Ron Paul turning down the NH Recount: Avoiding the Rockefeller Trap

[ApplesauceNinja]

Folks, I love the Ron Paul Revolution and everything Dr. Paul stands for.  I am a die hard supporter, and that will never
change.  But, I won't lie to you about being very worried right now about where we stand.  It's 11:00 p.m., and it looks
like Dr. Paul is getting trashed badly in New Hampshire.  In a state with as many independents as NH, I can't for the life
of me figure out how he's fallen behind five others, including Ghouliani.  To me, and I think many of you may feel this way,
I think the fix is in at this point. 

I don't think the people with the money are going to let this be a fair fight.  I'm not being a sore loser, but I smell a rat.
How is it that Dr. Paul, who was projected by many mainstream news outlets to place no lower than third, is losing so
badly?  I think Faux News and the like have pooled their resources to make sure our candidate places near the bottom
so that their glad handing neocon talking heads like Sean "The Great American" Hannity and the like can say "see, we told you
so."  I am so seething with rage right now.  I'm angry with the blinded, narrow minded American public.  They keep seeing
the same whores from the same political parties making the same promises and then not living up to them.  They see how
the status quo has failed, continues to fail, and will fail far into the future, and yet they honestly believe that the right
weasel from one of the two parties will fix everything. 

Most Americans are never going to wake up and see what's going on around them.  They're happy to take that blue pill and
go back to sleep once every four years.  And, I'm afraid the idiot majority is going to take us, the freedom loving patriots,
down the toilet with them.  We can fight, but as long as we're branded loons and liars by the talking heads on tv, the place
where most Americans get all of their information, the vast majority of the public who never reads or thinks for themselves
will continue to wreck the American dream for us all.  Yes, my friends, I am terrified.  Push come to shove, I won't go down
and be a happy little part of the system willingly.  I'm just saddened because it doesn't have to be this way.  If the
American people would just pull their heads out of their asses for just one minute, we could change things.  But, they
won't.  They've been dumbed down by the education system, and their sense of right and wrong has been deadened by
media and entertainment. 

We all woke up.  We all smelled the tyranny.  But, at the risk of sounding like an elitist here, we have something most
Americans don't anymore - a love of our freedoms and the ability to think logically.  Alex said on his show the other day
that if Dr. Paul finished fourth or worse that it was probably over for the Ron Paul Revolution.  I hope to God he is wrong. 
I want to hold out hope that maybe people will wake up before the shackles are put around their ankles, but at this point
it's not looking good.  I don't think you can bring the truth to a public that doesn't want it. 

So, what are we to do?  If the tyranny exposes itself for what it is, and it most certainly will, what are we the patriots
to do?  If appealing to the American people with logic and facts doesn't work, how do we stop the government machine
from running over us?  Thanks for listening. 

[DM]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7615681123636044843&q=visitor+from+past&total=542&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

[PatriotX]

If appealing to the American people with logic and facts doesn't work, how do we stop the government machine
from running over us? - ApplesauceNinja

We don't.  We just keep giving them Hell!  

This is something the whole world will have to learn from in due season.  And don't think for a minute that what we are doing isn't important in the grand scheme of things.

Fight ON!


Patriot X  

[Capt. Obvious]

No it's not over!!! It just started to get mad!!!

[Cruise4]

'Turkeys voting for Christmas' comes to mind.

So I have to suspect its an education issue. The people just do not have the facts to make an informed choice. Not suprising given the mainstream media.

I've only looked in on the Ron Paul campaign, but what stood out for me was No IRS and No Fed. Now a dead bloke could stand and I'd vote for him with those policies. Am I that different? (Don't answer that).

Was there count fraud? Hopefully we'll get a clearer picture in the coming days. But many people seem to be 'suprised' at this result.

Lose heart? No, not at all. This is but a part of the larger Truth Campaign. Ron Paul is a huge boost and more people are becoming aware every day. Everything is not riding on Ron Paul... its riding on us.

The fight to educate the people and get them questioning authority has got to go on... regardless of any 'perceived' obstacles.

[PatriotX]

Everything is not riding on Ron Paul... its riding on us. - Cruise 4

Ain'T THAT THE TRUTH!


Patriot X   

[monkeyboy]

What? Over? Did you say "over"? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!

And it ain't over now. 'Cause when the going gets tough . . . the tough get going. Who's with me? Let's Go! Come on! AAAAEEEEEGGGHHHH!!

[Capt. Obvious]

What? Over? Did you say "over"? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!

And it ain't over now. 'Cause when the going gets tough . . . the tough get going. Who's with me? Let's Go! Come on! AAAAEEEEEGGGHHHH!!

you mean the Japanese

Otherwise...YEAH!!!

[siberpredahtor]

I don't want to downplay Ron Paul, I really do love the guy, but

Ron Paul is an idea, he is the manifestation of Liberty.

