NASA!!!...Psy-op, Photoshop, Terra-forming... What's Up, NASA?

[Voskhod3]

An outstanding picture... you have to see it full size here: http://spaceflight.nasa.gov/gallery/images/apollo/apollo15/hires/as15-86-11602.jpg

[Voskhod3]

Another outstanding picture full size here: http://science.ksc.nasa.gov/mirrors/images/images/pao/AS15/10075742.jpg



But oh golly gosh.. NO ANTENNA.... oh no!

..unless you research the story of what happened to Jim Irwin's antenna.

[TheCaliKid]

Google is your friend.

Seriously.. do you guys ever research anything?

Not for me, you insidious, pompous fool.


I am addressing iks83.

[Voskhod3]

Not for me, you insidious, pompous fool.

What's thin, long and shiny and is to be found attached to the top of a PLSS?

That's how we know.

[iks83]

Not for me, you insidious, pompous fool.


I am addressing iks83.

Uhmmm... I dont believe they were hung on some gadget to fake low gravity so why should I be the one to proof that they did? You crazy?

[TheCaliKid]

Uhmmm... I dont believe they were hung on some gadget to fake low gravity so why should I be the one to proof that they did? You crazy?

Exactly my point. I don't believe that they were either.


When I said "you" I meant it as in "collective you" (all the hoaxers). If there were indeed wires supporting the men, why do we only see the "glinting reflections" off to one side? We should more, unless they assume that only one wire was used. (which doesn't really work, from their point of view)

[Voskhod3]

Exactly my point. I don't believe that they were either.

I wish you had been clearer.

I apologise.

[TheCaliKid]

I apologise.

Apology accepted.


At times, communicating via message board can be difficult.

[Jackson Holly]

Dawn:

I am asking - how do we know (prove to me) that the "glinting reflections" are not just the astronauts anntenna catching the light?

Many of the YouTubers have confused the antenna for support wires ... that's obvious ... but that does not discount the possibility of their use in studio. They would have used a body harness just as in any other movie, connecting with the tiny black wire behind the head.

But forget looking for the wires if you like ... they were mostly hidden against the black backgrounds, retouched or edited out, anyway.

Just look at the results ... the moonwalking ... convincing to you?


Two more vids here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9kon-URcko&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6wf8moMZl8

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 ... and finally Dawn, did you see this short video ...
one of the first things I posted on this thread.

A deal breaker if actual footage.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93Mp9zYJQdY&feature=related

[TheCaliKid]

Yeah, I don't know. What about the experiments that they left behind? Doesn't that prove they went there?

[TimeLady]

Yeah, I don't know. What about the experiments that they left behind? Doesn't that prove they went there?

afaik no one has addressed this yet.

[TheCaliKid]

I don't think anyone is ever going back. They say 2020, but I call BS. There's no way anyone is ever going back. Hell, they've been talking about going back for 35 years now.

I think there is another space program that we don't know about. Maybe outta Area 51. NASA is for fools and tools. Gimmie a break.


 

[Jackson Holly]

There was a mirror that was placed upon the Moon by one of the Apollo missions for the purpose of measuring the distance between the Earth and the Moon with a laser. Unless every astrophysicist in the world is in on the conspiracy, that mirror is likely still there.

Yeah, I don't know. What about the experiments that they left behind? Doesn't that prove they went there?

~~~~~~~~~~~

Timelady:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_evidence_for_Apollo_Moon_landings

Here is the link to WIKI that you posted earlier ... we can talk about each item one at a time, if you like.

First, the piece about the reflectors:

~~~~~~~

Retroreflectors

The Apollo 11 Lunar Laser Ranging Experiment as left on the Moon

The presence of retroreflectors (mirrors used as targets for Earth-based tracking lasers) from the Lunar laser ranging experiment (Laser Ranging RetroReflector; LRRR) left on the Moon is evidence of a landing.

Quoting from James Hansen's biography of Neil Armstrong (First Man: The Life of Neil A. Armstrong):

    For those few misguided souls who still cling to the belief that the Moon landings never happened, examination of the results of five decades of LRRR experiments should evidence how delusional their rejection of the Moon landing really is.

