UFO X-Files Released By U.K. Reveal Desire To Weaponize Alien Technology

[Letsbereal]

UFO X-Files Released By U.K. Reveal Desire To Weaponize Alien Technology
12 July 2012, by Lee Speigel (The Huffington Post)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/12/uk-ufo-x-files_n_1668444.html

[37]

Did Huffington publish this kind of thing before AOL bought them?

[Letsbereal]

Did Huffington publish this kind of thing before AOL bought them?

Donnow but does it realy matter?

Larry King Confirms Existence Of UFOs on CNN http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmh2NJxc3BQ

U.F.O DISCLOSURE PROJECT -FULL VERSION http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vyVe-6YdUk

And don't come to me with that bluebeam crap. We're not in Kansas anymore.

Do your freakin research! Don't die a fool!

[37]

Donnow but does it realy matter?

Larry King Confirms Existence Of UFOs on CNN http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmh2NJxc3BQ

U.F.O DISCLOSURE PROJECT -FULL VERSION http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vyVe-6YdUk

And don't come to me with that bluebeam crap. We're not in Kansas anymore.

Do your freakin research! Don't die a fool!

Done the research.  Spent thirty years watching, reading and listening to everything I could find on UFOs.  Final conclusion...lots of evidence of advanced craft.  Zero evidence of aliens.

Period.

Larry King will have some credibility when he spends an hour talking about WTC 7.  Same goes for Bryant Gumble and every other mainstream "journalist" who has done a major network piece on UFOs.  Including Cronkite all the way back in the mid 1970's.  Get a clue.

Everybody in the Disclosure Project either saw a craft or was given "evidence" of aliens from a third party or is an admitted spook.

If you believe that aliens are operating UFOs, then you are the fool.

[geneftw]

Do the craft build and operate themselves?  There have been reports of these craft WAY before we could have built them.  I mean WAY, WAY, WAY before.

[37]

Do the craft build and operate themselves?  There have been reports of these craft WAY before we could have built them.  I mean WAY, WAY, WAY before.

You've convinced me...just kidding. 

What's the evidence and how do you prove to me it's not a forgery or been altered?

[geneftw]

Well, I can’t “prove” it myself.  There aren’t but a few links for the original articles.
Here’s some stuff to look over.  Use your judgment, draw your own conclusions. 

http://science.howstuffworks.com/space/aliens-ufos/ufo-history4.htm

http://www.exploresouthernhistory.com/arkansasairship.html

http://www.dailygrail.com/news/19th-century-ufo-reports

http://www.nicap.org/waves/prior-47-19th.htm

http://www.think-aboutit.com/ufo/AncientRussianManuscriptDescribes19thCenturyUFOSightings.htm

http://socyberty.com/paranormal/ufo-sightings-and-crashes-of-the-1800s-in-america/



Some ancient, some more recent:
(Of course, the more ancient ones are more speculative.)
http://www.livinginthelightms.com/shambhalaufos

More ancient and more speculative:
http://www.theastralworld.com/aliens-ufos/first-ufo-sightings.php

http://lithiumdreamer.tripod.com/ufoart.html

[geneftw]

Well, I can’t “prove” it myself.  There aren’t but a few links for the original articles.
Here’s some stuff to look over.  Use your judgment, draw your own conclusions. 

http://science.howstuffworks.com/space/aliens-ufos/ufo-history4.htm

http://www.exploresouthernhistory.com/arkansasairship.html

http://www.dailygrail.com/news/19th-century-ufo-reports

http://www.nicap.org/waves/prior-47-19th.htm

http://www.think-aboutit.com/ufo/AncientRussianManuscriptDescribes19thCenturyUFOSightings.htm

http://socyberty.com/paranormal/ufo-sightings-and-crashes-of-the-1800s-in-america/

Here's one from Christopher Columbus:
http://www.ufoevidence.org/cases/case487.htm



Some ancient, some more recent:
(Of course, the more ancient ones are more speculative.)
http://www.livinginthelightms.com/shambhalaufos

More ancient and more speculative:
http://www.theastralworld.com/aliens-ufos/first-ufo-sightings.php

http://lithiumdreamer.tripod.com/ufoart.html

[geneftw]

Well, folks, I have a passion for this subject, but I didn't come to talk about UFOs on a Prison Planet forum.  The subject really would tie in to it all, but it's too controversial even for y'all.   I wish I could convince EVERYBODY that this is a real issue and has ties to Prison Planet/InfoWars subject matter, but that would be as daunting a task as changing peoples' religious views.  We all have to draw our own conclusions.  Here's some stuff that shows ties (here & there, within the article) to our subject matter.  It deals with possible reasons for UFO secrecy.  Now I'm going to try to duck out of here.  Wish me luck! 

http://www.presidentialufo.com/old_site/ufo_coverup.htm

[37]

What an incredibly pointless pack of links.  Why don't you just throw in some Rense and ATS links.

