HIV causes AIDS (Watch out for the NWO disinfo saying it does not)

[apex111]

whatever loser, if youre so smart answer this question
In 1983 nobody thought hiv was the cause of aids(except a couple crackpot scientists like gallo and levy) in 1986 everybody spoke as hiv as the cause of AIDS as fact, every medical school taught it was the cause, the blood supply was screened and the prestigious Intsitute of medicine dedicated 2 billion per annum for hiv research, can you supply us with the scientific papers published between 1983-86 that created this consensus, or was this consensus created by politics and not science?  Waiting for those papers.

[jimd3100]

What many don't realize is that mycoplasma was developed as a biological weapon and is slowly spreading through the population, while the New world order laughs at everyone for worrying about a harmless retrovirus hiv.
http://www.projectdaylily.com/

Here is a letter written by the founder of the website you just cited.
http://www.lightparty.com/Health/Nicholson.html

Letter from Professor Garth Nicolson,


Chair of Cancer Research, University of Texas,


to Mr. Gary Wade, National Health Federation.

 

Professor Garth L. Nicolson,
David Bruton Jr. Chair in Cancer Research
Department of Tumor Biology (108)
The University of Texas M.D.
Anderson Cancer Center Houston, Texas 77030
Phone (713) 792-7481 Fax (713) 794-0209
June 7, 1996

Mr. Gary Wade
National Health Federation
212 W. Foothill Blvd.
Monrovia, CA 91016   Tel: 818-357-2181
 

Dear Mr. Wade:

I have attached some information, reprints and preprints on GWI and the possible use of CBW during Operation Desert Storm. For your information, we have found so far that about one-half of the GWI patients (and 2/2 British ODS veterans) have an invasive mycoplasma infection that can be successfully treated with antibiotics, such as doxycycline (Nicolson, G.L. and Nicolson, N.L. Doxycyclæ0treatment and Desert Storm JAMA, 273:618-619; Nicolson, G.L. and Nicolson, N.L. Diagnosis and treatment of mycoplasmal infections in Persian Gulf War Illness - CFIDS patients. Int. J. Occup. Med. Immunol. Tox. 5:69- 78; 1996) (200 mg/d for 6 wk per course; several courses are usually required, similar to Lyme Disease), Cipro (1,000 - 1,500 mg/d) or Zithromas (500 mg/d).

We have developed new diagnostic procedures (Gene Tracking and forensic PCR) for analysis of the types of mycoplasmas found in GWI, and these may also be useful and informative for soldiers with GWI-CFIDS and some civilians with CFIDS (These diseases are essentially the same --(Nicolson, G.L. and Nicolson, N.L. Chronic fatigue illness and Operation Desert Storm. J. Occup. Environ. Med. 38:14-16, 1996). I have included these reprints with this letter.

Currently we are using a test called Gene Tracking to identify unusual DNA sequences unique to mycoplasmas in blood leukocytes (Nicolson, N.L. and Nicolson, G.L. The isolation, purification and analysis of specific gene-containing nucleoproteins and nucleoprotein complexes. Meth. Mol. Genet. 5:281-298, 1994).

We have adapted forensic PCR procedures for the accurate determination of invasive mycoplasmic infections, and this may be useful for clinical labs that are struggling with antibody approaches for detecting mycoplasmas.

What is interesting about these mycoplasmas is that they contain retroviral DNA sequences (such as the HIV-1 env gene but not other HIV genes), suggesting that they may have been modified to make them more pathogenic and more difficult to detect. It's also interesting that we have been working with a support group of Texas Department of Corrections employees that were apparently exposed to the same unusual mycoplasma before ODS, possible during a Defense Department-supported vaccine testing program in selected state prisons here in Texas.

One of the biotech companies involved in this TDC study (in Houston, TX) had US Army contracts to study mycoplasmas (this is indicated in their publications on the subject) and has been named in lawsuits as selling or supplying CBW to Iraq.

We have been able to assist thousands of soldiers recover from a life-threatening disease that is caused by invasive mycoplasma infections. We have learned that over 6,000 US soldiers have died of infectious diseases and chemical exposure in Operation Desert Storm. I suspect that this is being hidden from the American public for political, economic and legal reasons.


Sincerely,

Garth L. Nicolson, Ph.D.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pathogen

[apex111]

They never published on that and another lab refuted that claim, the foremost expert on mycoplasma incognitus is Dr. Lo from the armed forces institute of pathology, he published on it, killing every animal he inoculated, the mysterious Dr. Lo never mentioned hiv being part of it, afterall he discovered it, I suggest people read the Nicolsons barely fictionilized book based on confidential sources they had that it was part of the bioweapons program and being illegallly tested, and how those people know that hiv is harmless.  http://www.projectdaylily.com/

[netizen_x]

Here is a letter written by the founder of the website you just cited.
http://www.lightparty.com/Health/Nicholson.html

Letter from Professor Garth Nicolson,


Chair of Cancer Research, University of Texas,


to Mr. Gary Wade, National Health Federation.

Off - topic. The question is "Does HIV even cause AIDS": not "Does Mycoplasma cause AIDS".

Please provide us some truth about the question

[netizen_x]

In 1983 nobody thought hiv was the cause of aids(except a couple crackpot scientists like gallo and levy)

consensus, or was this consensus created by politics and not science?  Waiting for those papers.

The HIV causes AIDS hypothesis was invented by Gallo who stole it from the French guy. The hypothesis was rendered in a press - release, not in a scientific journal. HIV=AIDS is a popular hypothesis, not a scientific one. Please prove otherwise.