And I won't speak for you guys, but my revolution for Liberty will not end till there is a bullet in my head

[monkeyboy]

you mean the Japanese

Otherwise...YEAH!!!

Gee captain Obvious - I thought everyone knew this Animal House quote...

[Infowarrior]

Ron Paul just helped plant the seeds of liberty.  We'd love to see him in office, for two terms if allowed, but you guys are right.  It's not JUST Ron Paul.  It's up to US.  If we lose heart, and give in to the mainstream media machine and the naysayers, who has won?  We know for CERTAIN that the NWO claims a victory here if we don't continue to spread the messages of Dr. Paul, wake people up, and move forward.

Think about this: What will the media say if Ron Paul continues on for months, never reaching even 1st or 2nd place in any caucus or primary in any state?  Persistence matters here.  He can gain attention just for being persistent in his message.

We don't have a choice!  The Republic needs us.  The message doesn't end here.  The revolution NEVER ends, so long as we don't let it.

[Capt. Obvious]

Gee captain Obvious - I thought everyone knew this Animal House quote...

Oh, sorry. No I don't know that quote.

[keldorn]

The idea isn't over, but I don't realistically expect Ron Paul to win the Republican nomination with the establishment as it currently is, and if a state with so-called independent voters support a status-quo war monger like John McCain is a testament of how far lost this country is.

[ApplesauceNinja]

Don't get me wrong.  I'll never stop fighting the NWO.  I'll never give up my rights without a fight.  They'll make a corpse
of me before I let them make a slave of me.  My son's future is riding on the ideas of liberty prevailing.  I'm just saddened
by the New Hampshire results.  It speaks volumes about the level of ignorance this nation has sunk to. 

[bennyxbo]

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/2008/nh/nh_primary_gop_results_by_town/

What we need to do is simply go down the list, pick a few towns where paul got 0-5 votes, and confirm that there werent more paul supporters there.

like Ellsworth, if we can find 2 people from there that can prove they voted for Ron Paul, then we prove there was fraud.

Also:

Waterville -1
Roxbury - 2
Sutton - zero ?
Wentworth's Location - zero

[menace]

It wont be over becuse Dr. No lost.

[ApplesauceNinja]

Like most everyone else here, I'm horrified at what happened in yesterday's NH Primary.  I see it as the result of
either continued party line voter stupidity and blindness, voter fraud, or a combo of the two.  I see it as a major
blow for us and what we hope to achieve. 

But, even if Dr. Paul doesn't win the nomination, and we have to be honest with ourselves and know that he most
likely won't, so long as the political machine owns the voting machines, we have to start planning for the movement's
life after Dr. Paul.  The Ron Paul Revolution isn't even about  Dr. Paul, really.  The Ron Paul Revolution is just another
name for the Patriot movement.  However, even though the movement is bigger than any of us, Dr. Paul is our champion,
and frankly, he's the only one on Capitol Hill we've got.  So, what happens after he is no longer in Washington D.C.? 

He is 72, and while he's in remarkably good health, how much longer can he continue to serve as a U.S. Congressman?
10 years at best, maybe?  Who do we have that champions our rights?  Who do we have who will pick up the mantle
and fight for a return to a Constitutional form of government and sound money?  Nobody.  We need as much representation
on The Hill as we can get. 

So, what should we do?  As grand as the idea sounds, maybe some of us should consider running for Congress or other political
offices in our states ourselves.  I think there's enough thirst for truth and dedication out there that surely, if at least 2 patriots
in each state ran for Congress or the Senate, a handful would be bound to get elected.  Truth is a powerful message, folks.
Dr. Paul has shown us that.  We need more like him.  If we want to fight the system, it would be best to do it from within,
peacefully, via strong and honest leaders.  Congressman Alex Jones of Texas, anybody?       

[Dig]

To Reluctant Ron Paul Supportors

3 min - Jun 13, 2007 -  (124 ratings)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVJIMsu9fyQ

[Megaman]

If you guys think the bankers and the military industrial complex will let Ron Paul win these elections you`ve got another thing coming! The corporate elite own all the media and the ballot boxes! Stop dreaming, you have ZERO CHANCE! Sorry to sound so negative but I think this is a waste of time seriously. Better start stocking food and ammunitions instead.

Let the natural sequence of events happen, once USA is on its knees and everyone is broke, people are starving and hunted down by the gestapo to be sent to concentration camps, with UN troops in the streets, then dumb americans will realize whats going on and there will be a revolution, a civil war.

Its human nature not to do anything until the house is on fire. History repeats itself endlessly. The only advice I can give you is to educate your children and friends to get ready for the holocaust.