Or maybe you just tell me why corporate television is willing to talk about UFOs and not WTC 7.

I mean, there isn't a big UFO secret...it's on EVERY channel.

Along with 2012...at least that has an expiration date.  We get to laugh at those twits in T-minus...

UFO believers are as hopelessly confused as Global Warming believers...and they get their propaganda from the same source, television.

[geneftw]

Exactly why I didn't come to this forum to talk about UFOs.  The nature of the debate is exactly the same as the debate between atheists and believers.  Neither side convinces the other of anything.  They only infuriate each other and each side considers the other to be silly & ignorant.  Pointless exercise in futility.
BTW:
Television is the LAST place (if even that much) where I get my info.  I could show you some amazing footage straight from NASA websites, but you'd still stick your head in the sand.

This is my last post to this thread. ... (I hope.  )

[Georgiacopguy]

Exactly why I didn't come to this forum to talk about UFOs.  The nature of the debate is exactly the same as the debate between atheists and believers.  Neither side convinces the other of anything.  They only infuriate each other and each side considers the other to be silly & ignorant.  Pointless exercise in futility.
BTW:
Television is the LAST place (if even that much) where I get my info.  I could show you some amazing footage straight from NASA websites, but you'd still stick your head in the sand.

This is my last post to this thread. ... (I hope.  )

Well sure, its easier to talk about a subject where everybody believes the same fairy tale that you are pushing. And where they will pat you on the back for believing the same thing as they. Only a fool with a weak position would go where people would question information and sources. So of course you dont want to have a conversation with people who have discriminating view points, people who question every particle of information, who seek out the truth, and wish to seperate flights of fancy and fanfiction from real tangible world problems. I dont want UFO's remotely conencted with what prisonplanet puts out, because do you think I want for one moment somebody that I'm tryign to wake up to ask me about some UFO bullshite? Hell no, I want them to ask me about real stuff, and I do not want them to have the excuse that since we beleive in UFO's, that they can't take us seriously. And I would seriously suggest that you look up what is concidered proof. There is a higher standard for proof around here, and thus far, your collection of links, don't suffice, and are nothing more than a collection of websites that support your position, but do not offer proof. And the very idea that you want to make claims such as these, then toddle off, and not support your positions shows that you cannot. You made the claims, its YOUR job to prove it, not our job.

[37]

After posting the same links twice, he wants to drop the conversation when I respond. 

Do you have any opinion on the question I asked?  Why does the History Channel have a weekly show called Ancient Aliens, while simultaneously ignoring the mountain of evidence and experts gathered by 9/11 Truth? 

[geneftw]

Oh, heck...One more post.
If you read my post, you would have noticed that I do not consider my links to be "proof."  Only food for thought.  If the info in those links could be verified, they would have more clout.  With enough effort, I'd bet the original source could be found.

Georgiacopguy said, "I dont want UFO's remotely conencted with what prisonplanet puts out, because do you think I want for one moment somebody that I'm tryign to wake up to ask me about some UFO bullshite? Hell no, I want them to ask me about real stuff, and I do not want them to have the excuse that since we beleive in UFO's, that they can't take us seriously."

I agree to a GREAT extent with that, except that I don't consider UFOs to be bullshit.  I do, however, realize that a very many people do, and I certainly do not want our InfoWars mission to be "discredited" with the talk of UFO.  This is another reason that I do not wish to discuss this issue on this forum.

I certainly CAN provide MUCH more credible info than I have, but I am not interested in undermining InfoWars' credibility for the sake of my trivial "I told you so" bragging rights. (As if any amount of info would change your minds, anyway.)

One more link, and I'm outta here.  I've given my reasons for turning tail and running, and I'm not ashamed.  I'm doing the right thing.  I won't let my pride stand in the way of our great cause.

My final link on this subject:  About two hours of testimony from high-level and/or credible witnesses who are all willing testify under oath before congress.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yyEZdcVoT0

Now. Argue with them; not with me.

[37]

My final link on this subject:  About two hours of testimony from high-level and/or credible witnesses who are all willing testify under oath before congress.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yyEZdcVoT0

Now. Argue with them; not with me.

I take this to mean we won't be hearing more from you on this subject.

I'm not going to go argue with the Disclosure Project and it's stable of spooks and kooks.  Their best testimony is for exotic vehicles, not aliens.  And, then there's the fact that Steven Greer is selling seminars on summoning UFOs through some sort of channeling.  You can go check their website for yourself...but, you won't. 

Hope you wake up soon and join the real fight.

[37]

http://www.disclosureproject.org/ctp.shtml

CONTACT TRAINING PROGRAM


This comprehensive program gives you all the materials used at the CSETI Workshops and Expeditions so that you can individually or with your own group begin to contact Extraterrestrial Civilizations. In studying and using these materials you will learn how Contact has been made and how you too can become an Ambassador to the Universe promoting Universal Peace.

