Alan Watt: We Must Stop Falling For The Cons, Including the Ron Paul Con

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Offline Satyagraha

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Brocke - I don't think that "this thread is a troll fest."

People are hurt by what they perceive to be a betrayal; and that includes Alex.
Watch this interview done by Alex with Jon Rappoport. Alex is probably the most hurt of all,
because Alex put his whole heart and soul into supporting Ron Paul over their 17-year friendship:

Is The Ron Paul Era Over? Jon Rappoport Reports

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GT0TQSZhwfM

Published on Jun 12, 2012 by TheAlexJonesChannel

Last week, Ron Paul announced he had lost his battle for the nomination. He urged his troops not to disrupt the Republican Party machinery in Tampa at the convention. In a coordinated declaration, his son, Senator Rand Paul, endorsed Obama's twin, Romney, for president.

This has caused an explosion in the ranks of Ron's supporters, Tea Parties, other Constitutionalists, and people who prize individual freedom and also vote. That's a lot of people.

But was Ron ever intending to re-shape the Republican Party? Was that his proactive goal? Was he campaigning to win the nomination and become the titular head of the Republican Party and call the shots? Was he truly working to become the next president? Was he striving all-out to clean out corruption in Washington? Those are all heavy objectives.

Most importantly, when it surfaced there was the possibility he had actually won the Primaries in the first several states and had been robbed by his own Party; and when, much later, his campaign workers were going into states where delegates weren't legally bound to vote for the announced Primary winner and grabbing off those delegates, did Ron come out and say, YES, LET'S DO IT, LET'S RECLAIM THE STATES THAT ARE OURS AND LET'S UPSET THE WHOLE APPLECART? DID HE? DID HE STAGE AN ALL-OUT REVOLT? DID HE SAY THE MAJOR POLITICAL PARTIES ARE ONE BODY WITH TWO HEADS? DID HE LEAD THE CHARGE FOR A PALACE REVOLUTION?

Was that his goal?

We saw no real evidence of it.

Unless Ron comes out now and makes a tremendously convincing speech that explains his current position and reaffirms his underlying values, his political career on the national stage is finished. And if he imagines his son, Rand, who has just sold out by endorsing Romney, can take up the sword of the father in the future, he's delusional. In one day, Ron has ditched his own political career and his familial legacy.

By 2008, Ron Paul had enough cache to start a run at the presidency on his own terms as an Independent, but he didn't do it. He would have blown apart his status as a (barely) mainstream voice, but so what? Was there ever a chance the GOP establishment and its media allies would have permitted him to gain the Party's nomination for president?

Running as an Independent is a different game. You're no longer "a lone voice in the wilderness" of the two-Party system, because you have stepped outside the system. Something more is required of you. In this day and age of Internet access, you need to reach out for every inch and minute of space and time you can get online. You are supposed to stand strong and establish your beachhead and state your claim to, yes, power. The power to make real, not phony change happen.

Is this Ron Paul? Or has Ron decided that he has to shape his son's future within the framework of the Republican Party?
http://www.infowars.com/is-ron-paul-finished-on-the-national-stage/
by Jon Rappoport


And  the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, 
Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren,  ye have done it unto me.

Matthew 25:40

Offline decemberfellow

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Offline Brocke

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Brocke - I don't think that "this thread is a troll fest."

People are hurt by what they perceive to be a betrayal; and that includes Alex.
Watch this interview done by Alex with Jon Rappoport. Alex is probably the most hurt of all,
because Alex put his whole heart and soul into supporting Ron Paul over their 17-year friendship:


This is definitely disappointing. I must admit that my hope that Dr Paul would not would not "coordinate" with Rand put me in a state of denial. I retract my troll fest remark. Now I have to contemplate removing the Ron Paul stickers from my cars.  >:(

I really had hoped that Ron Paul would have remained true to the cause of Liberty to the end. This is very disappointing.