[whitelocust]

bow down and take it, eh? that's your advice? sounds like a troll to me. the road ahead is long and difficult, but new ground is gained every day. if everyone took your advice, we'd be knee deep in death already. we can prevail, people! do not get discouraged by this lap dog and his pessimism. if you want to hole yourself up in a cave somewhere and play rambo, fine, but stay out of our way. we stand for freedom and truth, and we stand up for what we believe. we do not cower in the shadows and hide behind a false sense of security. those are the actions of the elitists, the very things we are trying to defeat. so, go to your bunker and wait. the rest of us will be doing something important. we will be remembered forever, while you shall fade into obscurity. no one remembers the cowards.

[Dig]

Our founding fathers would evict us from their property if he ever heard such defeatist attitudes.

The best slave is the one who thinks he has no power whatsoever.

We Will Not Be Silenced Part 1

5 min - Jul 23, 2007 -  (24 ratings)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nB_Jbr8R8XU


We Will Not Be Silenced - Part Two

7 min - Feb 28, 2007 -  (76 ratings)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWPNF5KfAtY

[whitelocust]

i find it a pretty sad first post, especially from someone taking the name of one of my video game idols, MegaMan. he's not sounding too mega. you make a great point, sane. the fathers of the republic did not work their fingers to the bone to preserve our freedom so that people could admit defeat before the battle had even begun. indeed, they would be ashamed of us, and that is why we must work even harder to preserve what they ENTRUSTED TO US.

[Dig]

The issue here is that RP's chances of winning the election are better than John Edwards (3% v. 1%).

We need to be prepared to spread the word every second of every day about the Media Industrial Complex.  Once 300 Million American are awake, this shit is over.  We are lucky to have RP available to assist, but this is our country, our freedoms.  Everybody relating to him as a saviour is nuts.  Now I do agree we need to be very vigilant in local elections as well.  But for some reason people are living in a scarcity conversation of support RP OR support local candidates.

That is precisely the divide and conquer mentality that these Sun Tzu strategists use against us.  We have an abundance of energy, support, power, money.  Our wealth is immesurable if we just open our eyes.

We are made to think everything is scarce and it is just not true.  We can support the freedom message and local election opportunities.  To pit one against the other is not only absurd, it deprives others of the reality of their power.

[stymo1]

bow down and take it, eh? that's your advice? sounds like a troll to me. the road ahead is long and difficult, but new ground is gained every day. if everyone took your advice, we'd be knee deep in death already. we can prevail, people! do not get discouraged by this lap dog and his pessimism. if you want to hole yourself up in a cave somewhere and play rambo, fine, but stay out of our way. we stand for freedom and truth, and we stand up for what we believe. we do not cower in the shadows and hide behind a false sense of security. those are the actions of the elitists, the very things we are trying to defeat. so, go to your bunker and wait. the rest of us will be doing something important. we will be remembered forever, while you shall fade into obscurity. no one remembers the cowards.

AMEN !!!

sane, you should have renamed this thread " WE ARE DOOMED !! 300 million can never defeat 10,000 cowardly old men.  I advise you all to go to the store and buy a big supply of vaseline so when they gang rape us at the FEMA camps it won't hurt quite so much!!!", but it probably wouldn't be politically correct don't ya know.


This fight has just begun. We are changing the minds of Americans, waking them up from their slumber, one at a time. It is a very slow and painful task, there are so many asleep, but we will not fail.

[whitelocust]

i agree, definitely be prepared for anything  that may come, however i do not think an american or global holocaust is inevitable, in fact i think it is quite preventable, if the correct actions are taken. all that is needed is for more people to look a little further down the road, instead of fumbling with their cell phones or ipods. we all should be prepared for the worst, but at the same time we should be prepared to stand and fight the war on freedom. with a little initiative and a whole crapload of elbow grease, we can see this thing through to OUR desired end. a free and independent republic.

[whitelocust]

this is the attitude that every american needs.

[whitelocust]

only time will tell if our hard work will pay off. the only thing we can do is try try try and then try some more. through persistence we shall find our way. i for one will never carry a national id card. they'll have to execute me in the street.

[whitelocust]

the elite would love nothing better than for us to squabble over our petty differences. you both make good points. i have often questioned whether or not my fellow man would stand beside me in resistance to tyranny. not just talk the talk but walk the walk. well, after being on this forum for quite a while, i'm thoroughly convinced that yes, we will resist. not a small minority of us, but the masses which are slowly awakened will stand with us, hand in hand, to preserve peace and justice, and to promote freedom in the face of our would be dictators. despite all their wickedness and their hidden agendas, its our way that will lay waste to the globalist schemes, because our way is out in the open, for everyone to hear. true leaders lead by example, and that is what we do. i'm on the internet every day, spreading the good word of truth. not just reading and listening, but doing something about it. i've written countless emails to government officials, as well as private citizens, and feedback has been all good so far. but the fact is, even if no one stood by me, i would be there alone, standing by myself for my rights and the rights of all others.