The Program includes:
(click on items to read description or to purchase separately)

Contact: Countdown to Transformation - Dr. Greer's book & DVD
Hidden Truth - Forbidden Knowledge - Dr. Greer's book & meditation CD
Extraterrestrial Contact: The Evidence and Implications - Dr. Greer's first book
Cosmic Consciousness: A course in mantra meditation - 2 CD set
CSETI Working Group Kit - 4 CD set

Frickin' Whack-a-Doo!  

[geneftw]

Yep.  Ufology is full of 'em!   But did you check out who the eyewitnesses are (that are willing to testify under oath before congress) before passing them off as "spooks and cooks", and what they have to say?

[37]

Yes, I have...hell, I've watched all of their dvds  The best testimonies are air traffic controllers, pilots and police and military officers.  None of whom saw aliens, they saw craft they were not familiar with.

Then there are the kooks, spooks and dupes.  Dupes being honest people who have been preyed upon or fed disinfo intentionally by the spooks.  Look into what Bill Cooper said about the UFO disinfo program he was put under.

Nice try.  But, how exactly do you overlook the fact that the organization they are associating themselves with is involved with this strange hocus pocus?

Step out of the cult for a second and take a good long look.

[geneftw]

It's been a loooong time since I've watched the Disclosure Project testimony I linked to, but I do remember there was mention of aliens.  I started watching the video, hoping to dig some out. (I really don't have time, now.)  At the beginning of the video,they are showing snippets of what's to come in the video. At 3:02, you can listen to Seargent Clifford Stone, U. S. Army, Extraterrestrial Retrieval Team say, "I am prepared to state that I have been at locations where craft of unknown origin that did not originate on the face of this planet were there.  I am prepared to state that while I was there, we saw living [and] dead bodies of entities that were not born on this planet."

I figgered that's enough, at least for now.

As far as Disclosure Project being associated with more questionable organizations: I don't know.  All I can do is speculate.  Has Dr. Greer moved toward more of a profit motive?  Has he become too willing to believe ANYTHING?  Is there more going on that even I have a hard time swallowing?  I don't know.  But I do know not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

[geneftw]

There have been instances during the Cold War when craft have disabled nuclear missiles in the U.S. and in Russia simultaneously.  While this is not PROOF that it was aliens doing that, it certainly is very strong evidence.

[37]

There have been instances during the Cold War when craft have disabled nuclear missiles in the U.S. and in Russia simultaneously.  While this is not PROOF that it was aliens doing that, it certainly is very strong evidence.

Yeah, because the "elite" wouldn't have the disable codes to high tech weaponry. 

Really, dude, Hearst is selling you this shit on a weekly basis, what more proof do you need that it's shite?

[geneftw]

Here's more from Sgt. Stone:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcDSl0LaFLI

Here's some stuff about stone:
http://ufology.wikia.com/wiki/Clifford_Stone

He is but ONE of the MANY eyewitnesses who are willing to testify under oath before congress.

You are focusing on the segments of my posts of which I state that I do not consider to be my strongest arguments.

" 'Proof' that it's shite"?  You set your bar for what is "proof" much lower than you set mine. I set mine fairly high.

The nature of the debate is exactly the same as the debate between atheists and believers.  Neither side convinces the other of anything.  They only infuriate each other and each side considers the other to be silly & ignorant.  Pointless exercise in futility.

Over & out.

[37]

When I look up Clifford Stone or the Interplanetary Phenomena Research Unit, all I get is a bunch of speculation based on redacted documents of suspicious origin.  The "Majestic Documents" are, in my estimation, exactly what Cooper talked about.  Disinfo intentionally spread to hide advanced tech research and testing. 

And then there's the fact he's associated with this cult that prays to the skies for UFOs to show up and communicate with them.  Sorry, but I'm not buying into Scientology either.  I'm not rushing out to join the mourning Moonies either.

But, enjoy your fantasy, I guess.

[Georgiacopguy]

You are focusing on the segments of my posts of which I state that I do not consider to be my strongest arguments.

" 'Proof' that it's shite"?  You set your bar for what is "proof" much lower than you set mine. I set mine fairly high.

Over & out.

If they are your weakest arguments, then do not put them forth as proof or verification, if you cannot support them or back them. Where did you learn to debate, clown school? If you have proof, not speculation, if you have evidence, not weak testimony, then by all means, put it up here. But to make statements then recant and say, thats not my best evidence only makes you look less and less credible, just like the people you are putting forth as credible witnesses. As for proof that its shite... We believe it is shite because we have a HIGH standard of proof. You are readily and willing to accept ANYTHING and ANYBODY as proof or evidence of the existence of alien life. that means you have a LOW standard or proof and avidence. Becuase we are discerning, and are not willing to simply accept any kook that pops up and says "I saw an alien" as proof, we have a HIGH standard or proof and evidence.