That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history.
~Aldous Huxley

He who has a why to live can bear almost any how. - ~Friedrich Nietzsche

EvadingGrid

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This is definitely disappointing. I must admit that my hope that Dr Paul would not would not "coordinate" with Rand put me in a state of denial. I retract my troll fest remark. Now I have to contemplate removing the Ron Paul stickers from my cars.  >:(

I really had hoped that Ron Paul would have remained true to the cause of Liberty to the end. This is very disappointing.

Yea, many of us feel that way.

Offline tritonman

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Many of us are aware that Ron Paul is doing what he said he was going to do, Alex amongst others deluded themselves I can see, but Ron is doing what he said he would do and I am not quite sure why you people thought he would do differently really.  He never came out for a third party run when you look back at this.  You may feel betrayed but look within and put the blame where it lies with yourselves. ;)

Offline Geolibertarian

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Yea, many of us feel that way.

I just wish people would stop giving him credit for "supporting" the impeachment resolution, because not only does he refuse to mention it in any of his speeches, he has yet to co-sponsor it (even though it was introduced over three months ago):

     http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d112:HC00107:@@@P
     http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/112/hconres107

And I don't care what his cult followers say, neither I nor anyone else in this forum is to "blame" for that inexcusable failure.
"Abolish all taxation save that upon land values." -- Henry George

"If our nation can issue a dollar bond, it can issue a dollar bill." -- Thomas Edison

http://schalkenbach.org
http://www.monetary.org
http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=203330.0

Offline tritonman

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Geo, no matter how badly your "cult" tries to imply a change on his part, you clearly have not backed that claim up is all I am saying.
  Do try to stick to the facts and leave the name calling behind. ;)

Offline Geolibertarian

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Do try to stick to the facts

Don't lecture me about sticking to the facts, because I actually backed up my claim that he has thus far refused to co-sponsor the impeachment resolution.

If you're going to arrogantly claim that others are to "blame" for what he himself refuses to do as an active, taxpayer-financed member of Congress, then don't act surprised or offended if those you have falsely accused don't respond with loving kindness.

As shocking as it may sound, there are more important things than securing a speaking slot at the Republican national convention.

"Keynes" isn't the one trying to start World War III!
"Abolish all taxation save that upon land values." -- Henry George

"If our nation can issue a dollar bond, it can issue a dollar bill." -- Thomas Edison

http://schalkenbach.org
http://www.monetary.org
http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=203330.0

Offline tritonman

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If you're going to arrogantly claim that others are to "blame" for what he himself refuses to do as an active, taxpayer-financed member of Congress, then don't act surprised or offended if those you have falsely accused don't respond with loving kindness.


Strawman Much??  I made no such claim as you know very well. ???

Offline Geolibertarian

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Strawman Much??  I made no such claim as you know very well. ???

"You may feel betrayed but look within and put the blame where it lies with yourselves."

Those are your exact words.
"Abolish all taxation save that upon land values." -- Henry George

"If our nation can issue a dollar bond, it can issue a dollar bill." -- Thomas Edison

http://schalkenbach.org
http://www.monetary.org
http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=203330.0

Offline tritonman

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Many of us are aware that Ron Paul is doing what he said he was going to do, Alex amongst others deluded themselves I can see, but Ron is doing what he said he would do and I am not quite sure why you people thought he would do differently really.  He never came out for a third party run when you look back at this.  You may feel betrayed but look within and put the blame where it lies with yourselves. ;)
Nice try. ;)  Here is the full quote in context. ;D  I should add that I am not counting you as one whom deluded himself as I don't believe you are amongst those who liked his policies in the first place.  I should calrify when I speak of betrayal I am talking about those who "claimed" to back him but suddenly find it popular to trash him when his position has been constant and it is them who have changed. 
   Like I stated earlier this kind of backstabbing is absolutely terrible for any movement going forth upon Dr. Pauls retirement.

Offline resist.tyranny

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We've been "Medina'd" again.  I'll bet Alex is more careful about going "all in" on a candidate from now on.  That kind of betrayal can ruin Alex's reputation as well. 

What I suspect is that Ron Paul is probably a good guy--mostly--but I guess we have to look at what he DOESN'T say as much as what he does say.

