Author Topic: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil  (Read 21569 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline plantop14

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,690
Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« on: May 03, 2008, 09:22:58 am »
I believe our planets crude oil system is abiotic! The elites (oil side) are deceiving the world to drive up prices and control the populace by creating shortages and economic hardship!
AK47, Glock23 & Mossy590 is my family's Life Insurance policy, what is yours?

Offline sid

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 894
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2008, 09:37:16 am »
Peak oil refers to peak production ability as much as total quantity.  Trillions and trillions of barrels of oil extractable at the rate of one barrel a day hardly does the world's overall supply in the tanks much good.  It's only what we can get our hands on easily that counts.

The era of cheap oil is past, unless we come up with something to replace it as the main energy source and lessen demand for it.



Offline Dig

  • All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man.
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 63,090
    • Git Ureself Edumacated
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2008, 12:48:08 pm »
Peak oil refers to peak production ability as much as total quantity.  Trillions and trillions of barrels of oil extractable at the rate of one barrel a day hardly does the world's overall supply in the tanks much good.  It's only what we can get our hands on easily that counts.

The era of cheap oil is past, unless we come up with something to replace it as the main energy source and lessen demand for it.




Oil does not have to be abiotic to know that peak oil is a total farce.

The disinfo trolls are running around the Internet saying that...

"because oil is abiotic, peak oil does not exist"

Then the MSM gets to counter with... "because you cannot prove oil is abiotic, peak oil must exist."

abiotic allows the hegelian dialectic even though it has little necessity in proving peak oil is a total farce.

The only reason oil costs more today then it was in 1950 is because the dollar is weaker (yes 10x weaker).

The only reason that oil has been stable in price compared to gold (even though supply and technology has increased exponentially) is because of these fake wars like gulf war 1 and 2, bosnia, rwanda, oppression in venezuela, and protecting feudalists in wahabbi countries.

peak oil is a total f**king joke. anyone spreading the bullshit is eather a disinfo artist, in the industry, or lacks substantial logical reasoning skills.


BTW - check out the poll...only two questions...HEGELIAN DIALECTIC

I love it when disinfo artists make things so fricking obvious
All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline jkm1864

  • Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 329
  • I drink Cool-Aid
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2008, 01:28:46 pm »
I love how everyone in America is a expert on the oil field when the oil field probably makes up only 400,000 jobs in the US. I work in the oil field and guess what alot of people are full of total shit. We are constantly exploring for oil and natural gas so guess what it will run out at its rate of use. Now I am not saying that it will not come back I'm just saying that it will run out with the constant use if not given time to replemish its self. I work as a surveyor meaning the company I work with looks for oil plus I am involved in the laying of the lines, platforms, & pretty much everything in the gulf of mexico. I will not go along with the idea that oil is not going to run out and I will not take the oil companies view of its running out real quick. I see the platforms built and new pipelines built every year. We are using up the reserves on the gulf slope and are having to drill in deeper and deeper water due to that. I think its interesting that they have found huge reserves off of the shelf but it will not cause the price to drop. You need to understand its a oil cartel and its in their best interest to keep prices up.

Offline sid

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 894
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2008, 02:09:49 pm »
Oil does not have to be abiotic to know that peak oil is a total farce.


Sane, if oil is not abiotic then peak oil is a truth.  Non abiotic oil means there are X number of gallons of oil on the planet as a fixed resource,  it does not regenerate or replenish, and anything over 50% of X means peak oil has been reached.  After that point, there is less and less and less oil available.

Perhaps you meant to say this differently?

Offline Dig

  • All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man.
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 63,090
    • Git Ureself Edumacated
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2008, 04:13:48 pm »
Sane, if oil is not abiotic then peak oil is a truth.  Non abiotic oil means there are X number of gallons of oil on the planet as a fixed resource,  it does not regenerate or replenish, and anything over 50% of X means peak oil has been reached.  After that point, there is less and less and less oil available.

Perhaps you meant to say this differently?

Uh, even if it is a finite amount, 50% of X (as you put it) may not be reached for over 100 million years even with demand at 100,000% of what it is today.  Therefore it still may not be abiotic, yet the theory that it has/will "peak" within the next 50 generations (should be enough time to "re-invent" the numerous alternative energy methods in existence today) is a total farce.

Of course if someone is completely conditioned into the Hegelian Dialectic system of logic, this may be difficult to understand.
All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline sid

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 894
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2008, 05:23:08 pm »
Sane,

How do you economically extract oil form very, very deep deposits or shale formations?  Even surface oil shale produces very expensive oil by the time you get it to market.  We're confined to working within certain economic constraints.  At 1,000, or maybe 10,000, dollars a barrel there are huge amounts of oil available.  At 100 a barrel, there are far lesser amounts available.  At 10 dollars a barrel there is none.

