ



Offline Revolt426

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2009, 09:21:09 PM »
Hi. HH.

I did not expect this from you. Tell me was there a problem with Georgia recently? Who provoked the situation; according to this site, Georgia started the problem, and advisors from our armed forces were known to have been there, including Blackwater Mercs.
Or who is setting up so called missle shields within their proximety.

I don't give one shiite about their problems with the gas, thats their problem, not shiite to do with us yet.

My point missed here is they to my knowledge  have not provoked us, have we them?

By the responce here on a point made, truthfully, I had not expected.

If you beleive I was waving the Russian flag, you didn't get my message at all. Nor the fact I depend on this site for the truth, if what I have read here on this site is not factual, let me know.

If I get your message the US regime has not in any way provoked this nation, neither in Georgias acts, nor their missle program. True or false, because bro, I depend on this site for facts, truthfull facts. If the regime was not involved in these two acts for example, then tell me. Ya in my oppinion this has a lot to do with us, not knocking on our neighbors door . Let me know if this site has made  an error in these facts..

I'm well aware of the attrocities commited by the Soviets, I was raised in fear of their BS. I'm well aware what they are capable of, on a par with our regime.

Last but not least, I understand completely the bullshiite that any Gov. is capable of, be it Russain ,Georgian, Israel, or whatever. Kinda bothers me that my reasoning got twisted, tell me they have not been provoked, or was our regime squeky clean in these areas.

I'm never claimed to be Russian  defender, as has been written in by a few here, in fact stipulated in my post that I am not defending them. Just trying to get at the truth here. Can I trust this site for factual news, let me know.

CJ



What happened was simple. George Soros INSTALLED Saakashvilli during the Rose Revolution, and ordered him to attack South Ossetia, be it to gauge the Russian Response , or to make the Russians look bad, or whatever.... Soros was behind it without a doubt. He is the guy who funded the Ukraine/Georgia Revolutions (Orange/Rose). Could have been a Zbrzezinski tactic but Soros had to be involved.
"Liquidate labor, liquidate stocks, liquidate the farmers, liquidate real estate … It will purge the rottenness out of the system..." - Andrew Mellon, Secretary of Treasury, 1929.

Offline Revolt426

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2009, 09:23:13 PM »
Russia can no longer be taken as a serious global military threat due to their economic situation. They are in deeper shit then we are to be honest, since their entire currency and economy is based on Exporting Oil and some raw materials, none of which is being purchased now.
"Liquidate labor, liquidate stocks, liquidate the farmers, liquidate real estate … It will purge the rottenness out of the system..." - Andrew Mellon, Secretary of Treasury, 1929.

Offline heavyhebrew

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2009, 09:27:43 PM »
Not attacking you chris, not at all. I am just saying that Russia is not our friend, has never been our friend and, most likely, will never be our friend.
My comments were not directed at you, personally, at all.

I never alluded to you being a defender of Russia. That is between you and monkey.

My post should have been summarized with a simple "a enemy of my enemy is not always my friend". Sorry if I upset you, it was not intended.
We work jobs we hate to pay for stuff we don't need to impress people we don't like. Am I the crazy one here?

Offline Revolt426

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2009, 09:42:17 PM »
Not attacking you chris, not at all. I am just saying that Russia is not our friend, has never been our friend and, most likely, will never be our friend.
My comments were not directed at you, personally, at all.

I never alluded to you being a defender of Russia. That is between you and monkey.

My post should have been summarized with a simple "a enemy of my enemy is not always my friend". Sorry if I upset you, it was not intended.
Heavy is right, Russia would re-establish the Soviet Union if they were able to, but as Zbrzezinski accurately put it, Russia is no longer a Global Power, but a Regional Power, and they have to learn to live with it. Russia has NEVER been a free country, their GOV is run like the mafia and their news is State Owned, so they only report on foreign affairs and never on what is actually occuring IN russia.
"Liquidate labor, liquidate stocks, liquidate the farmers, liquidate real estate … It will purge the rottenness out of the system..." - Andrew Mellon, Secretary of Treasury, 1929.

Offline Revolt426

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2009, 09:43:37 PM »
http://www.larouchepac.com/news/2009/01/05/russian-economy-downspin-larouche-asserted.html

Russian Economy In Downspin, As LaRouche Asserted

January 5, 2009 (LPAC)--Russian industrial production collapsed 8.7% in November 2008 from its level one year earlier, in the largest decline since the 1998 GKO crisis. This is stunning confirmation of Lyndon LaRouche's warning, in his paper, "How Russia Was Surprised," that "Russia's government, rather than heeding my globally circulated warning, allowed itself to be misled into pretending that it would not be hit massively by what were, in fact, the inevitable spillover of this crisis into Russia's own economy."