He also signaled early on that this was his last hurrah, so I guess RP is doing what he can to propel his son forward before going into retirement, at the expense of the movement.  Of course Rand is on a downward spiral, but they probably don't see it like that. 

The deeper we get, the more respect I give Alan Watt.  I don't want to believe what he says sometimes, but the further we get into it, the more obvious it gets that everything is rigged.  And what's not rigged will be co-opted. 

Trust but verify

Offline Geolibertarian

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Nice try. ;)  Here is the full quote in context. ;D  I should add that I am not counting you as one whom deluded himself as I don't believe you are amongst those who liked his policies in the first place.  I should calrify when I speak of betrayal I am talking about those who "claimed" to back him but suddenly find it popular to trash him when his position has been constant and it is them who have changed.

I am not "trashing" him when I say he has thus far refused to co-sponsor the impeachment resolution, but am merely stating a fact. Don't blame me if the truth hurts.

Quote
Like I stated earlier this kind of backstabbing is absolutely terrible for any movement going forth upon Dr. Pauls retirement.

Ah, so if you point out a simple fact about the impeachment resolution, you're "backstabbing."  ::)

It's obvious we're never going agree on this, so let's just agree to disagree and be done with it.
"Abolish all taxation save that upon land values." -- Henry George

"If our nation can issue a dollar bond, it can issue a dollar bill." -- Thomas Edison

http://schalkenbach.org
http://www.monetary.org
http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=203330.0

Offline tritonman

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Ah, so if you point out a simple fact about the impeachment resolution, you're "backstabbing."  ::)

This never was one of my contentions is what I am making clear here.  You may feel this but it is not so is all I am saying.

Offline Brocke

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Ron Paul Says No To Mitt Romney Endorsement
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZXP2uqV3OU

With serendipitous timing regarding the recent release of our video 'Ron Paul BLOWBACK', Ron Paul says no to a Mitt Romney endorsement while being interviewed by Wolf Blitzer.

A followup to this...

Ron Paul BLOWBACK!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRzroUTM9X8


That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history.
~Aldous Huxley

He who has a why to live can bear almost any how. - ~Friedrich Nietzsche

Offline Satyagraha

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Ron Paul Says No To Mitt Romney Endorsement
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZXP2uqV3OU

With serendipitous timing regarding the recent release of our video 'Ron Paul BLOWBACK', Ron Paul says no to a Mitt Romney endorsement while being interviewed by Wolf Blitzer.

A followup to this...

Ron Paul BLOWBACK!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRzroUTM9X8

From Ron Paul's message to his base...

Important National Convention News
http://www.ronpaul2012.com/2012/06/15/important-national-convention-news/

    The Republican National Convention begins on August 27, and you and I have some critical work to do to get ready.

    As I shared last week, my campaign will have as many as 200 bound delegates and several hundred more on the convention floor who support our issues.

    To stand with my delegates, I will be holding an important rally in Tampa on Sunday, August 26th.  Everyone is welcome to attend.  In fact, I’m hoping we’ll have a wonderful crowd.

    The goal of this rally is to kick off the week for our delegates, set the proper respectful and positive tone, and
prove to the GOP establishment that you and I are the future of the Republican Party –
and that we stand behind our beliefs 100%.


    Today, I shot a video sharing my thoughts on my campaign’s successes and how we will advance our ideas in Tampa.  I do hope you’ll take a moment to watch it....

=================

No way. I am not the future of the Republican OR Democratic Party; and I have nothing to "prove" to either party.
I'm so sorry that Ron Paul supports the GOP 100%. There's no room in that party for anyone who loves freedom.

Oh - and BY THE WAY: The statement "...prove to the GOP establishment that you and I are the future of the Republican Party – and that we stand behind our beliefs 100%." IS AN ENDORSEMENT OF THE GOP NOMINEE - 100%.
And  the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, 
Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren,  ye have done it unto me.

Matthew 25:40

Offline tritonman

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[=================

No way. I am not the future of the Republican OR Democratic Party; and I have nothing to "prove" to either party.
I'm so sorry that Ron Paul supports the GOP 100%. There's no room in that party for anyone who loves freedom.