What you fail to get is; YOU made the statements, YOU believe they are real. The common, average man believes its all phony. Except for you. You are making statements to the contrary, you beleive something that is not  a commonly held belief, and goes agaisnt the face of known science and accepted doctrine. Therefore, the burden of proof is on you...YOU are supposed to prove your statements and beliefs. Then, based on your statments and beliefs, we are supposed to disprove or debunk, since we arent willing to buy into junk science. Even fourth graders know how scientific theory works. You state a hypotyhesis, and then you go about proving it. But you want us to prove your case for you, all the while you want to play smoke and mirrors by sayign we have a low standard of proof, and by trying to hide behind 'face saving' statements such as thats "You are focusing on the segments of my posts of which I state that I do not consider to be my strongest arguments." Nobody is making you post weak arguments. What you post is what you post, wether it be weak, or strong. If your arguments are weak, or not valid, then there is only one person to blame; you. And the common denominator in all of your weak arguments is you, and your hypothesis. But I suppose you will fall on your sword and claim to be a weak debator rather than admit that aliens are not proven to exist, because you lack proof.

If we follow your thought process and logic to their ultimate conclusions, then just because somebody prays to God, that alone proves he exists. I mean you posted a website, or two that essentially has people praying or meditating that alien craft will come here. Thats not proof, thats just wishful thinking.

And if somebody testifies in front of congress about the existence of God, that too proves He exists. For all we know, the good Sergeant could be a proven Pathological liar, or he may believe this hoopla just as fervently as you do, or even more so, and he may have, just like you, convinced himself that its true. During my time as an investigator, I found people who could foul up polygraph machines, both voice stress and anatomical stress detectors, becuase they fervently beleifed the lies they were telling. To them, what they were saying was the truth because it was the only truth they knew. They had mentally and emotionally disproven every other factor, to the point that only the truth they knew was "possible."

Previously, you mentioned that craft existed and were seen "way way way before man could have built them." So what you are saying is, we should take the word on ancient peoples, who were ignorant of science, and would routinely make up religions and superstitions based on the unknown as fact of alien craft coming here? Are you really sure you want to use ancient peoples as your supoport for your theory?? Do you really think superstitious peoples are really that accurate, and worthy as being labled as your defacto expert witnesses?

[geneftw]

A couple of things before I move on to a new thread post:
_________________________________________

Georgiacopguy:  “I mean you posted a website, or two that essentially has people praying or meditating that alien craft will come here.”
No, that was 37 who posted those links.
__________________________________________

37: “Yes, I have...hell, I've watched all of their dvds  The best testimonies are air traffic controllers, pilots and police and military officers.  None of whom saw aliens, they saw craft they were not familiar with.”
You’ve missed some; one of which I posted for you.
_____________________________________________
geneftw: “Well, I can’t “prove” it myself.  There aren’t but a few links for the original articles.  Here’s some stuff to look over.  Use your judgment, draw your own conclusions.” 

Georgiacopguy… “There is a higher standard for proof around here, and thus far, your collection of links, don't suffice, and are nothing more than a collection of websites that support your position, but do not offer proof.”

geneftw: “If you read my post, you would have noticed that I do not consider my links to be ‘proof.’ ”

geneftw: “While this is not PROOF that it was aliens doing that, it certainly is very strong evidence.”

Georgiacopguy: “If they are your weakest arguments, then do not put them forth as proof or verification…”

Somebody needs to clean the wax out of their ears!

Georgiacopguy: “YOU are supposed to prove your statements and beliefs.”
*sigh*…
AGAIN: geneftw: “The nature of the debate is exactly the same as the debate between atheists and believers.  Neither side convinces the other of anything.  They only infuriate each other and each side considers the other to be silly & ignorant.  Pointless exercise in futility.”   
In other words:  I know better than to try to “prove” it to you.
(and again): geneftw: “Use your judgment, draw your own conclusions.” 

37: “Hope you wake up soon and join the real fight.”
Don’t worry, buddy!  I’m right here with you on that front!
While I STRONGLY believe that the issue of UFOs/aliens is very much an underlying facet of our fight, I do not wish to bring the issue to the forefront for the reasons stated by Georgiacopguy: “I do not want them to have the excuse that since we believe in UFO's, that they can't take us seriously.”  Maybe someday…

[geneftw]

I originally intended to start a thread with this post, but I changed my mind, right or wrong.  I would have titled it “This is NOT a UFO thread.”

Well, this is not a UFO post;  it’s a post about 37 and Georgiacopguy.  I do not like your posts, and it definitely is NOT because you disagree with me, and it’s not a personal thing.  It’s because of your mentality/tactics.  (No, I do not mean “mentality” as in “intelligence”, but rather as in the way you are approaching the argument.)