[jimd3100]

Hey, why don't you AIDS Geniuses warn Alex Jones he has a shill working for him instead of wasting your time on this message board? Paul Watson writes articles that reach much more people than this thread.
Don't you think you should be warning Alex Jones that he has a shill working for him?
Paul Watson recently wrote this article in which he makes it very clear he believes HIV and AIDS are real and HIV causes AIDS.
http://prisonplanet.com/articles/april2008/041508_donation_ban.htm

With sentences such as...
the fact that changing the law would mean 50 percent more people would have their lives ruined and possibly die from the scourge of HIV matters little in comparison to ensuring that homosexuals aren't "offended".  and ... Cold hard facts and a sober understanding that overturning the ban would see HIV and AIDS skyrocket is not good enough for homosexual lobbyists
Obviously he thinks HIV and AIDS are real and not to healthy for you. We all know he does research before writing his articles, so he has to know what geniuses you guys are and that HIV and AIDS aren't real and if they are they are probably good for you. So the only explanation is he is a shill or an idiot. Oh...wait...actually there is one other explanation. Maybe Watson isn't as f**kin stupid as you are? Ya think?

In fact, you're so f**kin stupid that you are a shill for drug companies and eugenics and don't Even know it.
How does it feel to be manipulated?

[netizen_x]

Ive seen it too. Ive seen people reduce their viral load to 'non-existant' through the drugs they have now, and live 30 years after diagnosis. this did not happen before.

Interesting logic. Using the 'drugs they have now' you have witnessed people live '30 years after diagnosis'.

Did they avoid drugs for the previous 30 years?.

Please explain.

[netizen_x]

In fact, you're so f**kin stupid that you are a shill for drug companies and eugenics and don't Even know it.
How does it feel to be manipulated?

You tell me.

[apex111]

 Dr shyh Lo and Luc montagnier felt hiv was harmless without the mycoplasma co factor, Duesberg thinks its hard core fasttrack drug using lifestyle and azt, and malnutrition etc in africa, the intro to Dr. Culshaws book "science sold out" says it best, AIDS is likely the combination of many factors, and its ignorant to just focus on one thing.  "AIDS is much more complicated than hiv"  Dr shyh ching lo MD PHD armed forces institute of pathology 1990

[jimd3100]

Dr shyh Lo and Luc montagnier felt hiv was harmless without the mycoplasma co factor, Duesberg thinks its hard core fasttrack drug using lifestyle and azt, and malnutrition etc in africa, the intro to Dr. Culshaws book "science sold out" says it best, AIDS is likely the combination of many factors, and its ignorant to just focus on one thing.  "AIDS is much more complicated than hiv"  Dr shyh ching lo MD PHD armed forces institute of pathology 1990

I don't need to debunk Culshaws' pamphlet that you call a book. It's already been done...
http://www.aidstruth.org/science-sold-out.pdf

Keep being a shill for the eugenics and large drug companies. How does it feel to be manipulated?

[apex111]

whatever Culshaws book has never been debunked by anybody, damn good read "science sold out" and the aids truth site is a joke

[LakeshoreBaby]

Whars the beef?

[Sonja]

Whars the beef?

Exactly! Until you have it. Then you have a moment to prove it isnt real. You can experiment with your OWN life.
Cancer can allegedly be cured by laetril, but most have died under this treatment, as have Most on chemo and radiation.

If its your body, you can screw around, in the meantime i recommend not taking the risk.

Interesting logic. Using the 'drugs they have now' you have witnessed people live '30 years after diagnosis'.

Did they avoid drugs for the previous 30 years?.

Please explain.

NO! And I should have said 20 years, but AIDs has been around so long now I cant even gauge time. I know people who are living well now, HIV viral load to zero and I knew then, they all died, in droves.
Can i ask, how many people have any of you known that got sick from this, can any of you name just one, or is it just some speculation?
Does one of you know ONE person, or ever been even close?

[Femacamper]

I think this issue is a distraction. Obviously, we've got compelling evidence on both sides of the argument. But no solid, clear-cut conclusion.

I say agree to disagree and leave it at that.

Come on everybody, we got some traitors to WeAreChange! (Is that a verb, yet?)

[LakeshoreBaby]

No.  There is no evidence that HIV has been isolated in human tissue, and that HIV causes AIDS.  Post the medical studies that prove it. 

[netizen_x]

HIV is a mind virus.

The truth will set you free.

[apex111]

AIDS is a complex disease, focusing solely on one agent and ignoring all others is the HIV dogmatists crime against humanity

[jimd3100]

There is no evidence that HIV has been isolated in human tissue, and that HIV causes AIDS.

HIV is a mind virus.

This is a fraud that can be won

So for those that didn't catch it, these are known as shills.....
A shill is an associate of a person selling goods or services or a political group, who pretends no association to the seller/group and assumes the air of an enthusiastic customer. The intention of the shill is, using crowd psychology, to encourage others unaware of the set-up to purchase said goods or services or support the political group's ideological claims. Shills are often employed by confidence artists. In the UK the term plant is also used.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shill

You see how they post? It's getting pretty obvious isn't it? I even have come out and said it.  So don't listen to me, here's someone else who thinks you're shills for the eugentics and drug companies.

He is Dr Horowitcz and he was just on the Alex Jones show a couple of days ago, and here is what he said in an interview....
     However, there are many people who, I believe, are simply misguided. They promote the idea that HIV has nothing to do with AIDS, and that the entire pandemic is the result of risky lifestyles and prescription medicines. Many of their arguments are valid including their criticism of the many false positives derived from highly questionable HIV tests.

But most of these naysayers fail to gather all the related data, including the socioeconomic, political, and scientific correlates and antecedents to this form of genocide. They fail to realize the primary source of this thesis is Dr. Peter Duesberg, who is heavily incriminated for his role in developing these specific types of never-before-seen leukemia-lymphoma-sarcoma cancer viruses in concert with Gallo and others. These people worked on the largely funded, mostly secret, Special Virus Cancer Program that gave rise to this pandemic. I believe that if you review all the evidence with an open mind, you will conclude as I have that Dr. Duesberg is an exceptional counterintelligence propagandist, covering up his own culpability.