This data shows there are man-made objects on the Moon in the locations claimed for the Apollo landing. Credit: The APOLLO (Lunar Laser Ranging) Collaboration

The NASA-independent Observatoire de la Côte D’Azur, McDonald, Apache Point, and Haleakala observatories are regularly using the Apollo LRRR. The image on the left shows some of the most unambiguous evidence. This experiment repeatedly fires a laser at the Moon, at the spots where the Apollo landing were reported. The dots show when photons are received from the Moon. The dark line shows that a large number come back at a specific time, and hence were reflected by something quite small (well under a meter in size). Photons reflected from the surface would come back over a much broader range of times (the whole vertical range of the plot corresponds to only 30 meters or so in range). This only happens when the laser is aimed at the spots where the lunar landings were reported, otherwise the expected featureless distribution is observed. The Apollo reflectors are still in use.

Strictly speaking, although the reflectors are strong evidence that human-manufactured artifacts currently exist on the Moon, and their locations are consistent with NASA's claims, they do not prove humans have visited the Moon. Similar retroreflectors were carried by unmanned missions such as Lunokhod 2, and like the Apollo reflectors, these reflectors are still in use. However, there is no explanation of how the Apollo retroreflectors got to the Moon other than being carried by manned Apollo missions.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

NASA likes to cite "independent" sources to validate their claims ... there are 'independent' sources in a New World Order?

And they especially like to cite the work of their "competitors", Russia ... our comrades during WWII and actual partners in space ... they are part and parcel of the scam ... WTF?

Watch this video first:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=adSbmLPvoD8

~~~~~~~~~~

1. Now, I don't doubt the Astronomer's sincerity ... he probably thinks he is doing real science, and bouncing rays off the mirror left at Tranquility by Neil & Buzz. But, did you catch the fact of the amount/number of 'rays' (did he say photons?) that they receive back? Many astronomers report that kind of rate and better just blasting the moon's surface with a laser.

2. We think of the laser as remaining a pinpoint over that 250,000 miles, but it does not, it spreads to several hundred feet (as is my memory). I guess I just don't believe their 'science'.

3. Anyway, as the article says, they did or could have left the same mirrors in an unmanned landing (if indeed that were accomplished).

4. BTW ... as posted elsewhere on the forum I believe, they are cutting the funding ($125,000 per year) for the mirror blaster program. It shows the moon retreating from the Earth. I wonder how long before it escapes the Earth's magnetic hold?

5.  ... and the LOL "sandwich bag" on the moon! It looks like a photographers test polaroid to me.

I'll dig up some more links if you like.

[iks83]

I don't think anyone is ever going back. They say 2020, but I call BS. There's no way anyone is ever going back. Hell, they've been talking about going back for 35 years now.

I think there is another space program that we don't know about. Maybe outta Area 51. NASA is for fools and tools. Gimmie a break.

Yeah its really sad they never went back although it doesnt seem to be that hard. The Apollo spacecraft had a weight of 24,5 tons. The lander 14 tons or so. The total max weight of the spaceshuttle is a bit over 100 tons. Basicly if they decommisson the spaceshuttle anyways why not remodeling into a lunar mission spacecraft. It can hold 16 tons of equipment basicly enough for a landing module and the shuttle itself can be the orbiter. Though fuel seems to be a problem since you have to move more mass. But seriously with all the new materials invented over the past 40 years it should be peice of cake. I understand the moon hoaxers taking that as proof that we never went there cause it would be rather easy with todays technology so why didnt they go?!? From a NWO standpoint you know why... well that damn space race made our kids dream and wanna be engineers and scientists. It brought the whole world together for a moment. We cant have that shit! Lets rather spend all the money for nukes and depopulation and ways to get the people under control and enslave them. Also all the inventions that came with the spaceprogram found their way to the slaves making their lifes better. Thats not acceptable!

[Voskhod3]

Jackson Holly wants to move on but won't acknowledge this is bullsh*t.



These pictures are a deceit.

Someone changed the colour
changed the brightness
compressed it so there is detail loss
cropped the right picture so it doesn't show where the shadow is
cropped the left picture so the lens flare is not obvious.

Well Jackson Holly, when you going ti grow a pair?

[SpeakUpFightBack]

Curious... I would like to see his evidence... the movement of the ghost image is consistent with a ghost reflection off of the capsule outside onto the window, and would have identical motion... an arm in front of the lens in a cramped space containing 3 men would not be uncommon... who among us hasn't stuck our finger over the camera lens when taking a shot...

Other than that I saw a young fat guy chasing a bunch of 70+ year-old man around with the Bible... six of them told him to f*ck off, and three swore on that Bible... and then one punched him in the nose... deservedly so I might add...

I would like to see this tape he's all on about, the "Apollo outtakes..."

Also, the animated depiction of the Van Allen belts, as a static symmetrical band of radiation in two layers is totally erroneous... it is considerably drawn around and weakened on the side facing the sun by the solar wind and is elongated on the Leeward/dark side of the planet... so if the capsule escapes the Earth's gravitation at the proper point it passes through less than 1000 miles of this weakened radiation which is drawn out by the solar wind, as I've pointed out... as to the size of the rocket needed to push the capsule and power supply to a high escape orbit... his supposed expert computes thrust parameters that are at least 5 times that needed for the Apollo capsule and power supply to escape Earth's gravity... I suggest he re-check his math... This video proves nothing other than the arrogance and disrespect of the person who made it.

--Oldyoti

"When we are planning for posterity, we ought
to remember that virtue is not hereditary."
 ~Thomas Paine

I love you yoda-yoti.  But check out the following film:

"A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Moon" - http://www.moonmovie.com/

Not a open and shut case; but certainly lots of questions!!!

[SpeakUpFightBack]

~ They took LOTS of Photographs! WOW! ~

Check out this interesting study that I stumbled upon on the good ole internet:

~~~~~ O ~~~~~

Here is a study by analyst Jack White. He has studied this moon landing hoax more than anyone. Here, he puts it to the math test to show the impossibility of what NASA is asking us to believe. I visited several official NASA websites to find HOW MANY PHOTOS WERE TAKEN on the surface of the Moon. Amazingly, NASA AVOIDS THIS SUBJECT almost entirely.
Two days of searching documents and text were fruitless. But Lunar Surface Journal, one of the sites, lists every photo with its file number. So I undertook to make an actual count of every photo taken by astronauts DURING EXTRA-VEHICULAR ACTIVITY (EVA), the time spent on the surface out of the LEM.

Here is my actual count of EVA photos of the six missions:

Apollo 11…........ 121

Apollo 12…........ 504

Apollo 14…........ 374

Apollo 15….......1021

Apollo 16….......1765

Apollo 17….......1986

~~~~~~~~~~

So 12 astronauts while on the Moon’s surface took a TOTAL of 5771 exposures.
That seemed excessively large to me, considering that their TIME on the lunar surface was limited, and the astronauts had MANY OTHER TASKS OTHER THAN PHOTOGRAPHY. So I returned to the Lunar Surface Journal to find how much TIME was available to do all the scientific tasks AS WELL AS PHOTOGRAPHY. Unlike the number of photos, this information is readily available:

Apollo 11….....1 EVA …..2 hours, 31 minutes…...(151 minutes)

Apollo 12….....2 EVAs…..7 hours, 50 minutes…...(470 minutes)

Apollo 14….....2 EVAs…..9 hours, 25 minutes…...(565 minutes)

Apollo 15….....3 EVAs…18 hours, 30 minutes….(1110 minutes)

Apollo 16….....3 EVAs…20 hours, 14 minutes….(1214 minutes)

Apollo 17….....3 EVAs…22 hours, 04 minutes….(1324 minutes)


Total minutes on the Moon amounted to 4834 minutes. Total number of photographs taken was 5771 photos. Hmmmmm. That amounts to 1.19 photos taken EVERY MINUTE of time on the Moon, REGARDLESS OF OTHER ACTIVITIES. (That requires the taking of ONE PHOTO EVERY 50 SECONDS!)