"Peak" oil may be ill defined as to when, but peak cheap oil has already been reached and passed.

Offline Dig

  • All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man.
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 63,090
    • Git Ureself Edumacated
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2008, 05:39:22 pm »
Sane,

How do you economically extract oil form very, very deep deposits or shale formations?  Even surface oil shale produces very expensive oil by the time you get it to market.  We're confined to working within certain economic constraints.  At 1,000, or maybe 10,000, dollars a barrel there are huge amounts of oil available.  At 100 a barrel, there are far lesser amounts available.  At 10 dollars a barrel there is none.

"Peak" oil may be ill defined as to when, but peak cheap oil has already been reached and passed.

In Venezuela it is twelve cents a gallon.

That is with a devaluated dollar.

Over the past 10 years oil prices have remained constant when compared to gold.

Oil prices are not rising (if we did not go to Iraq the price would be cheaper), the dollar however is being devalued to make it look like oil is scarce.  The problem is that food prices (also tied to the dollar) is also rising.  Rockefeller (controller of the Fed Reserve and #1 proponent of devaluing the dollar) is forcing the MSM to run bullshit stories about how oil prices are driving up food prices.  This is of course a complete lie.  The devalued dollar is raising food prices (and prices of many other things).  This is simply a wealth annexation by the Federal Reserve.  They are devaluing the dollar to extract wealth from the middle class.  They have been doing it for 100 years.  They are blaming false enemies like peak oil and subprime rates.  The Fed controls the value of the dollar (via loans and lower interest rates) and the subprime loan mess.  The whole thing is absurd, there is inflation not peak oil. 
All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline sid

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 894
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2008, 05:48:31 pm »
Prices are up heavily in relation to the dollar, but they are also up in relation to the Euro which is gaining value.  It is down in no currency.

Oil is also up in Gold.  Go back and plot oil and gold prices for this century and you will see that oil has increased faster than gold.

Offline Dig

  • All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man.
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 63,090
    • Git Ureself Edumacated
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2008, 08:55:19 pm »
Prices are up heavily in relation to the dollar, but they are also up in relation to the Euro which is gaining value.  It is down in no currency.

Oil is also up in Gold.  Go back and plot oil and gold prices for this century and you will see that oil has increased faster than gold.

I said 10 years (about the time the whole Peak Oil Bullshit started taking off).  The past 100 years?  Well demand went from 0 to higher than zero so of course price went up.  Wheras the demand for gold (per capita) has remained relatively constant in the past 3,000 years. 

Please use logical reasoning when presenting an argument.

Thanks
All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline plantop14

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,690
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2008, 01:07:04 am »



BTW - check out the poll...only two questions...HEGELIAN DIALECTIC

I love it when disinfo artists make things so fricking obvious
[/quote]
Sane, I do not know if you are talking about me (HEGELIAN DIALECTIC/disinfo artists) but it sure sounds like it! The poll is one question w/ two choices to pick or choose! To clarify what I meant by peak oil (I must be a dumb ass, not a professional writer) is : A. is oil created from fossils over millions of years or B. is oil simply created deep inside the earth from chemical reactions (the core, extreme heat and pressure, magma, etc....), a very simple question that I obviously made sound a lot different! Just wondering what other people thought, that's all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a disinfo artist, if you were talking to/about me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
AK47, Glock23 & Mossy590 is my family's Life Insurance policy, what is yours?

Offline Dig

  • All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man.
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 63,090
    • Git Ureself Edumacated
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2008, 08:07:34 am »


BTW - check out the poll...only two questions...HEGELIAN DIALECTIC

I love it when disinfo artists make things so fricking obvious

Sane, I do not know if you are talking about me (HEGELIAN DIALECTIC/disinfo artists) but it sure sounds like it! The poll is one question w/ two choices to pick or choose! To clarify what I meant by peak oil (I must be a dumb ass, not a professional writer) is : A. is oil created from fossils over millions of years or B. is oil simply created deep inside the earth from chemical reactions (the core, extreme heat and pressure, magma, etc....), a very simple question that I obviously made sound a lot different! Just wondering what other people thought, that's all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a disinfo artist, if you were talking to/about me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By confining an argument to two opposing views, you allow for a Hegelian Dialectic.  In this realm, a clear view of the obvious issues is obstructed.

The issue here is control of energy.  Oil does not have to be abiotic to prove that powerful people are purposefully creating the falsity that oil is scarce.

Oil can be finite, yet the reserves could last over 1 Billion years.  The clear view of the obvious is that we are being deprived access to energy on purpose as a method of control.

The wars are to drive up prices.

The corn ethenol BS is also to drive up prices of energy.

It has become so obvious the lies perpetuated all around us.

Peak Oil does not exist because we are far from any identifiable peak.  Whether it is abiotic or not is immaterial and allows control over peak oil discussions that could hinder an overwhelming awakening to truth.