BlackElectorate.com: Your origin of AIDS thesis "indicts" two highly respected members of the international medical and scientific communities - Dr. Robert Gallo and Dr. Peter Duesberg. What are their roles in all of this and how do they function as agents of disinformation regarding HIV/AIDS today?

Dr. Horowitz: Dr. Gallo and Dr. Duesberg fulfill the standard Hegelian dialectic of counterintelligence propagandists. That is, Dr. Gallo's partially false thesis that HIV causes AIDS versus Dr. Duesberg's partially false thesis HIV does not cause AIDS produces "synthesis," better known as mass confusion. People tire of the debate, and tune out, as government officials operating on behalf of drug industrialists keep sticking it to humanity, literally and figuratively, in the form of genocidal vaccinations now known to have triggered AIDS and a myriad of other new plagues.
http://www.osstation.com/origin.html

This guy was just on the Alex Jones show. To bad your spokesperson for AIDS isn't real, you know the one whos baby died from AIDS, wasn't on. I wonder why?

How does it feel to be exposed?

[apex111]

Gallo=fraud who was riddled with fraud accusations throughout his career,
Horowitz= Good intentions , but no where near the expert Duesberg is, Horowitz is also crazy to accuse these 2 of conspiring to create and spread HIV.  Like I've stated previously is the mycoplasma that's the center of the bioweapons program, thats why DR. Lo from the Army has a patent called "pathogenic mycoplasma, where he killed every animal he inoculated.  www.projectdaylily.com

Scientists who have doubted the Hiv Hypothesis
Harry Rubin UCB mcb professor member of the prestigious National academy of sciences (hall of fame for scientists)
Lynn Margulis PHD Biology expert NAS member Winner of CLintons Medal Of science in 1999 professor at umass
Shyh Ching Lo MD Phd considered a scientific genius in China, Army's highest ranking infectious disease pathologist, actually autopsied AIDS patients, and couldnt find any HIV, just antibodies.
Peter Duesberg PHD member of the NAS, NIH outstanding investigator grant, UCB MCB professor, California scientist of the year recognized by everyone as the worlds leading expert of retroviruses
Kary Mullis Nobel prize winning biochemist, inventor of the PCR
Walter Gilbert Nobel prize winning Harvard microbiology professor
many more

Sorry, I find these scientists more credible and their arguments more solid than Horowitz or Gallo the fraud.

Who wouldnt doubt a hypothesis based on a virus thats only in 1/1000 cells, no animal model and a window period extended from 10 months to 10 years.  see hiv fact or fraud.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8142733917997460212&q=hiv+fact+or+fraud&ei=GJocSO2BIZHUqwOeqrC8AQ

[Dig]

     However, there are many people who, I believe, are simply misguided. They promote the idea that HIV has nothing to do with AIDS, and that the entire pandemic is the result of risky lifestyles and prescription medicines. Many of their arguments are valid including their criticism of the many false positives derived from highly questionable HIV tests.

But most of these naysayers fail to gather all the related data, including the socioeconomic, political, and scientific correlates and antecedents to this form of genocide. They fail to realize the primary source of this thesis is Dr. Peter Duesberg, who is heavily incriminated for his role in developing these specific types of never-before-seen leukemia-lymphoma-sarcoma cancer viruses in concert with Gallo and others. These people worked on the largely funded, mostly secret, Special Virus Cancer Program that gave rise to this pandemic. I believe that if you review all the evidence with an open mind, you will conclude as I have that Dr. Duesberg is an exceptional counterintelligence propagandist, covering up his own culpability.

BlackElectorate.com: Your origin of AIDS thesis "indicts" two highly respected members of the international medical and scientific communities - Dr. Robert Gallo and Dr. Peter Duesberg. What are their roles in all of this and how do they function as agents of disinformation regarding HIV/AIDS today?

Dr. Horowitz: Dr. Gallo and Dr. Duesberg fulfill the standard Hegelian dialectic of counterintelligence propagandists. That is, Dr. Gallo's partially false thesis that HIV causes AIDS versus Dr. Duesberg's partially false thesis HIV does not cause AIDS produces "synthesis," better known as mass confusion. People tire of the debate, and tune out, as government officials operating on behalf of drug industrialists keep sticking it to humanity, literally and figuratively, in the form of genocidal vaccinations now known to have triggered AIDS and a myriad of other new plagues.
http://www.osstation.com/origin.html

Thank you for that.  Reminds me of "The Men Who Stare at Goats."

The Hegelian Dialectic over the past 50 years has been a major tool in robbing our ability to separate truth from fiction.

It is almost everywhere.  Until we can discern the differences, we are weak in communicating (among ourselves) major human rights violations.  This weakness in powerful, focused mass communication allows these crimes to go on for generations.

[jimd3100]

 

HIV/AIDS patients only die after taking the drugs, something most proponents of the AIDS myth refuse to discuss.

That is a flat out lie, and only someone who has not dealt with the issue in real life would post it.

As Christine Maggiore says,.....

Christine Maggiore passed on her HIV virus to her baby and within 3 years it died of AIDS, only retards now believe her and her "AIDS isn't real" BS
http://www.aidstruth.org/ejs-coroner-report.pdf


Another shill who wants you dead or a customer of big pharma if you want to live. Protecting the source of HIV



 

[LakeshoreBaby]

Post the study jimd.

[jimd3100]

...would you stop with the fake conspiracy theories blaming, attacking and refusing to listen to people who question why billions of dollars and 25 years later NO progress has been made on AIDS?

You're a shill and post DisInfo. Anybody that has dealt with this in real life knows you are lieing as new drugs were introduced in 1996 that fight off the "imaginary" HIV and patients no longer die. You are a blatant lier, and have no knowledge on the subject other than what you get from your disinfo web sites. Makes you rather pathetic.
 

David Baltimore, a Nobel Prize winner and leading expert on the AIDS virus, told the American Association for the Advancement of Science meeting in Boston last month that no progress on a vaccine has been made since the disease was discovered 25 years ago.