37: “Did Huffington publish this kind of thing before AOL bought them?”
37: “ If you believe that aliens are operating UFOs, then you are the fool.”
37: “ What an incredibly pointless pack of links.  Why don't you just throw in some Rense and ATS links….UFO believers are as hopelessly confused as Global Warming believers...and they get their propaganda from the same source, television.”
Georgiacopguy: “ …where everybody believes the same fairy tale that you are pushing….
37: “the Disclosure Project and it's stable of spooks and kooks.”
37: “ Then there are the kooks, spooks and dupes.  Dupes being honest people who have been preyed upon…”
37: “ what more proof do you need that it's shite?”
Georgiacopguy: “…since we aren’t willing to buy into junk science.
Georgiacopguy: “ Where did you learn to debate, clown school?”
makes you look less and less credible, just like the people you are putting forth as credible witnesses.
“Even fourth graders know how scientific theory works….”
“For all we know, the good Sergeant could be a proven Pathological liar, or he may believe this hoopla just as fervently as you do…”

Repeatedly ignoring statements I make, name-calling, ignoring, ridiculing and trivializing witnesses/evidence, personally attacking the messenger, trivializing the whole issue along with the evidence by calling it “shite”… WHOSE TACTICS DO THESE SOUND LIKE???!!!    HUH?   WHOSE??  THINK ABOUT IT!!!!!!

Name-calling and the like is the ONLY rebuttal you’ve offered.  That’s why I said, “ ‘Proof' that it's shite’ ?   You set your bar for what is ‘proof" much lower than you set mine. I set mine fairly high.”

And that I set mine fairly high is why I’ve stated over and over that I am not offering my links & stuff as proof, and is why I am not attempting to PROVE anything. Geneftw: “Use your judgment, draw your own conclusions.”

[geneftw]

As to the question, "Where did you learn to debate..Clown School?"
I never took lessons.  I just try to state my point and be honest. 

I found a list of Fallacious Arguments (intellectual dishonesty) online.  I copied a few of them.

*Ad Hominem (Argument To The Man):
attacking the person instead of attacking his argument. 
*Needling:
simply attempting to make the other person angry, without trying to address the argument at hand. Sometimes this is a delaying tactic
Needling is also ad hominem if you insult your opponent. You may instead insult something the other person believes in 
*Straw Man (Fallacy Of Extension):
attacking an exaggerated or caricatured version of your opponent's position.
*Burden Of Proof:
the claim that whatever has not yet been proved false must be true (or vice versa). Essentially the arguer claims that he should win by default if his opponent can't make a strong enough case.
*Argument By Question:
asking your opponent a question which does not have a snappy answer.
*Genetic Fallacy (Fallacy of Origins, Fallacy of Virtue):
if an argument or arguer has some particular origin, the argument must be right (or wrong). The idea is that things from that origin, or that social class, have virtue or lack virtue.
*Psychogenetic Fallacy:
if you learn the psychological reason why your opponent likes an argument, then he's biased, so his argument must be wrong.
*Argument By Dismissal:
an idea is rejected without saying why.
*Poisoning The Wells:
discrediting the sources used by your opponent.
*Argument From Authority:
the claim that the speaker is an expert, and so should be trusted.
*Appeal To Widespread Belief (Bandwagon Argument, Peer Pressure, Appeal to Common Practice):
the claim, as evidence for an idea, that many people believe it, or used to believe it, or do it.
*Argument By Selective Reading:
making it seem as if the weakest of an opponent's arguments was the best he had. 
*Argument By Generalization:
drawing a broad conclusion from a small number of perhaps unrepresentative cases.
*Failure To State:
if you make enough attacks, and ask enough questions, you may never have to actually define your own position on the topic.

I could attach quotes from this thread to all of the above items, but I've been sitting in this chair too long.  Just a quick read of the list should make those quotes jump out in the readers' minds.

[kimpunkrock]

I highly suspect anyone who says the have done all the research on UFOS and come up with the fact that is is a bunch of bullocks!  I mean really?!?!?  I have been researching the NWO and UFOs for over 20 years and I find that anyone who thinks that for one we are the only ones in the universe is a FOOL (to quote someone from above)...a complete and udder fool.

That show Ancient Aliens on the history GIVES YOU THE PROOF you are looking for,  do you think the egyptians and mayans drew UFOS because they didnt exist..?!?!?!?! 

I mean seriously not only have I seen an alien in person once, but I saw an off world UFO up close with my best friend from high school, I have also seen a ton of them in the sky...there is NO WAY at all that all UFOs belong to our military.  HOW the hell do you think our military got them EH?? well maybe if this topic wasnt suppressed here you would know that answer.  THEY SHOT SOME DOWN over Roswell and other places and backwards engineered them..I mean anyone who thinks we designed those ourselves better realize that if that were the case we would know about them since all major countries would have them BUT the fact that they LIE about them because they dont want us to know where they got that technology is a GIGANTIC  huge red flag that we are being lied too either way.  wake up!

There is proof all over the place and many of those documentaries go into the NWO and govt history with UFOs but hey go ahead and ignore this information and make fun at your own peril, because it is important information that literally shows a hidden dept of the NWO--WHERE MOST OF OUR TAXES GO by the way, these NWO MJ12 guys, those guys supersed the constitution, they are VERY dangerous.  Go and look up what Eisenhower said about them there are many professionally done documentaries online for free about Eisenhower. MJ12 and the UFOs.