When November of 2008 is compared to November a year earlier, Russia's manufacturing production fell 10.3%; steel pipe production fell 36.9%; coking coal production dropped 38.7%; and fertilizer production fell 51.6%.

The ruble has declined to a level of about 29 rubles to the dollar, a dollar which itself is wobbly.

Meanwhile, during November, as employers find internal cash reserves shrinking, and borrowing from banks more difficult, the level of overdue wages that businesses have not paid, leaped 93%.
"Liquidate labor, liquidate stocks, liquidate the farmers, liquidate real estate … It will purge the rottenness out of the system..." - Andrew Mellon, Secretary of Treasury, 1929.

Offline Freeski

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2009, 10:20:39 PM »
Russia can no longer be taken as a serious global military threat due to their economic situation. They are in deeper shit then we are to be honest, since their entire currency and economy is based on Exporting Oil and some raw materials, none of which is being purchased now.

But at one point they had an arsenal that could wreek havoc on the world so even if they're only half that now, or a quarter, it's still enough for us to take seriously. Also, was all of the other 75% destroyed, or was it "destroyed"?
"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.

Offline Revolt426

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2009, 10:22:41 PM »
But at one point they had an arsenal that could wreek havoc on the world so even if they're only half that now, or a quarter, it's still enough for us to take seriously. Also, was all of the other 75% destroyed, or was it "destroyed"?
I would think that they could wreck major havoc in Europe but are no threat to the U.S....... I dont know if their arsenal was 75% destroyed i just know they are in serious economic hell right now, alot worse then the U.S. and they are using very out dated Military Equiptment as seen in the Ossetia War
"Liquidate labor, liquidate stocks, liquidate the farmers, liquidate real estate … It will purge the rottenness out of the system..." - Andrew Mellon, Secretary of Treasury, 1929.

Offline able

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2009, 10:50:32 PM »
has Russia fully thrown of the yoke of the Bolsheviks? and who now is in the yoke of the Bolsheviks???

for those who do their true history of the world this is a major part of the equation....

all that is left of the host is usually a carcass, are you not in a economic crises for carrying out someone else s foreign policy?????   
my kids are not cannon fodder for the n.w.o!

Rock

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2009, 11:19:19 PM »
Russia is still the most powerful deterant.

Comments:

In 2008 ALONE Russia produced over 50 silo based Topol missile systems, 14 mobile Topol-M systems, AND by early 2009 the Bulava SS-NX-30 SSBM will be commissioned for service with the first order at 16... so yeah... Russia still has the worlds largest nuclear weapons stockpile at 16,300

Russia is still producing nukes, they also have the Iskander short range ballistic missile, wich is in full production as well the Sineva R-29m submarine launched ballistic missile, being produced for their Delta IV submarines.

Rock

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #18 on: January 05, 2009, 11:23:46 PM »
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/dec/24/russia-nuclear

Russia to raise nuclear missile output fourfold

Russia has thrown down a new gauntlet to Barack Obama with an announcement that it will sharply increase production of strategic nuclear missiles.

In the latest of a series of combative moves by the Kremlin, a senior government official in Moscow said the Russian military would commission 70 strategic missiles over the next three years, as part of a massive rearmament programme which will also include short-range missiles, 300 tanks, 14 warships and 50 planes.

Military experts said the planned new arsenal was presumed to consist of land-based intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBMs) rather than submarine-launched missiles. If this is the case, the plans represent a fourfold increase in the rate of ICBM deployment. The arsenal will include a new-generation, multiple-warhead ICBM called the RS-24. It was first test-fired in 2007, with first deputy prime minister Sergei Ivanov boasting it was "capable of overcoming any existing or future missile defence systems".

The new missiles will be part of a £95bn defence procurement package for 2009-2011, a 28% increase in arms spending, according to Vladislav Putilin of the cabinet's military-industrial commission. There will be further increases in spending in the following two years.

The new military procurements follow the war in Georgia in August. Russian forces easily routed Georgian troops, but the conflict exposed weaknesses in the Russian army, including outdated equipment and poorly co-ordinated command structures. The defence ministry said it would carry out drastic reforms, turning the army into a more modern force.

Vladimir Putin on Monday urged cabinet officials to quickly allocate funds for new weapons and closely control the quality and pace of their production. Military experts said the construction of 70 long-range nuclear missiles in the next three years represented a Russian attempt to strengthen its bargaining position with Washington, in talks aimed at agreeing new nuclear weapons cuts when the current treaty in force, Start I, expires next December.