Yea, that's right sherlock vaccination. But notice how you say no progress made and then use vaccination when it is an easily proven fact that progress has been made as the death rates have plummeted. Keep doing your shill work so people who are dumb enough to believe it will give money to the drug companies to keep them alive.
Progress toward treatment of your "imaginary" HIV yes. A vaccination? No
Your DIsInfo is rather poorly presented.

show me some proof of what you're saying about christine maggiore and her kid with some links to sources, i'll show you mine.  keep in mind she was diagnosed positive and then negative herself which was her first wake-up call to the AIDS myth too.

It's already been done, and it's well known she passed that imaginary virus on to her child and let it die with PCP pneumonia which is common in AIDS patients and with HIV and immune system compromise the death certificate is PCP brought on by AIDS...that's quite an impressive spokesperson for AIDS isn't real

there's a reason she's made films and given talks and is helping tons of AIDS patients wake up and she should get more credibility and a look quicker than either of us message board posters.

She is a fraud and has a dead baby to prove it. This is how disgusting you shills have gotten.

try and collect the $50,000 reward for finding the HIV virus on her http://www.aliveandwell.org/ without using trash that assumes HIV exists by making up some scientific gobbledygook.  find a picture of the HIV virus on it's own that's not a cartoon; you can't because they haven't found it.

Try reading the thread sherlock...you don't even know what you're talking about either, just like the other shills--this is all old

[Dig]

this whole thing smells like the no plane hit the towers theory.

a bunch of innuendo with frail connections.

it also serves the same purpose as the no plane theory...

say that AIDS is manmade and people are curious.  say HIV does not cause AIDS and they think you are whacked.

amazing how the M.O. with disinfo always seems the same.

[apex111]

What no planes and HIV dissidence are the same?, No planes are supported by nuts like nico haupt, some of the top scientists in the world, far more credentialed than Horowitz have doubted HIV's causal role.


Scientists who have doubted the Hiv Hypothesis
Harry Rubin UCB mcb professor member of the prestigious National academy of sciences (hall of fame for scientists)
Lynn Margulis PHD Biology expert NAS member Winner of CLintons Medal Of science in 1999 professor at umass
Shyh Ching Lo MD Phd considered a scientific genius in China, Army's highest ranking infectious disease pathologist, actually autopsied AIDS patients, and couldnt find any HIV, just antibodies.
Peter Duesberg PHD member of the NAS, NIH outstanding investigator grant, UCB MCB professor, California scientist of the year recognized by everyone as the worlds leading expert of retroviruses
Kary Mullis Nobel prize winning biochemist, inventor of the PCR
Walter Gilbert Nobel prize winning Harvard microbiology professor
Serge Lange phd  NAS member renoun professor of math at Yale
Rebbecca Culshaw phd mathmatical biologist author of "Science Sold out" Professor at U of Texas Tyler
Richard Strohman Professor emertis of MCB at Cal
Andrew Maniotis phd  Director of cell biology at University of Illinios
many more

Sorry, I find these scientists more credible and their arguments more solid than Horowitz or Gallo the fraud.  It's ridicolous to compare this theory to no planes.

Who wouldnt doubt a hypothesis based on a virus thats only in 1/1000 cells, no animal model and a window period extended from 10 months to 10 years.  see hiv fact or fraud.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8142733917997460212&q=hiv+fact+or+fraud&ei=GJocSO2BIZHUqwOeqrC8AQ

[mickswann]

I think AIDS is probably really caused by the Cell killing chemotherapy AZT, the most dangerous drug ever approved by the FDA

Its worth remembering that most of the people who contract HIV and don't go on to develop AIDS are the people who are too poor to afford AZT.
It truly is a horrible poison.

[netizen_x]

AZT.
It truly is a horrible poison.

Amen.

But still too many dying on the 'new' drugs that are being promoted now.

[jimd3100]

Amen.

But still too many dying on the 'new' drugs that are being promoted now.

Notice how the shill turned the words around..LOL...pathetic and rather obvious
And AZT isn't used anymore it's protease inhibitors, which were introduced in 1996, and coincidently that's when AIDS deaths started plumeting, because they work.

[netizen_x]

Notice how the shill turned the words around..LOL...pathetic and rather obvious
And AZT isn't used anymore it's protease inhibitors, which were introduced in 1996, and coincidently that's when AIDS deaths started plumeting, because they work.

AZT worked better. Depending on your point of view.

[apex111]

Alex did have the film hiv fact or fraud on the front page of prison planet a while back, although now he seems to beleive the hiv dogma, i'm not sure it be interesting to have Duesberg call in sometime or be a guest

[David Rothscum]

I don't know guys, it's really hard to tell. There's reason to believe the tests are inaccurate, with a lot of false positives and false negatives, and I wouldn't trust those medicines at all, but saying HIV doesn't cause AIDS reminds me of no-planes theories. It's also odd how all the people who push this are the ones involved with cancer and genetic engineering and stuff like that, it reminds me of how all the people who come out supporting no planes are former Republican government officials.

[netizen_x]

I don't know guys, it's really hard to tell.

Hard to tell, easy to sell.
The harder it is to tell, the harder we should question.
Does anybody have any actual proof, links to documents, or other data, that claims to proclaim truth, or any other documents or other kinds of evidence that HIV actually exists, let alone causes the 'syndrome' we call 'AIDS'?

Hurry up, we've been waiting for months.

[jimd3100]

Does anybody have any actual proof, links to documents, or other data, that claims to proclaim truth, or any other documents or other kinds of evidence that HIV actually exists, let alone causes the 'syndrome' we call 'AIDS'?

Hurry up, we've been waiting for months.