All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline sid

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 894
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2008, 08:31:53 am »
I said 10 years (about the time the whole Peak Oil Bullshit started taking off).  The past 100 years?  Well demand went from 0 to higher than zero so of course price went up.  Wheras the demand for gold (per capita) has remained relatively constant in the past 3,000 years. 

Please use logical reasoning when presenting an argument.

Thanks
Well, show that the per capita demand for gold has remained relatively constant.

I doubt that you can, but for your statement here to be ov any value at all, you must do this.  I seriously doubt that you can, since there are far fewer people possessing or seeking gold today than at any time in the past when gold was widely used for money (i.e.,  In 1920 virtually ever American either had or sought gold.    Today, only a small percentage either owns or seeks gold.)

You appear to be making up your arguments to support a point, something that has many different names for it.  I'll assume you have just been fed poor information though, and never questioned it or sought to verify it.

If you're going to bring logical reasoning to the front, I'd suggest you do a bit of study on logic, as you're arguments are self contradictory and illogical (as in claiming that the price of oil in gold was up in one post and then stating why it was not in another.)  For a quick study on the use of logic I'd suggest http://www.kfs.org/~jonathan/witt/tlph.html,  it will aid in oprganizing your thinking along logical lines.

Offline Dig

  • All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man.
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 63,090
    • Git Ureself Edumacated
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2008, 09:54:52 am »
Today, only a small percentage either owns or seeks gold.

What?

Really?

A small percentage of people own or seeks gold?

What do you call a small percentage?  50%? 60%? 70%? 

Let us say you are right and I am wrong.  That means that gold is at $840 an ounce with lower (rather than my argument of constant) demand.

This would translate to even higher inflation rather than lower inflation (using gold as one of the commodities to account for inflation) over the past 10 years.

Also, your obvious disinfo on the "gas at $10 a gallon" thread ( http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=37705.40 ) is making you highly suspect of purposefully distorting the actual financial crisis to members of this forum. 
All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline sid

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 894
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #14 on: May 04, 2008, 10:01:46 am »
What?

Really?

A small percentage of people own or seeks gold?

What do you call a small percentage?  50%? 60%? 70%? 

Let us say you are right and I am wrong.  That means that gold is at $840 an ounce with lower (rather than my argument of constant) demand.

This would translate to even higher inflation rather than lower inflation (using gold as one of the commodities to account for inflation) over the past 10 years.

Also, your obvious disinfo on the "gas at $10 a gallon" thread ( http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=37705.40 ) is making you highly suspect of purposefully distorting the actual financial crisis to members of this forum. 
Sane, you are the one claiming an increased per capita demand for gold.

If you make this claim, you should be ready, willing, and able to prove it, not being able to do so without having the figures available.

You haven't, I say it's because you can't.

Since you're reduced to calling me a "liar" in effect rather than address my posts with anything of substantive or supporting nature, I'm assuming you are just making stuff up and hoping to keep anyone from noticing it by attacking me on a personal basis.

Argumentum ad hominem, hardly befitting of someone that claims to be looking for truth.  You're better than that, live up to your potential.

Offline Dig

  • All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man.
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 63,090
    • Git Ureself Edumacated
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #15 on: May 04, 2008, 10:28:20 am »
Sane, you are the one claiming an increased per capita demand for gold.

If you make this claim, you should be ready, willing, and able to prove it, not being able to do so without having the figures available.

You haven't, I say it's because you can't.

Since you're reduced to calling me a "liar" in effect rather than address my posts with anything of substantive or supporting nature, I'm assuming you are just making stuff up and hoping to keep anyone from noticing it by attacking me on a personal basis.

Argumentum ad hominem, hardly befitting of someone that claims to be looking for truth.  You're better than that, live up to your potential.

actually I presented the argument saying that you are right and I am wrong.  Since this may be difficult to find unbiased perspective on it, I am conceding to your argument that demand has lowered over the past 10 years (or 100 years).  Either way, your equally unfounded (in this thread) supposition that demand has lowered actually shows an increase in the theft of wealth from the middle class to international elites.

If prices are so high with a relative decrease in demand, then inflation must be growing at a higher rate than if demand was constant.

All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline sid

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 894
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #16 on: May 04, 2008, 10:36:00 am »
actually I presented the argument saying that you are right and I am wrong.  Since this may be difficult to find unbiased perspective on it, I am conceding to your argument that demand has lowered over the past 10 years (or 100 years).  Either way, your equally unfounded (in this thread) supposition that demand has lowered actually shows an increase in the theft of wealth from the middle class to international elites.

If prices are so high with a relative decrease in demand, then inflation must be growing at a higher rate than if demand was constant.


We're close to agreement here, with a few detail that wouldn't be worth haggling out as they aren't all that important.