Moscow's strategy appears to be to challenge Obama's new administration as soon as it takes office on 20 January. On the day Obama was elected the Russian president, Dmitry Medvedev, announced plans to station short-range Iskander missiles in Russia's Kaliningrad exclave as a counter to American installation of its missile defence system in eastern Europe.

Ruben Sergeev, an expert on disarmament issues, said Moscow was afraid of falling behind in a new arms race.

"Russia is decommissioning its old liquid-fuel missiles from the Soviet era at a rate of several dozen every year," he said. "The Kremlin knows that if it doesn't increase production of ICBMs rapidly now then it will have no chance of getting a new arms reduction treaty out of the US, which has much greater quantities of missiles." Negotiations on a successor to Start I have been bogged down in detail, and hamstrung by the Bush administration's lame duck status.

The chief US negotiator, John Rood, said last week that the latest sticking point was Russian insistence that the new treaty cover long-range delivery systems, such as bombers and missiles, intended for conventional arms as well as nuclear warheads. The US wants the treaty to focus solely on nuclear warheads.

Moscow has also signalled that it would supply Tehran with new surface-to-air missiles in defiance of US opposition. Washington has asked for more information on the sales, fearing the weapons being sold include long-range S-300 missiles, which have a 120km (75 mile) range. They could threaten US planes in Iraq, and could also protect Iranian nuclear sites from aerial attack.

The US has set aside its own plans for military action against Iran for now, but US officials hoped that fear of an Israeli strike would make Iran more amenable to suspending its enrichment of uranium.

Offline 241727

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #19 on: January 05, 2009, 11:25:12 PM »
Quote
The arsenal will include a new-generation, multiple-warhead ICBM called the RS-24. It was first test-fired in 2007, with first deputy prime minister Sergei Ivanov boasting it was "capable of overcoming any existing or future missile defence systems".

My understanding is the newer missiles can defeat the so called missile shield.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RS-24



Offline 241727

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2009, 11:39:56 PM »





Rock

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2009, 11:53:22 PM »

Offline Freeski

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2009, 12:06:15 AM »
Here it is

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nA4oz8q6RDE

Wow, that's a BIG missile. Is the hydrogen bomb still the biggest payload?
"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.

Offline Revolt426

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #23 on: January 06, 2009, 12:48:06 AM »
There is no ballistic missile capable of over powering the secret part of the missile shield they probably already have operational. They tell you they are setting up 12 Interceptors? Nonsense its a front, they are using DIrect Energy Tech and that is nuke proof if you really look at what is possible now.
"Liquidate labor, liquidate stocks, liquidate the farmers, liquidate real estate … It will purge the rottenness out of the system..." - Andrew Mellon, Secretary of Treasury, 1929.

Offline chris jones

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #24 on: January 06, 2009, 09:29:33 AM »
Not attacking you chris, not at all. I am just saying that Russia is not our friend, has never been our friend and, most likely, will never be our friend.
My comments were not directed at you, personally, at all.

I never alluded to you being a defender of Russia. That is between you and monkey.

My post should have been summarized with a simple "a enemy of my enemy is not always my friend". Sorry if I upset you, it was not intended.

Thanks for the reply, and no need to apolagize, I did misunderstand your post, its me who should be making apoligies.

HH, I do think the regime played a game on Russia, and I'm convinced they were seeking tensions to increase. Again, I'm not waving the Soviet , or Russian flag, but we are involved, The reasoning behind this, I look to the regime, their playmates in the G7, and the Elite.

The effects of the Genocide we are commiting and our support of Isarael in their ongoing slaughter, has sent ripples of fear and hatred globaly.
Yes, this regime is involved, and will be under fire for our undying affection for Israel and treatment of the PL.

I beleive we have made it clear, the global political veiw of our leaders is basically, controll,fear,genocide,and or submit to us. They are stirring up a hornets nest, and they are well aware of it.

Just my thoughts.


Offline 241727

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #25 on: January 06, 2009, 09:34:41 AM »
The scary thing is the Russians are playing a wait and see what Obaaamma actualy does when he takes office. So take a guess what there attitiude will be when Zibignew starts his moves on The Grandchess Board.

Personaly I would'nt put money on pole long past his "sell by date" playing chess at international level with the Russians.

Offline Pheonix Renewed

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #26 on: January 06, 2009, 09:44:04 AM »
I'm sorry, I'm not convinced that Russia are the bad guys. I AM convinced that we ARE the bad guys. This makes me inclined to see Russia's "fruits" and ask myself if they are as bad as our MSM makes them out to be. Are they our friends? No.