Oh - and BY THE WAY: The statement "...prove to the GOP establishment that you and I are the future of the Republican Party – and that we stand behind our beliefs 100%." IS AN ENDORSEMENT OF THE GOP NOMINEE - 100%.
No matter how you slice it, you simply can not get there from here.  He is telling the GOP that he stands by his beliefs and not theirs.  I thought he was making this perfectly clear.  This is a shot across the establishments bow , nothing more or less. ;)

Offline Satyagraha

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BEFORE Rand Paul endorsed Mitt Romney,
And BEFORE Ron Paul endorsed the GOP 100% (asking his supporters to do the same)...

... excerpted from the interview Alex did with Tarpley...

====================

Tarpley: Let me talk to you - you are better than Ron Paul.  You don't need Ron Paul. Let's take an issue like 911. You have stuck to your guns on 911 Truth.

Alex:  Alright, since you brought that up, Ron Paul was asked four years ago about it, and after he said, well, (interrupted)

Tarpley: And again on January 1st he repudiated it --

Alex: he's been so busy he hasn't been able to deal with it..

Tarpley: wow, it's the greatest issue of our time...

Alex: But he knows about false flags, Ron Paul knows false flag terror is real, there's been a CIA coup, all of that - Ron Paul; I know him...

Tarpley:  When did he say that? Did he say that on the presidential debates?

Alex: He said that on my show and others... I know Ron Paul's family, man, Ron Paul is good. All I know is there's bigger -- why are you so obsessed with Ron Paul?

Tarpley: In the presidential debates he was asked... he was asked ...Because I see lots of people who are useful and productive people...(interrupted)

Alex: Useful idiots for your soviet model?

Tarpley: ... who have been highjacked by a flim-flam artist. Ron Paul is the most successful con artist in the entire campaign.

Alex:  60 seconds on your obsession because I want to get to other issues... oh really, only Ron Paul, in the entire galaxy, it's all Ron Paul ... not Syria, not Libya, not Russia, not NATO, not Europe collapsing, not the pigs being sucked dry, Ron Paul! Ron Paul! Ron Paul! He's so Evil! He's so Bad! Tarpley -Tarpley - he'll save us - along with the communists!

Tarpley: You are undercutting, if you want to protest Bilderberg, I would say to you, 'don't go out there and say Ron Paul, Ron Paul - I know a lot of people, including myself, who say, 'I don't want to hear about any reactionary republican for the rest of my life. I'm sick of republicans, I don't want any of them'. I know a lot of people who, after Bush, swore that they would never vote for a reactionary republican for 10 thousand years, and now (interrupted)

Alex: hey, I'm against the whole power structure..


Tarpley:  but you're tied to the republican party - are you guys all registered republicans? What is this?

Alex: Can we now move on to the next topic..(interrupted)

Tarpley: Why do we have to be tied to a cynical politican of the republican power structure?

Alex: Webster, I exposed Obama, I exposed Bush...(interrupted)

Tarpley: How about Ron Paul? When are you going to expose him? But you're running interference for Ron Paul...and he's running interference for Romney - where does that leave you? You see what I mean?

Alex: Listen, Romney's an unknown country, I've exposed his ties to banking and all of it. Now listen, stop right there. Finish up with your Ron Paul fetish. Let's move on to the next subject, go ahead.

Tarpley: A vote for Ron Paul was a vote for Romney.



Tarpley's question, "...but you're tied to the republican party - are you guys all registered republicans? What is this?"

Is answered by Ron Paul's statement:

"...The goal of this rally is to kick off the week for our delegates, set the proper respectful and positive tone, and
prove to the GOP establishment that you and I are the future of the Republican Party –
and that we stand behind our beliefs 100%."


And  the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, 
Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren,  ye have done it unto me.

Matthew 25:40

Offline Satyagraha

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No matter how you slice it, you simply can not get there from here.  He is telling the GOP that he stands by his beliefs and not theirs.  I thought he was making this perfectly clear.  This is a shot across the establishments bow , nothing more or less. ;)

Did you notice this line from Ron Paul?