Offline Dig

  • All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man.
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 63,090
    • Git Ureself Edumacated
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #17 on: May 04, 2008, 10:44:29 am »
We're close to agreement here, with a few detail that wouldn't be worth haggling out as they aren't all that important.

I am not sure what agreement we are at so I will state the main point of my thesis:

Inflation is the cause of increased prices over the past 50 years rather than scarcity of oil.  This inflation has also stolen over 50% of the average American Citizen's purchasing power over the past 38 years.  The cause of the inflation and theft of trillions in wealth is the Federal Reserve and their control of monetary policy.  The Federal Reserve is a private institution headed by International Bankers including Rockefeller and Rothschild and are unconstitutionally protected by corrupt politicians, corporate leaders, corrupt policies and other influential entities.

The idea of peak oil is just another false distraction to hide the above facts and protect the true criminals from facing justice.
All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline plantop14

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,690
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #18 on: May 04, 2008, 10:45:17 am »
Sane and Sid, come on ya'll, you two seem like smart people ;)! As far as the poll question goes, it was just a very, very simple question! I was just wondering what other people thought about the concept of oil creation. You know, like we've been taught all the way thru elementary, jr. high and high school that oil is a fossil fuel! I personally can see some of the price manipulation and some of the games they are playing! Anyway, I didn't mean to use Hegelian Dialectic, if that's what I did! Like I said, I'm no speech writer, that's for sure!! :o
AK47, Glock23 & Mossy590 is my family's Life Insurance policy, what is yours?

Offline plantop14

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,690
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #19 on: May 04, 2008, 10:53:10 am »
I am not sure what agreement we are at so I will state the main point of my thesis:

Inflation is the cause of increased prices over the past 50 years rather than scarcity of oil.  This inflation has also stolen over 50% of the average American Citizen's purchasing power over the past 38 years.  The cause of the inflation and theft of trillions in wealth is the Federal Reserve and their control of monetary policy.  The Federal Reserve is a private institution headed by International Bankers including Rockefeller and Rothschild and are unconstitutionally protected by corrupt politicians, corporate leaders, corrupt policies and other influential entities.

The idea of peak oil is just another false distraction to hide the above facts and protect the true criminals from facing justice.
Sane, I'm with you 100% on that! You hit the nail on the head! ;)
AK47, Glock23 & Mossy590 is my family's Life Insurance policy, what is yours?

Offline Dig

  • All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man.
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 63,090
    • Git Ureself Edumacated
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #20 on: May 04, 2008, 11:14:56 am »
Sane and Sid, come on ya'll, you two seem like smart people ;)! As far as the poll question goes, it was just a very, very simple question! I was just wondering what other people thought about the concept of oil creation. You know, like we've been taught all the way thru elementary, jr. high and high school that oil is a fossil fuel! I personally can see some of the price manipulation and some of the games they are playing! Anyway, I didn't mean to use Hegelian Dialectic, if that's what I did! Like I said, I'm no speech writer, that's for sure!! :o

We are conditioned to think in the Hegelian Dialectic from a very early age.  It perpetuates an inherent deficiency in logically assessing complex issues.

When it was so obviously being used, I wanted to point it out and why it can cause a distraction.  If everyone simply noticed when they are using it, they may be able to highten the intellectal level of discussions on important issues in this country.  If they also noticed how much it is used on MSM, it would also help.  Watch the movie "Blue Collar" for more information on how our discussions are continually being divided into opposing arguments:  http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=38576.0
All eyes are opened, or opening, to the rights of man. The general spread of the light of science has already laid open to every view the palpable truth, that the mass of mankind has not been born with saddles on their backs, nor a favored few booted and spurred, ready to ride them legitimately

Offline trixi1

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,891
  • He is watching. Smile because Jesus is Lord.
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #21 on: May 05, 2008, 04:36:11 am »


http://www.investmentu.com/IUEL/2007/20070122.html

The Peak Oil Myth

The Investment U e-letter: Issue #630
Friday, January 22, 2007

The Peak Oil Myth… Don't Go Broke On This Popular Investing Fallacy
by Alex Green, Investment Director, The Oxford Club

At an investment conference last year, I ran into an attendee who told me he had just put his entire fortune into oil stocks. Sadly, this was just as oil was crossing the $75 mark.

"Haven't you heard about Peak Oil?" he asked, looking incredulous. "According to The Association for the Study of Peak Oil (ASPO), world oil production has already peaked. Our planet is certain to run out of fossil fuels in our lifetimes."

Whenever someone mentions the word "certain" in an economic forecast, I tend to shudder involuntarily. This time was no exception.

Peak Oil Theory goes something like this: Oil is a finite resource. Production has peaked. With the world's population surging and developing countries industrializing rapidly - especially giants like India and China - it's just a matter of time before demand outstrips supply, leading to sky-high oil prices.