Good for them, I wouldn't be our friends, either. In fact, I'd kick the shit out of us.

Is Russia out there instigating wars? I don't see it. Are we? I see that.

Is Russia out there supporting genocide? I don't see it. Are we? I see that.

Is Russia out there slaughtering civilians in foreign countries? I don't see it. Are we? I see that.

No, indeed... Russia is not our friend. I wouldn't want to be friends with anyone who wants to be friends with us, frankly.
Nobody made a greater mistake than he who did nothing because he could only do a little.

-Edmund Burke

Do not under-estimate your own mind. That is the NWO's job.

- Cathiasus

Offline chris jones

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #27 on: January 06, 2009, 09:49:14 AM »
The scary thing is the Russians are playing a wait and see what Obaaamma actualy does when he takes office. So take a guess what there attitiude will be when Zibignew starts his moves on The Grandchess Board.

Personaly I would'nt put money on pole long past his "sell by date" playing chess at international level with the Russians.


Bump++++++ behind the curtains of war and slaughter, this nation is being ripped apart, the fear factors they are initiating, the enemies they are creating is far beyond what this country was based upon, they  are in control absolute.
I beleive all truthers have opened many an eye of the citizenry to the abonination taking place.  I also beleive that this will not kick into full force untill the effects of their takedwon truly hit the people. They may be drinking fluoride, OK, but a 2 x 4 across the side of their heads will get them out of their bubbles, I have a feeling this is coming.

Offline andy1033

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #28 on: January 06, 2009, 10:11:31 AM »
The scary thing is the Russians are playing a wait and see what Obaaamma actualy does when he takes office. So take a guess what there attitiude will be when Zibignew starts his moves on The Grandchess Board.

Personaly I would'nt put money on pole long past his "sell by date" playing chess at international level with the Russians.


Personally i think he and his team have already started. russia knows they where set up to go into georgia, but i think it was obamas team that set them up to look bad, because putin was getting a good international reputation. they tried to get rid of that before obama gets in.

The world has seen what uk/usa/israel do, and have done in the 21st century alone, and surely many arab governments are looking again at there siding with america/uk/israel.

Looks like this gas thing is to make russia look bad again, when russia just wants paying for the gas they sent to ukraine. Man is there going to be alot of propganda against russia in the west in the coming years or what, with obama coming in. Just hope the truth and people see through obamas bull.

Offline chris jones

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #29 on: January 06, 2009, 10:33:50 AM »
I'm sorry, I'm not convinced that Russia are the bad guys. I AM convinced that we ARE the bad guys. This makes me inclined to see Russia's "fruits" and ask myself if they are as bad as our MSM makes them out to be. Are they our friends? No.

Good for them, I wouldn't be our friends, either. In fact, I'd kick the shit out of us.

Is Russia out there instigating wars? I don't see it. Are we? I see that.

Is Russia out there supporting genocide? I don't see it. Are we? I see that.

Is Russia out there slaughtering civilians in foreign countries? I don't see it. Are we? I see that.

No, indeed... Russia is not our friend. I wouldn't want to be friends with anyone who wants to be friends with us, frankly.

Hi Pheonix. I have to admit, I liked your post. Very honest. Good on ya.

Then you must agree we have provoked some hard feelings in that nation as well as a few others.

I appreciate you honesty and your being strait forward and up front.

At this point in my life, I have to admit I don't have much faith in any rulers, but I have completly lost faith in our current regime, and a few before that.

I wonder who beleives that this regime has not proven to the world we are a threat to their well being.


Offline Al Bundy

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #30 on: March 10, 2017, 06:31:32 AM »
Russian President Putin sacks 10 generals and 2 prosecutors.

https://en.crimerussia.com/gover/putin-dismisses-10-generals-and-2-prosecutors/http://

Offline freedom_commonsense

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #31 on: March 10, 2017, 06:42:53 AM »
Not a good sign when you fire police chiefs, internal service investigators and other persons in the legal system.

Offline regmeok

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Re: Russia flexes its military muscle
« Reply #32 on: April 17, 2017, 01:59:41 AM »
heated debates here. i ll make some general comments on friend v enemy thing.

  there is no such category as 'friend' when it comes to countries' competition over territories, routes, resources, offshores, etc. but let us omit that thought from consideration

(1) would Russia be an independent entity and hadnot it been ruined (in many ways) for 100 years by bolsheviks and their descendents - i see no reason why Russia would not be a comparatively friendly entity (much more friendly than friendenemy UK with which US have been competing last 100 years for world dominance)
(2) but in the current state Russia can be considered as an anti-american instrument. but would it be correct to call a hammer and not the owner ' a friend'?