"You and I are the future of the GOP".

Since that line does not seem to irritate you, as it does me, then I assume you're a registered Republican.

I am not, nor am I a registered Democrat.

Good luck with that plan to change the GOP from within.


And  the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, 
Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren,  ye have done it unto me.

Matthew 25:40

Offline tritonman

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.

Good luck with that plan to change the GOP from within.



Thank you,  and Go Ron Go.   give em all hell. ;D
The whole idea of a Ron Paul Con is not accurate by the way,  He never claimed he was doing other than what he is .

Offline resist.tyranny

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Did you notice this line from Ron Paul?

"You and I are the future of the GOP".


That pisses me off too.  I'm nobody's minion--Republican or Democrat (or Libertarian for that matter).  I'm my own man, and I think for myself.  And trying to change the Republican Party from within, is like trying to cut your way out of a dragon once he swallows you.  You're "toast".

No, we need a revolution of ideas and men and women on conscience, not "Party".

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No, we need a revolution of ideas and men and women on conscience, not "Party".

I agree.

I would also like to see the candidates contractually obligated to their manifesto.

Offline bovvered

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I would also like to see the candidates contractually obligated to their manifesto.
That would be the minimum requirement for any kind of real democracy, rather than the giant psy-ops it has become, with its bells and whistles and its constant supply of false heroes.  Obviously that will never happen because the system is designed to be corrupt and to be controlled by the real wealth and the real power behind the scenes, well out of sight.  It is not meant to be a fair and just system.

It's amazing how many people come to some sort of understanding that the system itself is the problem, and still allow themselves to be convinced that we just need to vote in the right person who will then use the system to fix the system.  It's an impossibility.

-----

Anyway, the Alan Watt audio has now been uploaded to youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlcoHiOrYLk

Offline masterofthemoon

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Spin Drs wrong on Dr Paul
« Reply #103 on: June 20, 2012, 01:10:32 PM »


Oh - and BY THE WAY: The statement "...prove to the GOP establishment that you and I are the future of the Republican Party – and that we stand behind our beliefs 100%." IS AN ENDORSEMENT OF THE GOP NOMINEE - 100%.

Perhaps you are affected with short term memory like nearly everyone else on this forum but RP said(dating back to the previous election) that the plan was to effect change in the GOP with C4L and the support of more 'liberty minded' candidates. I agree that a reformist strategy never seems to work(historically speaking) but it is most certainly not an endorsement of romney(and he never will) or didn't you see the Infowars front page today? He also said as much on CNN.

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Offline pac522

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Re: Spin Drs wrong on Dr Paul
« Reply #104 on: June 20, 2012, 10:05:37 PM »
Perhaps you are affected with short term memory like nearly everyone else on this forum but RP said(dating back to the previous election) that the plan was to effect change in the GOP with C4L and the support of more 'liberty minded' candidates. I agree that a reformist strategy never seems to work(historically speaking) but it is most certainly not an endorsement of romney(and he never will) or didn't you see the Infowars front page today? He also said as much on CNN.



Correct and people seem to forget why. Because you aren't getting elected to any office of great meaning without being in one of the two parties. Unfortunately if you want to beat a wolf you have to think like a wolf. You have a better chance of changing the GOP from within then trying to get elected from the outside.

In my eyes there are three choices, one, you have a peaceful sit in where 80% of the people call it in and don't go to work and protest until we get change, highly unlikely and we don't have the time it would take for 80% of the people to get fed up enough, two, 3% of the population pick up arms and have a repeat of the bloody portion of the American Revolution, which is still going on or you get in the system and try to change it.
This country did not achieve greatness with the mindset of "safety first" but rather "live free or die".

Truth is the currency of love. R[̲̅ə̲̅٨̲̅٥̲̅٦̲̅]ution!

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All of this could be solved with a 1% Wall St Sales Tax. Why do we avoid this topic on Infowars? :-\

Offline Scarbo

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All of this could be solved with a 1% Wall St Sales Tax. Why do we avoid this topic on Infowars? :-\

Good question, and you're right.