There's only about 84,000 documents here you can read. You can bring them to your next "No Planes/HIV isn't real meeting".
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez

[netizen_x]

There's only about 84,000 documents here you can read. You can bring them to your next "No Planes/HIV isn't real meeting".
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez

Yes and you've read them all, no doubt JimD. Thanks for the link to the official government website. Everybody knows you can trust the CDC and FDA. I like eugenics too. JimD please line up for your shots. I am not searching through about 84000 documents for a non existent study that proves HIV exists or causes AIDS. That's YOUR job. We've been waiting for months for YOU to provide these documents.

Anyone who's interested in the science of AIDS, as opposed to the religious view of AIDS as espoused by JimD, check out http://www.rethinkingaids.com/

Latest news from that site:

News Flash! April 29, 2008 — In response to conspiracy theories mentioned by the Rev. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. in his widely reported speech to the National Press Club Rethinking AIDS is making its experts available to the media for comment on the racial bias inherent in flawed HIV testing.

Reporting on this, Accuracy in Media has called for "an open and honest debate about the nature of AIDS." On April 28, 2008, Cliff Kincaid, Editor of the AIM Report, referenced the April 23rd Rethinking AIDS Day and the work of Celia Farber, writing: "24 years after HIV was declared at an April 23, 1984, Washington news conference, as the probable cause of AIDS, there is still no cure or vaccine. About $200 billion has already been spent by the U.S. Government on HIV/AIDS but investigations have found corruption in the various programs that test and distribute anti-AIDS drugs. The United Nations has been caught red-handed inflating the number of AIDS cases, even while a U.N.-backed international airline tax is being implemented country by country to spend even more money."

Recently RA President David Crowe debated Boyd Graves, who is one of the major proponents of the HIV-as-germ-weapon conspiracy theory.

[netizen_x]

HIV on Trial in Australia: Court Weighs Evidence for Claims of Isolation, Transmission and Testing
http://www.laleva.org/eng/2007/02/hiv_on_trial_in_australia_court_weighs_evidence_for_claims_of_isolation_transmission_and_testing.html

A motion for appeal in a criminal hearing in Adelaide, Australia has become the focus of international attention as fundamental claims by orthodox AIDS researchers — including the infamous Dr Robert Gallo — come under vigorous cross-examination by an attorney demanding scientific evidence that the virus exists. Top AIDS industry spokespersons from around the world have appeared in person or by satellite in Adelaide to defend the HIV hypothesis against charges by a local team of scientific and medical experts known as "The Perth Group" who asserts that two decades of AIDS research have failed to produce a purified isolate of HIV, validation of the accuracy so-called HIV tests, or proof that HIV is transmitted through bodily fluids.

Below are two news articles about the legal proceedings.
Other information about the trial and actual transcripts of testimony can be found at http://aras.ab.ca/index.php

For this week's testimony by alleged HIV discoverer Dr Robert Gallo, go directly to Gallo-Transcript.pdf Michael Geiger, a close observer of the events in Adelaide, reports being "stunned and amazed" by Gallo's statements to the court.

Geiger says, "It's difficult to tell if Gallo was defending HIV or if his testimony is a public admission of guilt."

Geiger urges transcript readers to note:
* Page 1294 where Gallo agrees that he found evidence of HIV in only 40% of the AIDS patients in his original study, and that 40% is not enough to prove HIV is the cause of AIDS:

Attorney to Gallo: "You had…48 out of 119, or 40%?"

Gallo: "I agree"

Attorney: "Do you agree that the isolation of HIV from only 40% of patients is not proof that HIV causes AIDS?"

Gallo: "I would say of course, in and of itself, 40% isolation of a new virus, I would not say is the cause."

* Page 1300 where Gallo admits to finding low percentages of HIV positivity in people with AIDS symptoms:

Attorney: "For…adults with KS, 30%; for adults…with AIDS opportunistic infections 47%. Do you accept your figures?"

Gallo: "I accept the figures."

* Page 1317 where Gallo acknowledges finding no HIV in KS lesions or in T cells, and testimony on page 1318 in which Gallo admits that "viral load" tests cannot be used to prove infection with a virus.

The language in news
articles covering the Adelaide trial speaks loudly and clearly of media prejudice in AIDS reporting. In the first of the two pieces that follow, medical and scientific experts challenging the notion that HIV has been isolated according to proper, scientific standards are branded "an organized group of HIV deniers" and lack official titles such as MD, while those being called by the court to produce evidence are referred to as "experts" with repeated references to their professional credentials.

The obvious bent of Australian coverage is at least one step up from the US media response: Not a single story on the uproar from down under has appeared in American news.

[Amishism]

Inventing the AIDS Virus - by Dr. Peter Duesberg. (1996) The most prominent and persistent critic of HIV as the cause of AIDS presents his case most exhaustively and popularly. Duesberg, himself a virologist, stoutly maintains that HIV cannot cause AIDS because it fails to meet the rules by which a virus is implicated as disease-causing. He says that the causes of AIDS in First World countries most probably are overuse of toxic drugs--by legal prescription (e.g., AZT) as well as illicit use (e.g., the nitrite inhalants known as poppers that are used to enhance sexual capability)--and multiple and repeated infections with venereal diseases; in the Third World, they are malnutrition and maladies (e.g., tuberculosis) rare in wealthy nations but still prevalent in poor ones as well as, again, substance abuse. Duesberg massively documents and cogently argues these positions but not before laying out the historic and political reasons why most members of his profession and related medical specialists seized on a viral causation for AIDS. Basically, virologists wanted another success like that with polio and, frustrated by complete failure to find viral causes for cancer, took up AIDS as the perfect challenge as well as, once HIV was discovered, a ticket for prolonging their first-class ride on the medical research gravy train.
www.helpforhiv.com

[Amishism]

The causes of AIDS in First World countries most probably are overuse of toxic drugs--by legal prescription (e.g., AZT) as well as illicit use (e.g., the nitrite inhalants known as poppers that are used to enhance sexual capability)--and multiple and repeated infections with venereal diseases;
Dr. Peter Duesberg, retrovirologist, author: Inventing the AIDS Virus
http://www.helpforhiv.com/books.htm


HIV-AIDs fiction



Two things here are completely false, that AIDs is race specific, and that AIDs is caused by HIV created in a lab somewhere, turned loose on society where we are all in danger.