That, of course, should cause oil stocks to soar. Ergo, we need to jump on energy stocks the way the Hunt brothers loaded up on silver.

I hate to be the skunk at the garden party, but there are quite a few holes in so-called Peak Oil Theory. Anyone who has bought into this idea may want to think again. It turns out that the Peak Oil Theory may actually be the peak oil myth, here's why…

Finite Resources and Peak Oil Theory

In 1930, the United States had 13 billion barrels of proven oil reserves. With those 13 billion barrels, the country fought World War II, energized the post-war economic boom, and fueled Americans' newfound love affair with the automobile. Sixty years later, how much of that 13 billion-barrel reserve do you suppose was left?

Omitting Alaska, the lower 48 states alone had proven reserves of 17 billion barrels, 31% more than in 1930.

The same thing happened in the Persian Gulf. In 1975, official reports concluded that the region had 74 billion barrels of oil. This was during the energy crisis. Americans were told that that the world had only enough fuel to last a couple more decades.

Yet by 1993, the official estimate was that Persian Gulf reserves exceeded 663 billion barrels, nine times as much as 20 years before.

"This time it's different," the Peak Oilers insist. Yet last year we saw the discovery of enormous new oil reserves in the Gulf of Mexico. And let's not forget the large-scale processing of high-quality crude from Alberta's oil sands.

A Scientist's Perspective On Peak Oil

Further raining on Peak Oil's parade is Ray Kurzweil. Scientist and author Kurzweil insists that nanotechnology will make oil obsolete within two decades.

It sounds outlandish, I know. But hear him out.

"Even though our energy needs are projected to triple within 20 years," he wrote recently, "we'll capture that .0003 of the sunlight needed to meet all of our energy needs with no use of fossil fuels, by using extremely inexpensive, highly efficient, lightweight, nano-engineered solar panels. From there, the energy will be stored in safe, highly distributed fuel cells."

"Solar power," he insists "is now providing one part in a thousand of our energy needs but that percentage is doubling every two years, which means multiplying by a thousand in 20 years. Almost all of the discussions I've seen about energy fail to consider the ability of future nanotechnology-based solutions to solve this problem. This development will be motivated not just by concern for the environment, but by the $2 trillion we spend annually on energy. This is already a major area of venture funding."

I'll concede - and my wife will happily confirm - that I'm no nanotechnologist. And clearly much of what Kurzweil says is speculative. Yet plenty of scientists, including pioneering nanotechnologist Dr. Eric Drexler, argue that Kurzweil is correct.

But even if he's wrong, higher oil prices are an incentive to explore more broadly, extract more efficiently, and continue improving technology and energy alternatives. Higher oil prices also encourage greater conservation.

Note To Oil Investors: Don't Bet the Bank

So despite the population boom and increasing industrialization, banking on oil hitting the moon anytime soon is not a particularly sound bet.

And that's a good thing. Unless, of course, you happen to be a Middle East dictator, a Venezuelan socialist… or some poor sod banking on the peak oil myth.

Good Investing,

Alex

-------------------------

I don't personally agree that it's a good thing to pay more just to get other forms of energy or other sources of oil, but I posted this because it's just one more source talking about how oil levels are changing. The peak oil boogeyman is a farce and needs to be exposed as such.

John 3:16 teaches us: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

John 14:6 says:  "I am the way the truth and the life; NO MAN cometh unto the Father BUT BY ME."

Offline trixi1

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,891
  • He is watching. Smile because Jesus is Lord.
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #22 on: May 05, 2008, 04:38:29 am »


http://www.investmentu.com/IUEL/2007/20070122.html

The Peak Oil Myth

The Investment U e-letter: Issue #630
Friday, January 22, 2007

The Peak Oil Myth… Don't Go Broke On This Popular Investing Fallacy
by Alex Green, Investment Director, The Oxford Club

At an investment conference last year, I ran into an attendee who told me he had just put his entire fortune into oil stocks. Sadly, this was just as oil was crossing the $75 mark.

"Haven't you heard about Peak Oil?" he asked, looking incredulous. "According to The Association for the Study of Peak Oil (ASPO), world oil production has already peaked. Our planet is certain to run out of fossil fuels in our lifetimes."

Whenever someone mentions the word "certain" in an economic forecast, I tend to shudder involuntarily. This time was no exception.

Peak Oil Theory goes something like this: Oil is a finite resource. Production has peaked. With the world's population surging and developing countries industrializing rapidly - especially giants like India and China - it's just a matter of time before demand outstrips supply, leading to sky-high oil prices.

That, of course, should cause oil stocks to soar. Ergo, we need to jump on energy stocks the way the Hunt brothers loaded up on silver.