~~~~~~~~~

Let’s look at those other activities to see how much time should be deducted from available photo time:

Apollo 11….Inspect LEM for damage, deploy flag, unpack and deploy radio and television equipment, operate the TV camera (360 degree pan), establish contact with Earth (including ceremonial talk with President Nixon), unpack and deploy numerous experiment packages, find/document/collect 47.7 pounds of lunar rock samples, walk to various locations, conclude experiments, return to LEM.

Apollo 12….Inspect LEM for damage, deploy flag, unpack and deploy radio and television equipment (spend time trying to fix faulty TV camera), establish contact with Earth, unpack and deploy numerous experiment packages, walk to various locations, inspect the unmanned Surveyor 3 which had landed on the Moon in April 1967 and retrieve Surveyor parts. Deploy ALSEP package. Find/document/collect 75.7 pounds of rocks, conclude experiments, return to LEM.

Apollo 14….Inspect LEM for damage, deploy flag, unpack and deploy radio and television equipment and establish contact with Earth, unpack and assemble hand cart to transport rocks, unpack and deploy numerous experiment packages, walk to various locations. Find/document/collect 94.4 pounds of rocks, conclude experiments, return to LEM.

Apollo 15….Inspect LEM for damage, deploy flag, unpack and deploy radio and television equipment and establish contact with Earth, unpack/assemble/equip and test the LRV electric-powered 4-wheel drive car and drive it 17 miles, unpack and deploy numerous experiment packages (double the scientific payload of first three missions). Find/document/collect 169 pounds of rocks, conclude experiments, return to LEM. (The LRV travels only 8 mph.)

Apollo 16….Inspect LEM for damage, deploy flag, unpack and deploy radio and television equipment and establish contact with Earth, unpack/assemble/equip and test the LRV electric-powered 4-wheel drive car and drive it 16 miles, unpack and deploy numerous experiment packages (double the scientific payload of first three missions, including new ultraviolet camera, operate the UV camera). Find/document/collect 208.3 pounds of rocks, conclude experiments, return to LEM. (The LRV travels only 8 mph.)

Apollo 17….Inspect LEM for damage, deploy flag, unpack and deploy radio and television equipment and establish contact with Earth, unpack/assemble/equip and test the LRV electric-powered 4-wheel drive car and drive it 30.5 miles, unpack and deploy numerous experiment packages. Find/document/collect 243.1 pounds of rocks, conclude experiments, return to LEM. (The LRV travels only 8 mph*.)

Let’s arbitrarily calculate a MINIMUM time for these tasks and subtract from available photo time:

Apollo 11…subtract 2 hours (120 mins), leaving 031 mins for taking photos

Apollo 12…subtract 4 hours (240 mins), leaving 230 mins for taking photos

Apollo 14…subtract 3 hours (180 mins), leaving 385 mins for taking photos

Apollo 15…subtract 6 hours (360 mins), leaving 750 mins for taking photos

Apollo 16…subtract 6 hours (360 mins), leaving 854 mins for taking photos

Apollo 17…subtract 8 hours (480 mins), leaving 844 mins for taking photos

~~~~~~~

So do the math:

Apollo 11…..121 photos in 031 minutes….....3.90 photos per minute

Apollo 12…..504 photos in 230 minutes….....2.19 photos per minute

Apollo 14…..374 photos in 385 minutes….....0.97 photos per minute

Apollo 15…1021 photos in 750 minutes….....1.36 photos per minute

Apollo 16…1765 photos in 854 minutes …....2.06 photos per minute

Apollo 17…1986 photos in 844 minutes …....2.35 photos per minute

~~~~~

Or, to put it more simply:

Apollo 11….....one photo every 15 seconds

Apollo 12….....one photo every 27 seconds

Apollo 14….....one photo every 62 seconds

Apollo 15….....one photo every 44 seconds

Apollo 16….....one photo every 29 seconds

Apollo 17….....one photo every 26 seconds

~~~~~~~~~~

So you decide. Given all the facts, was it possible to take that many photos in so short a time?

Any professional photographer will tell you it cannot be done. Virtually every photo was a different scene or in a different place, requiring travel. As much as 30 miles travel was required to reach some of the photo sites. Extra care had to be taken shooting some stereo pairs and panoramas. Each picture was taken without a viewfinder, using manual camera settings, with no automatic metering, while wearing a bulky spacesuit and stiff clumsy gloves.

The agency wants the world to believe that 5771 photographs were taken in 4834 minutes! IF NOTHING BUT PHOTOGRAPHY HAD BEEN DONE, such a feat is clearly impossible…made even more so by all the documented activities of the astronauts.

Imagine … 1.19 photos every minute that men were on the Moon – that’s one picture every 50 SECONDS!

http://theconspiracyzone.podcastpeople.com/posts/28159

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Thanks for the info!!!

[iks83]

Thanks for the info!!!

Oh god and so fell another fool victim to decpetion and BS.

[iks83]

So certain are you? I guess you must believe that some cave dwelling Muslims brought the US to its knees, without any help.

 We never went and wont go until after the collapse of this present system of things. All mankind will have to unite before space becomes a frontier that we may explore in person. High altitude orbit is as far as we have gotten....for now.

The reason why I think so is posted before. Everyone with half a braincell should realize the errors in that article... why don't you just go to the surface journal and look up what time they actually spent on making the photos instead of believing some averaged statistical scam. Oh I forgot... the journals are all fake and whatnot... how convenient.

[Voskhod3]

The reason why I think so is posted before. Everyone with half a braincell should realize the errors in that article... why don't you just go to the surface journal and look up what time they actually spent on making the photos instead of believing some averaged statistical scam. Oh I forgot... the journals are all fake and whatnot... how convenient.

Yep.

The brain-dead NEVER check anything.

I think we have safely established that.

[Outer Haven]

Yep.

The brain-dead NEVER check anything.

I think we have safely established that.

You really sound like a brain-dead disinfo agent with a broken record. 

[Voskhod3]

You really sound like a brain-dead disinfo agent with a broken record. 

I'm not the one who doesn't varify what he's told.

There's a clue for you on the 'Youtube caught red-handed' thread.

Go there, read what I wrote, go and play then come back and admit you're wrong.

Thanks.

[Jackson Holly]

Results of my highly scientific study:

Regular 3M duct tape ... one minute in a 250 degree oven



Try it yourself!

[luckee1]

    Duct tape works everywhere!  Whatcha talkin bout!   

[Jackson Holly]

burlguy:

"Duct tape doesn't work in the vacuum of space," said John Shannon, the mission management team's chairman.

Did you have a link for that statement?

Here is a NASA link (call it the tape page) where they go on endlessly about "good old American duct tape" saving the day. At one point they do say that if the tape is applied inside the lander and the air 'bubbles' are carefully smoothed out, then it can be taken outside.   

http://www.workingonthemoon.com/WOTM-DuctTape.html

There are a bunch of page links here, haven't looked at them all ... but I have not found one about hi-temp tape specs, yet.

[kushfiend]

[Jackson Holly]

 
I guess duct and scotch tape only worked on the Apollo moonwalks, then.

                                               

[xfahctor]

 So has any one looked in to what types of tape were actualy used?

[Jackson Holly]

So has any one looked in to what types of tape were actualy used?

I have been trying to see what NASA says ... on the page I listed above they seem to be describing regular duct tape, which could not hold up under nearly 300 degree temps outside the LM (lander).

Then burlguy finds the quote that duct tape does not work in a vacuum. I assume that is true for any temp spec.   

I know there are hi-temp tapes ... but I don't know what was possible in 1960s.

Then there is the "scotch" tape all over the lander!

[xfahctor]

I have been trying to see what NASA says ... on the page I listed above they seem to be describing regular duct tape, which could not hold up under nearly 300 degree temps outside the LM (lander).

Then burlguy finds the quote that duct tape does not work in a vacuum. I assume that is true for any temp spec.   

I know there are hi-temp tapes ... but I don't know what was possible in 1960s.

Then there is the "scotch" tape all over the lander!