What is being called AIDs is racing through a very white Russian poplution:


Russia's Aids catastrophe growing
Infection rates rocket among East European drug users


The spiralling rate of HIV infection in Russia and eastern Europe has been revealed by shocking new figures.
The annual "Aids Epidemic Update" from the United Nations and World Health Organisation estimates that more than 36m people around the world are now living with HIV or Aids.


Russia's Aids timebomb
Wednesday, 3 December, 2003
The HIV virus is still young here. The epidemic really took hold in the mid-1990s when it spread like wildfire among injecting drug users.


Russia now has one of the fastest-growing rates of HIV-infection in the world, and addicts who used infected needles still make up the vast majority of those living with the virus.



There are three prominent schools re HIV-AIDs:


#1) Official story:HIV causes AIDs for unknown reasons and pharx helps save lives.


#2) Appears to be a backup story which keeps the population reduction going and serves as a possible political football. This one is spread by papal knight Len Horowitz and the alternative media, now breaking into mainstream. That: HIV-AIDs was cooked in a military lab and is race specific. Condoms are still needed and pharx still save lives.


#3) What I believe the evidence shows to be the truth about HIV-AIDs, that: HIV does not cause AIDs, it is not an STD, and the pharx are deadly. This option brings to an end what was AIDs,pointing out these people were dying previously from drug induced low immune systems and malnutrition.


www.helpforhiv.com
free videos at this site as well as many books and personal testimony. Also pointed out is Dr. Gallo has a patent of the HIV test which has caused many false positives.

Heavyweight boxer Tommy Morrison:
Morrison Says Error in H.I.V. Test Hurt Career

www.theaidstrial.com/recinter.htm
www.virusmyth.com/aids/video
2600+ AIDS Rethinkers - doctors and professionals
http://rethinkingaids.com

[netizen_x]

Video of Press conference from October 1.

Dr Gary Null talks to Janine Roberts, investigative journalist and author of "Fear of the Invisible", the book that blew the lid off of the fraudulent science in the early Gallo papers on HIV/AIDS

http://conself.blogspot.com/2008/09/poof.html

[David Rothscum]

Can we finally put this myth to rest now? I've known about this woman for quite some time now, and how she let her daughter die. Yes, the virus exists and yes it causes AIDS. The cancer viruses exist as well, they're brought to you by the same people who brought you HIV, and yes, they really gave admittedly thousands, but probably millions of people cancer. The same people involved with these programs to search for a viruses that attacked the immune system were the first supporters of HIV denialism. That's not an argument for the denialists case, it's as much an argument for your case as former white house people pushing no planes is.
Are the big pharma treatments good for you? They're capable of extending your life, but they're not perfect, just as the methods they give us against cancer aren't perfect but can actually help cause cancer. It's a lot better than denying you have the disease though. Although Oprah and the rest of the media may tell you that just denying something happens and imagining it's better will make things better, it doesn't taking actiosn makes things better, pretending everything is wonderful makes things worse.
http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2008/12/hivaids_denialist_christine_maggiore_die.php
HIV/AIDS denialist Christine Maggiore is dead

Category: Alternative medicine • Medicine • Pseudoscience • Quackery • Skepticism/critical thinking
Posted on: December 30, 2008 12:00 PM, by Orac

Longtime readers of this blog may remember the case of Eliza Jane Scovill. For newbies and those who might not remember, I've copiously linked to posts written by me and others.

To boil it all down, three years ago a child named Eliza Jane Scovill (often called EJ) died tragically three years ago of Pneumocystis carinii pneumonia and HIV-associated encephalopathy. The reason is that her mother, Christine Maggiore, was a prominent HIV/AIDS denialist, who, after having been found to be HIV positive back in the early 1990s fell under the sway of Peter Duesberg and came to believe that HIV does not cause AIDS and that therefore she did not need to take antiretroviral drugs. She even went so far as to form an HIV/AIDS denialist/activist group known as Alive & Well AIDS Alternatives. Even worse, she imposed her pseudoscience on her child EJ. Not only did she refuse to take antiretrovirals during her pregnancy to lower the risk of maternal-fetal transmission of the virus, but she refused to have EJ tested for HIV and insisted on breastfeeding her, even though breastfeeding can transmit the virus from mother to child.

After EJ's death, the HIV/AIDS denialist cranks, aided and abetted by their allies in the blogosphere, tried very, very hard to claim that her death was not due to HIV. One in particular, a toxicologist named Dr. Mohammed Al-Bayati, read the autopsy report and tried to blame EJ's death on a reaction to antibiotics and a childhood viral illness, a claim that had no reasonable basis in science or medicine. As a result of my efforts to rebut Dr. Al-Bayati, a representative of Christine Maggiore even tried to suck me into a pseudodebate. It was one of the most bizarre incidents in the history of this blog. Even now I scratch my head when I think about it, wondering just what the heck the HIV/AIDS denialists were thinking when they tried to play me.

Unfortunately, now it appears that Maggiore's belief that HIV doesn't cause AIDS might have caught up with her. I say "might have" because we do not know. The one thing we do know is that she has died of pneumonia at the age of 52:

    On Saturday, Maggiore died at her Van Nuys home, leaving a husband, a son and many unanswered questions. She was 52.

    According to officials at the Los Angeles County coroner's office, she had been treated for pneumonia in the last six months. Because she had recently been under a doctor's care, no autopsy will be performed unless requested by the family, they said. Her husband, Robin Scovill, could not be reached for comment.

You can bet that there probably won't be an autopsy.