I hate to be the skunk at the garden party, but there are quite a few holes in so-called Peak Oil Theory. Anyone who has bought into this idea may want to think again. It turns out that the Peak Oil Theory may actually be the peak oil myth, here's why…

Finite Resources and Peak Oil Theory

In 1930, the United States had 13 billion barrels of proven oil reserves. With those 13 billion barrels, the country fought World War II, energized the post-war economic boom, and fueled Americans' newfound love affair with the automobile. Sixty years later, how much of that 13 billion-barrel reserve do you suppose was left?

Omitting Alaska, the lower 48 states alone had proven reserves of 17 billion barrels, 31% more than in 1930.

The same thing happened in the Persian Gulf. In 1975, official reports concluded that the region had 74 billion barrels of oil. This was during the energy crisis. Americans were told that that the world had only enough fuel to last a couple more decades.

Yet by 1993, the official estimate was that Persian Gulf reserves exceeded 663 billion barrels, nine times as much as 20 years before.

"This time it's different," the Peak Oilers insist. Yet last year we saw the discovery of enormous new oil reserves in the Gulf of Mexico. And let's not forget the large-scale processing of high-quality crude from Alberta's oil sands.

A Scientist's Perspective On Peak Oil

Further raining on Peak Oil's parade is Ray Kurzweil. Scientist and author Kurzweil insists that nanotechnology will make oil obsolete within two decades.

It sounds outlandish, I know. But hear him out.

"Even though our energy needs are projected to triple within 20 years," he wrote recently, "we'll capture that .0003 of the sunlight needed to meet all of our energy needs with no use of fossil fuels, by using extremely inexpensive, highly efficient, lightweight, nano-engineered solar panels. From there, the energy will be stored in safe, highly distributed fuel cells."

"Solar power," he insists "is now providing one part in a thousand of our energy needs but that percentage is doubling every two years, which means multiplying by a thousand in 20 years. Almost all of the discussions I've seen about energy fail to consider the ability of future nanotechnology-based solutions to solve this problem. This development will be motivated not just by concern for the environment, but by the $2 trillion we spend annually on energy. This is already a major area of venture funding."

I'll concede - and my wife will happily confirm - that I'm no nanotechnologist. And clearly much of what Kurzweil says is speculative. Yet plenty of scientists, including pioneering nanotechnologist Dr. Eric Drexler, argue that Kurzweil is correct.

But even if he's wrong, higher oil prices are an incentive to explore more broadly, extract more efficiently, and continue improving technology and energy alternatives. Higher oil prices also encourage greater conservation.

Note To Oil Investors: Don't Bet the Bank

So despite the population boom and increasing industrialization, banking on oil hitting the moon anytime soon is not a particularly sound bet.

And that's a good thing. Unless, of course, you happen to be a Middle East dictator, a Venezuelan socialist… or some poor sod banking on the peak oil myth.

Good Investing,

Alex

-------------------------

I don't personally agree that it's a good thing to pay more just to get other forms of energy or other sources of oil, but I posted this because it's just one more source talking about how oil levels are changing. The peak oil boogeyman is a farce and needs to be exposed as such.

John 3:16 teaches us: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

John 14:6 says:  "I am the way the truth and the life; NO MAN cometh unto the Father BUT BY ME."

Offline Hetware

  • Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 449
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #23 on: May 05, 2008, 07:00:21 am »
I believe our planets crude oil system is abiotic! The elites (oil side) are deceiving the world to drive up prices and control the populace by creating shortages and economic hardship!

I believe there is absolutely no evidence supporting the abiotic oil hypothesis, and I have seen clear evidence of biotic production of black oil.  I grew up in marshland.  Rotting biomass produces petroleum.

Now, I believe peak oil is an irrational panic, and is partially orchestrated by the elites who stand to benefit from the lemming stampede.


Offline Biggs

  • Moderator
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7,440
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #24 on: August 01, 2008, 06:47:00 am »
oldie but goodie - well worth a read if you are not familiar with abiotic oil

Oil Fields Are Refilling...Naturally - Sometimes Rapidly
 

There Are More Oil Seeps Than All The Tankers On Earth

By Robert Cooke

Staff Writer - Newsday.com

http://www.rense.com/general63/refil.htm

4-10-5

 
Deep underwater, and deeper underground, scientists see surprising hints that gas and oil deposits can be replenished, filling up again, sometimes rapidly.
 
Although it sounds too good to be true, increasing evidence from the Gulf of Mexico suggests that some old oil fields are being refilled by petroleum surging up from deep below, scientists report. That may mean that current estimates of oil and gas abundance are far too low.
 
Recent measurements in a major oil field show "that the fluids were changing over time; that very light oil and gas were being injected from below, even as the producing [oil pumping] was going on," said chemical oceanographer Mahlon "Chuck" Kennicutt. "They are refilling as we speak. But whether this is a worldwide phenomenon, we don't know."
 