well, something that kinda looks like metallic scotch tape anyways, I don't think there is anywhere near enough of anything to make a solid claim it is "scotch" tape". I am trying for the most part to stay out of this, just watching the debate and trying to keep it on point and based in science, but I may go do a little digging when I get free time. I will probably just ask some people I know who would know for sure.

[Jackson Holly]

^^^
Great ... that would be nice. I have seen quiet a bit of talk about it on other forums as well, but have not seen the official NASA explanation of using tape (really any kind of tape) as a standard operating procedure on the lunar lander, with knowledge of the excessive heat and vacuum.

[Jackson Holly]

burlguy:

Well according to the astronauts it was good old fashioned gray American tape.......

Does not make any sense, does it ... either tape works under high/low temps in a vacuum ... or it doesn't. They are trying to have it both ways.

After I read through the Apollo 12 Surface Journal I was struck by how much they talked about tape usage ... as if NASA became aware of how ridiculous those pix of the APOLLO 11 lander were all taped up, and were probably getting flak ... and so they really talked up moon~tape usage from then on.

Another quote from your source:

"Without a fender, the rover would be showered by a spray of dark, abrasive grit. White spacesuits blackened by dust could turn into dangerous absorbers of the fierce lunar sun with astronauts overheating inside."

Oh yeah? Well what about that gray, sticky duct tape?

Remember my earlier pic ... duct tape one minute at 250 degrees?

[iks83]

Oh yeah? Well what about that gray, sticky duct tape?

Remember my earlier pic ... duct tape one minute at 250 degrees?

Geez when you step into the sun on the moon you dont have suddenly 250°C (I think you mean C). It all depends on the material thats taking the radiation. In you little oven experiment it was air that reached 250 degrees of course it would melt away after one minute. In space there is no air so the tape itself needs to get hot and that depends on the material. White, even gray surfaces wouldnt get very hot I suppose. And the suits turning gray and gray duct tape is a huge difference... the duct tape doesnt care if it gets 40 degrees hotter. But make the experiment... take duct tape and put it in boiling water... then put your hand in there and see which one of you cares most about temperatures... you might even put your hand in a plastic bag for protection.

I know wiki isnt a very reliable source for some topics but I think its right about that: "No snap freeze effect occurs because all heat must be lost through thermal radiation or the evaporation of liquids..."  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_suit#Exposure_to_space_without_a_spacesuit

Or wait it says above "Unlike on Earth, where heat can be transferred by convection to the atmosphere, in space heat can be lost only by thermal radiation or by conduction to objects in physical contact with the space suit." I think its the same for increasing temperature only by absorption of radiation and contact with other materials. So basicly a black piece of metal would get hot quite fast and you shouldnt touch it. This whole discussion is pointless with you since you have no idea about physics. You dont even made any experience in life you can use to think about that stuff.

[codemonkey70]

No.
The landing was staged to hide the alien moon bases.

Okay, the thread can be locked now.
 

[iks83]

Another thing I forgot... when I look up information about space and temperature it always says like... the spacesuit has to endure temperatures from -120 degrees to +120 degrees celsius or stuff like that. Those people doesnt seem to know what they are talking about since it always depends on the material. Its like people talking about the dark side of the moon... there is no dark side.

[Voskhod3]

Results of my highly scientific study:

Regular 3M duct tape ... one minute in a 250 degree oven



Try it yourself!

OMG!

Someone doesn't understand radiation.

You are going to get ripped apart on this one!

Right after you admit the claim in the "lighted differently" post is a crock of sh*t.

Well?

[Voskhod3]

Here's a clue for you all.... kapton and teflon.

[Voskhod3]

Here is a NASA link (call it the tape page) where they go on endlessly about "good old American duct tape" saving the day. At one point they do say that if the tape is applied inside the lander and the air 'bubbles' are carefully smoothed out, then it can be taken outside.  

I'll translate.... "the NASA page was full of stuff I didn't want to hear or consider".

[iks83]

OMG!

Someone doesn't understand radiation.

You are going to get ripped apart on this one!

Right after you admit the claim in the "lighted differently" post is a crock of sh*t.

Well?

Please just explain and dont wait for them to admit anything since I wanna know too and I don't have as much time to research on my own.

[Voskhod3]

Patience.