It is possible that Christine Maggiore, in fact, died of a community-acquired pneumonia or some other sudden cause. It happens sometimes. (Remember Joe Strummer of one of my favorite rock bands ever, The Clash? He died suddenly of a massive MI at age 50.) However, if Maggiore's cause of death had been something other than a mystery illness, seemingly a pneumonia that sounds as though it might be HIV-related, chances are that Maggiore's family would have stated plainly the cause of her death. Even though we're unlikely ever to know for sure unless Maggiore's family requests an autopsy, it's still pretty unlikely that a 52 year old died of a simple community-acquired pneumonia or dropped dead of another illness, and if it wasn't HIV-related why be so coy about it? Moreover, the fact that Maggiore had been treated for this "pneumonia" in the last six months sure sounds suspiciously as though she had developed a more chronic infection, consistent with Pneumocystis pneumonia. Assuming that's the case, which is a pretty reasonable assumption, Maggiore has now joined the list of other HIV/AIDS denialists infected with HIV who have gone to their grave claiming that their HIV does not cause AIDS, that antiretrovirals do not improve survival of HIV-positive patients even though the evidence is overwhelming that they do, and that the illness that claimed them was not due to HIV, activists such as Michael Bellefountaine and David Pasquarelli.

Of course, the HIV/AIDS denialists are out in force trying to deny that Maggiore died of HIV-related causes:

    Her supporters expressed shock Monday over her death but were highly skeptical that it was caused by AIDS. And they said it would not stop them from questioning mainstream thinking.

    "Why did she remain basically healthy from 1992 until just before her death?" asked David Crowe, who served with Maggiore for a number of years on the board of the nonprofit Rethinking AIDS. "I think it's certain that people who promote the establishment view of AIDS will declare that she died of AIDS and will attempt to use this to bring people back in line. But you can only learn so much from an unfortunate death."

    Brian Carter, who facilitated local peer groups with Maggiore, said the movement would remain strong.

    "Christine was only part of this. There is an outstanding number of prominent rethinkers, independent thinkers, doctors, scientists, lawyers who question AIDS causation."

Why did she remain "basically healthy" from 1992 until just before her death? Because, if her death was indeed due to HIV, she was clearly an outlier, and she was fortunate enough that her HIV was slow-progressing. Unfortunately for EJ and her, reality has a way of imposing itself upon you whether you believe in it or not. As for the "outstanding number of 'rethinkers,'" well, suffice it to say that that list is less than stellar. Indeed, it appears that HIV/AIDS denialists are taking a play out of the playbook of creationists by constructing lists of "experts" who "doubt" that HIV causes AIDS.

There are at least three tragedies here. First was the death of EJ at such a young age. She was sacrificed on the altar of her mother's cultish refusal to accept the overwhelming scientific consensus that HIV causes AIDS and that antiretroviral therapy can not only prolong life but decrease the risk of maternal-fetal transmission of the virus. The second is that since the mid-1990s Maggiore has done a lot to spread the pseudoscience and misinformation that claims that HIV does not cause AIDS. Such misinformation has has devastating consequences in Africa, as this article points out:

    Though they run counter to the scientific consensus about AIDS, such beliefs can have a major effect. In South Africa, where about 5.7 million people live with HIV, the government refused until 2005 to fund antiretroviral treatment, citing questions about the effectiveness of the drugs that inhibit the replication of HIV. . . Researchers from the Harvard School of Public Health calculated earlier this year that the South African government's delay in introducing treatment between 2000 and 2005 cost more than 330,000 lives in that country.

That is the largest tragedy in terms of the global effect to which Maggiore's promotion of HIV/AIDS denialism has contributed.

On a more personal level, the third tragedy is that Maggiore had another child, a son. He, fortunately, appears to have escaped having HIV transmitted to him by his mother. On the other hand, unfortunately for him, not only did his mother's delusion claim the life of his older sister three years ago, but, if indeed Maggiore did die of HIV-related complications, her premature death was potentially preventable, and her delusion also has cost him a loving mother. As Peter Staley put it:

    What should we call it? A suicide? What should we call it when a woman dies because she refuses to believe she has a treatable illness?

    And what should we call it when a woman lets her baby daughter die because she refuses to believe the baby has a treatable illness? A murder?

Maggiore's son joins the uncounted others who mourn HIV victims whose lives might have been saved or prolonged if not for the refusal to accept the science that has produced one of the greatest achievements of scientific medicine ever, the characterization of the cause of AIDS and the development of treatments that reduced HIV infection from a death sentence to a chronic disease that can be managed with medication--all within less than 20 years.

[David Rothscum]

From Wikipedia:

Born in Chicago, Illinois, Maggiore grew up in Southern California. After graduating with honors from Reseda High, she worked in advertising and marketing in Los Angeles until 1984. After traveling through Europe and North Africa in 1984, she settled in Florence, Italy, where she lived from 1985 to 1987. In 1986, Maggiore started what became a multimillion dollar import/export clothing company, Alessi International, based in Tuscany. In 1992, as part of a routine medical exam, Maggiore tested positive for HIV. A former boyfriend also tested positive.[1]

Following her diagnosis, Maggiore became involved in volunteer work for a number of AIDS charities, including AIDS Project Los Angeles, L.A. Shanti and Women at Risk. However, following some anomalous HIV test results (negative, positive and indeterminate) and subsequently an interaction with prominent AIDS denialist Peter Duesberg in 1994, she began to question whether HIV did in fact cause AIDS. Maggiore came to believe that her positive test may have been due to flu shots, pregnancy, or a common viral infection.[3]

In 1995, Maggiore left the clothing business to work as a freelance consultant for US government export programs. At the same time, she founded Alive & Well AIDS Alternatives, an organization supporting pregnant HIV-positive women who wish to avoid HIV medications for themselves or their children.[3] Maggiore herself drew criticism for breast-feeding her children;[2] breast feeding has been shown to increase the risk of mother-to-child transmission of HIV.[5][6][7]