[Georgiacopguy]

You say repeatedly, use your own judgment, draw your own conclusions. Well I have, and the "proof" that is out there does not meet MY high standard of proof. The "evidence" put forth to date does not prove the case. Im not siting her saying that there cannot be alien life, I'm just saying that NOBODY has proven the case. So you can suggest whatever you like about me personally Gene, but I am just a discerning person who does not want disproven junk science attached to what is termed a truth movement. Truth usually infers that something is proven or provable true. Thus far, the truth movement is a proven fact, UFO's, not so much. Until the time it can be proven, it falls into my filing cabinet as a fairy tale. You may not like my filing system, but gosh, thats how it works for me.

You like to nit pick about debating and argument strategy, call it intelelctual dishonesty, yet you cannot muster up evidence or proof, and somehow insist you have a high standard of proof. Well, if you cannot prove it, then perhaps you should leave that to people better eduated on the subject than you. If you are ill equipped, pick your fights, and move on. Because you are not doing your "movement" any favors by presenting weak arguments. The fact that you are trying to infer that 37 and I are COINTELPROs or some sort of disinfo agents, by your list of argument strategies shows you have no other argument than to try and discredit those who oppose your type of thinking. Thats weak, real weak. And pretty damn obvious too.


I know you want aliens to exist, and if somebody comes along with proof they do exist, thats great. But there are better, more important, tangible things to focus on right now, than some  alien fairy tale. You can suggest it's disinfo all you like, but it's fact. The world is flying apart at the seams, and all you are worried about is some possibly nonexistent planet and some loose theory that it may or may not involve the NWO. Here's a clue guy, the NWO and the powers that be have hidden shit from us for generations. You want to try harder to prove your case, then how about shifting  that energy you put into aliens, and help us big kids fight the NWO and powers that be, because if they fall, they might just leave the filing cabinets open, helping you prove your case. IF they bloody exist/we've made contact to begin with. But if you insist on playing lets pretend, then you are of no use to me at all. I am rooted in what I can prove. And I've no time to trivialize with people that are not rooted in the real world, wanting to take on real problems.

And if I've insulted you, its simply becuase I find most UFO types to be insulting MY intelligence by purporting the things they do, and claiming things are "proof" or "strong evidence" when they clearly are not. I also do not abide in people who waste time on useless minutia that does not progress things, and I find them tedious and useless. You managed to hedge yourself into that, so if I show contempt for you or your beliefs, that is why. People who wonder off and focus on the intangible and unprovable, are akin to that kid on a baseball team in the outfield who watch the butterfly flitter by, and fail to catch the ball. But more importantly, if you do not like my opinions or arguments, do not read them. When you post thigns around here, people who both support you and oppose you are going to post on those threads, so if you do not want to submit yourself to ad hominems, straw man, burden of proof etc etc, then you might want a better way to get your info out there. Becuase no matter where you go online, thsoe sorts of tactics and theatrics exist. Not becuae those people are disinfo, or COINTELPROS, but because they do not believe as you do, and they don't like their intelligence to be insulted. If we were to exclude every one of the things you posted, then most online arguments wouldn't exist. Because nobody, and I mean nobody can just state an opinion, state the facts that back it up, and leave it at that. It's simply not realistic to expect people to. People are passionate, You are passionate about aliens, I am passionate about what can be proven. Those passions show themselves in various ways. Even you yourself rushed to a fallacious argument in that you tried to infer that 37 and I were using arguments like those, therefore you were comapring us to the enemy.

You might state your points (Do links count as points) and try to be as honest as you know how to be. But that does not a case prove. As I said earlier in another post, you and those other witnesses may believe what you beleive so fervently, that you cannot see any other truth. At least I'm open to the evidence that aliens may exist, they just have not been proven, whereas are you just as open to the fact that they may not exist afterall? I dont think you are, because you are far too emotionally invested in them existing, why I do not understand. But that seems to be a common thread amongst UFO believers; they beleive so hard in what they cannot prove or what they think is proven with weak evidence, they attack those who do not believe, think non-beleivers are intellectually inferior since they do not beleive, and do not have an open mind. It is almost akin to a religion to some beleivers I've encountered, in fact a great many I've met have forsaken religion FOR UFOs. And the arguments that result between UFO beleivers and non beleivers are akin to some arguments I've seen between christians and atheists. But for some reason, the people I've met who are emotionally invested in UFOs were not generally grounded in real life, they gravitated towards things outside of the mainstream. I'm not saying thats you, just what I've observed. I've noted that a few were emotionally invested in it to the point that they needed it be real, because they were so disatisfied with real life. Again, not saying you fall into these categtories, just what I've noticed. Maybe you should ask yourself though, why is it so important that aliens exist ? Why is it so important that you prove their existence? To me, it doesnt matter a whit if they exist or not. Because come tomm, its still another day, (if they do exist, I may not have tomm if they attack en masse ala Hollywood aliens.) But whether they exist or don't doesnt impact my life at all. Is that true also for you? You don't have to answer these questions to me, in the grand scheme of things, I'm nobody to you, just answer it to yourself, but be truthful with yourself. The only answer I have, if I was answering those questions for you, would be that I'd rather see you exert that energy into fighting the NWO/ PTB. I think it would be energy better spent. But that's just me. Of course, you may just say this is an "Impassioned Plea" argument, and not ponder a thing I've said, which would be very closed minded of you.     