Also not known, Kennicutt said, is whether the injection of new oil from deeper strata is of any economic significance, whether there will be enough to be exploitable. The discovery was unexpected, and it is still "somewhat controversial" within the oil industry.
 
Kennicutt, a faculty member at Texas A&M University, said it is now clear that gas and oil are coming into the known reservoirs very rapidly in terms of geologic time. The inflow of new gas, and some oil, has been detectable in as little as three to 10 years. In the past, it was not suspected that oil fields can refill because it was assumed the oil formed in place, or nearby, rather than far below.
 
According to marine geologist Harry Roberts, at Louisiana State University, "petroleum geologists don't accept it as a general phenomenon because it doesn't happen in most reservoirs. But in this case, it does seem to be happening. You have a very leaky fault system that does allow it to migrate in. It's directly connected to an oil and gas generating system at great depth."
 
What the scientists suspect is that very old petroleum -- formed tens of millions of years ago -- has continued migrating up into reservoirs that oil companies have been exploiting for years. But no one had expected that depleted oil fields might refill themselves.
 
Now, if it is found that gas and oil are coming up in significant amounts, and if the same is occurring in oil fields around the globe, then a lot more fuel than anyone expected could become available eventually. It hints that the world may not, in fact, be running out of petroleum.
 
"No one has been more astonished by the potential implications of our work than myself," said analytic chemist Jean Whelan, at the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution, in Massachusetts. "There already appears to be a large body of evidence consistent with ... oil and gas generation and migration on very short time scales in many areas globally," she wrote in the journal Sea Technology.
 
"Almost equally surprising," she added, is that "there seem to be no compelling arguments refuting the existence of these rapid, dynamic migration processes."
 
The first sketchy evidence of this emerged in 1984, when Kennicutt and colleagues from Texas A&M University were in the Gulf of Mexico trying to understand a phenomenon called "seeps," areas on the seafloor where sometimes large amounts of oil and gas escape through natural fissures.
 
"Our first discovery was with trawls. We knew it was an area of massive seepage, and we expected that the oil seeps would poison everything around" the site. But they found just the opposite.
 
"On the first trawl, we brought up over two tons of stuff. We had a tough time getting the nets back on board because they were so full" of very odd-looking sea.floor creatures, Kennicutt said. "They were long strawlike things that turned out to be tube worms.
 
"The clams were the first thing I noticed," he added. "They were pretty big, like the size of your hand, and it was obvious they had red blood inside, which is unusual. And these long tubes -- 3, 4 and 5 feet long -- we didn't know what they were, but they started bleeding red fluid, too. We didn't know what to make of it."
 
The biologists they consulted did know what to make of it. "The experts immediately recognized them as chemo-synthetic communities," creatures that get their energy from hydrocarbons -- oil and gas -- rather than from ordinary foods. So these animals are very much like, but still different from, recently discovered creatures living near very hot seafloor vent sites in the Pacific, Atlantic and other oceans.
 
The difference, Kennicutt said, is that the animals living around cold seeps live on methane and oil, while the creatures growing near hot water vents exploit sulfur compounds in the hot water.
 
The discovery of abundant life where scientists expected a deserted seafloor also suggested that the seeps are a long-duration phenomenon. Indeed, the clams are thought to be about 100 years old, and the tube worms may live as long as 600 years, or more, Kennicutt said.
 
The surprises kept pouring in as the researchers explored further and in more detail using research submarines. In some areas, the methane-metabolizing organisms even build up structures that resemble coral reefs.
 
It has long been known by geologists and oil industry workers that seeps exist. In Southern California, for example, there are seeps near Santa Barbara, at a geologic feature called Coal Oil Point. And, Roberts said, it's clear that "the Gulf of Mexico leaks like a sieve. You can't take a submarine dive without running into an oil or gas seep. And on a calm day, you can't take a boat ride without seeing gigantic oil slicks" on the sea surface.
 
Roberts added that natural seepage in places like the Gulf of Mexico "far exceeds anything that gets spilled" by oil tankers and other sources.
 
"The results of this have been a big surprise for me," said Whelan. "I never would have expected that the gas is moving up so quickly and what a huge effect it has on the whole system."
 
Although the oil industry hasn't shown great enthusiasm for the idea -- arguing that the upward migration is too slow and too uncommon to do much good -- the search for new oil and gas supplies already has been affected, Whelan and Kennicutt said. Now, companies scan the sea surface for signs of oil slicks that might point to new deposits.
 
"People are using airplane surveys for the slicks and are doing water column fluorescence measurements looking for the oil," Whelan said. "They're looking for the sources of the seeps and trying to hook that into the seismic evidence" normally used in searching for buried oil.
 