In a 2002 article entitled My Bout of So-Called AIDS, Maggiore wrote that she had been diagnosed with a cervical condition (a "Grade 3 Pap smear with cervical dysplasia") which she wrote would qualify her for an AIDS diagnosis (in fact, although invasive cervical cancer is an AIDS-defining illness, an abnormal Pap smear has never been an AIDS-defining condition). Maggiore's doctors recommended further evaluation with colposcopy; Maggiore instead followed a naturopathic program and had a third Pap test under an assumed name performed by another doctor, which was normal.[8]

In a 2005 article in the L.A. Times, Maggiore claimed to be in excellent health without taking anti-retroviral treatment.[3] Maggiore's husband and partner, filmmaker Robin Scovill, has repeatedly tested negative despite what Maggiore describes as "a decade of normal, latex-free relations"; their son Charlie, born in 1997, has also tested negative for HIV.[2][3]

On December 27, 2008, Maggiore died. She was under a doctor's care and was being treated for pneumonia. A doctor familiar with the family suggests that anti-HIV drugs could have prevented her death, but Maggiore's fellow AIDS denialists state that her pneumonia was not related to AIDS and that she died as a result of an alternative medicine treatment.[9]

[edit] Death of Eliza Jane

Christine Maggiore chose not to take antiretroviral drugs or other measures which reduce the risk of mother-to-child transmission of HIV during her pregnancies.[4][10] However, given the known and unknown risks of antiretroviral use in pregnancy, National Institutes of Health guidelines state that the final decision regarding their use "should be made by the woman after discussion with her health care provider about the known and unknown benefits and risks of therapy" in a "noncoercive" environment.[11] Maggiore also breast-fed her children, despite evidence that breast-feeding can also transmit HIV from mother to child. Her youngest daughter, Eliza Jane, was never tested for HIV, nor did she receive any of the recommended childhood vaccines.[3] Maggiore discussed her beliefs as an AIDS dissident on Air America Radio in March 2005, stating that "...our children have excellent records of health. They've never had respiratory problems, flus, intractable colds, ear infections, nothing. So, our choices, however radical they may seem, are extremely well-founded."[3]

[edit] Illness and death

Several weeks after this interview, in April 2005, Eliza Jane became ill with a runny nose. She was seen by a physician from the family's pediatric practice, who documented a normal physical exam. Several days later, Maggiore took Eliza Jane to see another pediatrician, Jay Gordon, who felt she had a mild ear infection.[3] Reportedly, Gordon was aware of Maggiore's HIV status,[3] but did not have Eliza Jane tested for HIV and was not concerned about opportunistic infection. According to the hospital report, filed just after Eliza Jane's death and based upon an interview with Maggiore, Eliza Jane "had been diagnosed with pneumonia" in the weeks preceding her death.[12]

When Eliza Jane failed to improve, Maggiore took her to see Philip Incao, a holistic practitioner and board member of Maggiore's AIDS-denialist organization Alive & Well AIDS Alternatives. Incao stated that Eliza Jane appeared "mildly ill... no way I considered her in danger... she did not act as a patient acts if she's severely ill or in danger."[2] On May 14, 2005, Incao prescribed amoxicillin for a presumed ear infection.

The following day, Eliza Jane became lethargic and vomited several times. While Maggiore was on the phone with Incao, Eliza Jane collapsed and stopped breathing.[3] She was rushed by ambulance to Valley Presbyterian Hospital in Van Nuys, California. Physicians attempted to resuscitate Eliza Jane, but were unsuccessful. According to the hospital report, a "chest x-ray revealed pneumonia," and Eliza Jane was pronounced dead at 5:40 AM on May 16, 2005.[12]

[edit] Cause of death

An autopsy was performed. The Los Angeles County coroner found that Eliza Jane was markedly underweight and underheight, consistent with a chronic illness, and that she had pronounced atrophy of her thymus and other lymphatic organs. Examination of her lungs showed infection with Pneumocystis jiroveci, a common opportunistic pathogen in people with AIDS and the leading cause of pediatric AIDS deaths.[13] The post-mortem examination of Eliza Jane's brain showed changes consistent with HIV encephalitis; protein components of HIV itself were identified in Eliza Jane's brain tissue via immunohistochemistry.[12]

Based on the clinical information, the immunohistochemical documentation of HIV in Eliza Jane's brain, the evidence of pronounced immunosuppression, and the isolation of the opportunistic pathogen Pneumocystis jiroveci from Eliza Jane's lungs, the coroner concluded that Eliza Jane had died of Pneumocystis pneumonia in the setting of advanced AIDS.[12] This conclusion was described by the coroner as "unequivocal".[2]

Maggiore rejected the coroner's conclusion, ascribing it to political bias and attacking the personal credibility of the senior coroner, James Ribe.[14] Maggiore retained a board member of Alive & Well AIDS Alternatives, Mohammed Al-Bayati, to review the autopsy report. Al-Bayati holds a Ph.D. in comparative pathology (the pathology of animal diseases). He is not a medical doctor, nor is he board-certified in human pathology. He is the author of a book entitled Get All The Facts: HIV Does Not Cause AIDS.[15]

Al-Bayati released a report describing his conclusion that Eliza Jane had not died from AIDS or pneumocystis pneumonia, but from an allergic reaction to amoxicillin.[16] Maggiore embraced Al-Bayati's conclusion that a reaction to amoxicillin was responsible, stating, "I believe the unfortunate irony in this situation is that the one time that we were asked to and that we complied with mainstream medicine, we inadvertently gave our daughter something that took her life."[2]

Al-Bayati's report has been dismissed as both biased and medically unsound.[17][18] Both the L.A. Times and ABC PrimeTime Live consulted independent experts in pathology about Eliza Jane's case; these experts agreed unequivocally with the coroner's conclusion that AIDS and resultant Pneumocystis pneumonia were the cause of death, and rejected Al-Bayati's report.[3][2]