[37]

The guy you posted provided no proof other than his word.

I could believe in Santa Claus based on the testimony of a six-year-old but that wouldn't make him real.

Kim, I've been reading about UFOs for over thirty years.  I've watched everything about UFOs ever put on television, which is a shit ton.  If it was ever a "secret" it's the worst kept secret in the history of big secrets.  Neither you nor gene can sit there and explain why the completely corrupt mainstream media is more than happy to help you believe in UFOs but not 9/11 being an inside job.

Get a fvcking clue.


The same people selling you on UFOs, will never talk about the central banking scam...why the hell is that?


I've watched Ancient Aliens...it's not that convincing.  What's the best evidence you have seen on there?  I'm pretty sure georgiacopguy already told you why the evidence of simpletons who hadn't figured out the wheel yet, might be questionable.  But, here's the other thing, Ancient Aliens never shows you the history of where a piece of art has been kept and who has owned it.  They don't often tell you who found an engraving or cave drawing.  When they do, it's pretty easy to look that person up and see that they were A) wealthy and B) working for a foundation or has ties to a University/Intelligence organization.

When you guys provide some real proof, I'll be glad to look at it.  I went and googled Clifford Stone and his "group" it came up "bullshit".  What else do you have for proof?  Stop acting like we're attacking you, we're just saying that we don't completely trust the History Channel which is owned by Hearst Publishing.  We're demanding some proof.  You claim to have been convinced by something, tell us what it is.  Or, is it more likely, you have just accepted these things because you enjoyed watching them on TV?  You've been programmed.

[geneftw]

Unproven (at least to those of us not in the loop) does not necessarily equate to “junk” science.
“Proof” would be an alien walking out of a craft to shake your hand.  Nope, I can’t muster that.

“ But there are better, more important, tangible things to focus on right now, than some  alien fairy tale.”  There are more tangible things to focus on, but having the technologies of free energy, antigravity, etc. would be of emense importance.  (Repeatedly calling it a fairy tale is intellectually dishonest…A tactic used by those we are fighting.)

“You want to try harder to prove your case, then how about shifting  that energy you put into aliens, and help us big kids fight the NWO and powers that be,…”
You’re showing me once again that you’re either not reading what I’written or you’re ignoring or forgetting it. because if they fall, they might just leave the filing cabinets open, helping you prove your case. IF they bloody exist/we've made contact to begin with. But if you insist on playing lets pretend, then you are of no use to me at all. I am rooted in what I can prove. And I've no time to trivialize with people that are not rooted in the real world, wanting to take on real problem.”
“But if you insist on playing lets pretend, then you are of no use to me at all. I am rooted in what I can prove. And I've no time to trivialize with people that are not rooted in the real world, wanting to take on real problems.”
(More ridicule.  Attack the messenger.)

“ I also do not abide in people who waste time on useless minutia that does not progress things, and I find them tedious and useless. You managed to hedge yourself into that…”
I found it necessary to point out the tactics of you’re arguments.  The raise a red flag.

“Becuase no matter where you go online, thsoe sorts of tactics and theatrics exist….”
Oh, OK.  So that means those underhanded tactics are OK for YOU to use.

“Even you yourself rushed to a fallacious argument in that you tried to infer that 37 and I were using arguments like those, therefore you were comapring us to the enemy.”
Almost correct, except that I’m comparing your tactics, not you, to the enemy, and my argument that you are using those tactics are not fallacious;  they are in plain sight…right there on the screen.

“… are you just as open to the fact that they may not exist afterall? I dont think you are, because you are far too emotionally invested in them existing, why I do not understand.”
No, I admit that I’m not.  I’m convinced that they do. 
“Emotionally invested” ?  We all have an emotional investment in our causes, of course, but I’m not obsessed or fanatical about it.  But I realize how those technologies would transform this world into a world-o’-plenty. 

“It is almost akin to a religion to some believers I've encountered, in fact a great many I've met have forsaken religion FOR UFOs. And the arguments that result between UFO believers and non believers are akin to some arguments I've seen between Christians and atheists.”
Exactly what I’ve been saying all along!

[geneftw]

“Kim, I've been reading about UFOs for over thirty years.”
So of course that makes you an infallible expert.  (Another one of those tactics.)  I’ve been at it about a decade longer than you, but I don’t feel that makes me any more “expert” than everybody with less time at it.