Similar research on known oil basins in the North Sea is also under way, and "that oil is very interesting. There are absolutely marvelous pictures of coral reefs which formed from seepage [of gas] from North Sea reservoirs," Whelan said.
 
Analysis of the ancient oil that seems to be coming up from deep below in the Gulf of Mexico suggests that the flow of new oil "is coming from deeper, hotter formations" and is not simply a lateral inflow from the old deposits that surround existing oil fields, she said. The chemical composition of the migrating oil also indicates it is being driven upward and is being altered by highly pressurized gases squeezing up from below.
 
This upwelling phenomenon, Whelan noted, fits into a classic analysis of the world's oil and gas done years ago by geochemist-geologist John Hunt. He suggested that less than 1 percent of the oil that is generated at depth ever makes it into exploitable reservoirs. About 40 percent of the oil and gas remains hidden, spread out in the tiny pores and fissures of deep sedimentary rock formations.
 
And "the remaining 60 percent," Whelan said, "leaks upward and out of the sediment" via the numerous seeps that occur globally.
 
Also, the idea that dynamic migration of oil and gas is occurring implies that new supplies "are not only charging some reservoirs at the present time, but that a huge fraction of total oil and gas must be episodically or continuously bypassing reservoirs completely and seeping from surface sediments on a relatively large scale," Whelan explained.
 
So far, measurements involving biological and geological analysis, plus satellite images, "show widespread and pervasive leakage over the entire northern slope of the Gulf of Mexico," she added.
 
"For example, Ian MacDonald at Texas A&M has published some remarkable satellite photographs of oil slicks which go for miles in the Gulf of Mexico in areas where no oil production is occurring." Before this research in oil basins began, she added, "changes in reservoired oils were not suspected, so no reliable data exists on how widespread the phenomenon might be in the Gulf Coast or elsewhere."
 
The researchers, especially the Texas team, have been working on this subject for almost 15 years in collaboration with oil industry experts and various university scientists. Their first focus was on the zone called South Eugene Island block 330, which is 150 miles south of New Orleans. It is known as one of the most productive oil and gas fields in the world. The block lies in water more than 300 feet deep.
 
As a test, the researchers attempted to drill down into a known fault zone that was thought to be a natural conduit for new petroleum. The drilling was paid for by the U.S. Department of Energy.
 
Whelan recalled that as the drill dug deeper and deeper, the project seemed to be succeeding, but then it abruptly ended in failure. "We were able to produce only a small amount of oil before the fault closed, like a giant straw," probably because reducing the pressure there allowed the fissure to collapse.
 
In addition to the drilling effort and the inspection of seeps, Whelan and her colleagues reported that three-dimensional seismic profiles of the underground reservoirs commonly show giant gas plumes coming from depth and disrupting sediments all the way to the surface.
 
This also shows that in an area west of the South Eugene Island area, a giant gas plume originates from beneath salt about 15,000 feet down and then disrupts the sediment layers all the way to the surface. The surface expression of this plume is very large -- about 1,500 feet in diameter. One surprise, Whelan said, was that the gas plume seems to exist outside of faults, the ground fractures, which at present are the main targets of oil exploration.
 
It is suspected that the process of upward migration of petroleum is driven by natural gas that is being continually produced both by deeply buried bacteria and from oil being broken down in the deeper, hotter layers of sediment. The pressures and heat at great depth are thought to be increasing because the ground is sinking -- subsiding -- as a result of new sediments piling up on top. The site is part of the huge delta formed over thousands of years by the southward flow of the massive Mississippi River. Like other major deltas, the Mississippi's outflow structure is continually being built from sands, muds and silts washed off the continent.
 
Analysis of the oil being driven into the reservoirs suggests they were created during the so-called Jurassic and Early Cretaceous periods (100 million to 150 million years ago), even before the existing basin itself was formed. This means the source rock is buried and remains invisible to seismic imaging beneath layers of salt.
 
In studying so-called biomarkers in the oil, Whelan said, it was concluded that the oil is closely related to other very old oils, implying that it "was probably generated very early and then remained trapped at depth until recently." And, she added, other analyses "show that this oil must have remained trapped at depths and temperatures much greater than those of the present-day producing reservoirs."
 
At great depth, where the heat and pressure are high enough, she explained, methane is produced by oil being "cracked," and production of gas "is able to cause sufficient pressure to periodically open the fracture system and allow upward fluid flow of methane, with entrapment of oil in its path."
 
Copyright © 2002, Newsday, Inc.
STOP THE KILLING NOW
END THE CRIMINAL SIEGE OF GAZA - FREE PALESTINE!!!!!!!

Offline youtubeocean

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 20
  • Peak Oil Is Real
    • YoutubeOcean
Re: Peak Oil vs Abiotic Oil
« Reply #25 on: October 23, 2008, 06:06:47 pm »
Peak Oil Is Real