“I've watched everything about UFOs ever put on television…”
If that’s all you’ve gotten your information from, you are sadly limited.  If you’ve gotten information elsewhere, you’ve missed stuff, for example testimonies about aliens, such as the mere one I’ve posted.  But of course, all those colonels, military & commercial pilots, air traffic controllers, radar technicians, etc. are all delusional, huh?  

“Neither you nor gene can sit there and explain why the completely corrupt mainstream media is more than happy to help you believe in UFOs but not 9/11 being an inside job.”
Deliberate leakage mixed with a lot of disinfo.  Maybe some of the leakage hasn’t been so deliberate; hence more disinfo to discredit the field.

“The same people selling you on UFOs, will never talk about the central banking scam...why the hell is that?”
I don’t know!!  But I have noticed, also, that people talking about meteorology don’t talk about architecture!  Why the hell is that?  Hmmm…Could it be because they are totally different fields? …. Nah.

“We're demanding some proof.”
“Proof” as in a living or dead alien I could bring to your house?  Sorry, no gottie.
“Proof” as in a preponderance of the evidence?  We feel we have it; you‘ve reached another conclusion.  Where else can we go from here? (I don’t care to dig for it all and put it all up here.  That would be more of a project than would be worth the trouble, here.)

“You’ve been programmed.”
Of course.  If I believe something you don’t, it’s because I’ve been programmed.

[davidbenz017]

Yes, I have...hell, I've noticed every single among the of the dvds  The best testimonies are certainly air traffic controllers, pilots and additionally also police and additionally army officers.  None of whom spotted aliens, the few viewed create these people had been not familiar along side.
Then there tend to feel the kooks, spooks and additionally dupes.  Dupes being clear-cut people who have been preyed upon or perhaps maybe offered disinfo deliberately of the spooks.  Look into exactly what Bill Cooper reported about the UFO disinfo plan he ended up being place under.
Pleasing try.  But, how absolutely do you overlook the simple and easy reality that the company the couple can be associating themselves along side is involved in this strange hocus pocus?
Action from the cult for a second and also take a good really very long look.

[geneftw]

Sorry 'bout the double-posted post up there.  I don't know how I managed to do that. :p

[EvadingGrid]

Sorry 'bout the double-posted post up there.  I don't know how I managed to do that. :p

fixed.
 

[geneftw]

Thanks!

Thanks!

[Georgiacopguy]

You cherry pick your "evidence and proof" the same way you cherry pick things out of our posts that you wish to argue. You never go after every argument, just the ones you feel you can attack. That tells me there are elements of our arguments you wish to give a wide berth, because you cannot even begin to argue them. So long as you cherry pick your "proof and evidence," you have no credibility in my book, nor do your arguments. Evidence, and proof by their nature, are self evident. None of yours is, or else us skeptics would be easier to convince.

[geneftw]

Your only arguments are "They associate with them." "They're kooks and spooks and dupes."  You're a fool if..." "This is shite."  "You can't believe them 'cuz they're primitive.
"I've been watching TV about it for 30 years."  "You have no proof."  "Maybe he's delusional."It's a fairy tale, in my opinion."  

You have nothing of substance to offer.

I've several times that I'm out o' here, and I meant it every time, but I just can't help myself.  By now, I should know, and I feel I've illustrated well enough that this is going nowhere.  It's not even going in circles, anymore; it's reached a dead end.

I'm out o' here! .... (I hope.   )  


Oh, hey:
We're fighting the same fight.  We can certainly be friends, but we obviously part ways on this topic. 

Visit my Facebook at gene.storton, but don't send friend requests, 'cuz I only accept personal friends...(two of which I've only met online long, long ago).  You'll see some of this, some of that, some of nuthin'...But you'll also see I do spread our cause.  Having 200 friends is pointless, because it would take all night to share stuff with everybody (Facebook does not have a "share with all friends" button), and very few fake friends would visit my page, anyway.

[geneftw]

Ahh!  Well, HECK!!  I'm already back.  LOL ... But this is just a continuation of what I was sayin' 'bout ME.

My son, John (A Facebook friend) once said in reply to a comment of mine, something like, "I don't know about that hoaky site" (referring to InfoWars.)  That kinda hacked me off.  I began bombarding him daily with articles and even just headlines, that I found on InfoWars and pointed out to him that this stuff is VERIFIABLE.  I showed him verification.  (You'd have to scroll down several months.)  I'm pretty certain that I've convinced him.

I'M AN IIINNNFOOO WAARRRIORRRRRRR!!!!   HYAAHHHHHH!!!!

[37]

Why do I start reading other people's posts and realize that I am reading something I myself posted previously?

Use the quotation function.

I still don't see where you have done anything but re-affirm your own faith based belief that UFOs are piloted by aliens.

The most simple, and probable answer is that UFOs are advanced vehicles built and piloted by men.

The most likely reason for the prevalence of people saying "aliens" is that the people who run the matrix want you to believe in aliens.  Just like the ancient kings of South America wanted their people to believe in a serpent that ate the sun.