[Kregener]

http://www.newswithviews.com/Devvy/kidd335.htm

[ApplesauceNinja]

I hope to God he will authorize a recount.  I know it may make us come across as sore losers, and I'm sure the media
will spin it as such, but it's not about that.  If we lost honestly, while it's not fine, it's acceptable.  We take the loss
and go on.  But, when people are being robbed of their votes, well, hell no!!  We need to shine a light on this here
and now, and hopefully it'll make the rest of the states sit up and take notice.  We need to let them know we're watching,
and we're not going to allow any funny crap to go on.  I just called the Ron Paul campaign, and I encouraged them to
demand an audit.  Ron Paul in 08!!

[Kregener]

[Dig]

Bev Harris was just on AJ and said another Republican candidate is authorizing it.  So he can continue the campaign and we can continue exposing the obvious fraud.

[grommet]

Hey that "Rudy Giuliani gets 9.11% of the vote in three NH towns" is incorrect.  Check the comments from the source article.
http://www.ronpaulwarroom.com/?p=764

[Dig]

Ron Paul says it in black and white:

"Even vote fraud is not beyond these people."

[Dig]

After the performance on CNN and at the fox debate, he kicks the shit out of the entire elite establishment more than any recount request could.

He fights for us more than himself and I am proud to support his message.
_____________________________

Ron Paul responds to racist quotes on CNN - 01/10/2008

11 min - Jan 11, 2008 -  (19 ratings)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4702113084821955070

Ron Paul clips during South Carolina Debate on 01/10/2008

16 min - Jan 11, 2008 -  (10 ratings)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7168787397434311377

[EthanAllen_TruthNet Radio]

As much as I support the Ron Paul campaign, this looks to be a death knell for future primaries in regards to voting fraud. If the Paul campaign won't stand up against vote fraud in NH, why would they in any other? There WILL be a recount in NH, but without the endorsement of the Paul campaign. They want to try and rise above the fray, but in doing so fail the opportunity to challenge state-wide election fraud that could put all of Ron Paul's chances at risk. I feel this is a HUGE mistake.

http://ronpaul2008.typepad.com/ron_paul_2008/2008/01/new-hampshire-r.html

January 12, 2008
New Hampshire Recount?

After a careful investigation, I have decided against seeking a recount in New Hampshire.  I am confident that not asking for a recount is the right decision.

I carefully considered the arguments for and against a recount before instructing my campaign staff not to pursue it. Without a firm belief that vote fraud had taken place, and without the possibility that a recount would have increased the chances for success of our campaign, a recount would have diverted campaign resources, time, and energy away from crucial battles elsewhere.

We have taken concerns about vote fraud seriously. In Iowa, campaign volunteers carefully monitored the caucuses. Campaign staff placed Paul supporters in every precinct to watch and verify the voting and count. We had supporters phone in results from their precincts to a campaign hotline while others ensured that those numbers were reflected on the official display board at the Polk County Convention Center. The numbers our caucus watchers reported agreed with the official tally, and both results also aligned with the campaign’s internal polling. In relatively pro-Paul counties, our sampling pegged support at 11.5%. This is consistent with an overall 10% finish for the entire state.

In New Hampshire, while I would have hoped for a better result than eight percent, I am convinced that vote fraud played no role in this result. Rumors of vote fraud were investigated, and in the end they proved to be the result of errors in early media reports that were not reflected in the official numbers.  In one notable case, when a campaign staff member contacted an individual who had on the evening of January 8 claimed that his vote had not been counted, the person said that he had made a mistake and that the next morning the error in reporting on a newspaper website had been corrected both in the media and -- most importantly -- in the official tally.

Many have expressed concerns that those ballots counted by machine yielded a 2% lower total than those counted by hand. However, machine counted vote totals were more than 2% lower for both John McCain and Mike Huckabee. Hand counted votes were more likely to be cast in rural areas. Results almost always vary between urban and rural areas.

My campaign staff and I have analyzed the numbers in New Hampshire and I have reached the conclusion that it was the high turnout -- not vote fraud or counting errors -- that left us with eight percent of the vote. Our total vote count of over 18,000 votes was well within what we projected given the efforts of our extensive statewide get-out-the-vote program, giving me no reason to believe that vote fraud played any role in the results of the Granite State’s primary.

In both Iowa and New Hampshire there is much to be proud of.  Taking both states together, I am honored that over 30,000 people cast their vote for me -- more than either Rudy Giuliani or Fred Thompson. Unlike many other candidates’ efforts, our campaign for freedom is growing and our message is spreading.

Now is the time to redouble our efforts. Our resources must be spent on the upcoming primaries and caucuses, and on ensuring that, with your help, we organize every state yet to vote with our Precinct Leaders program.

We can't win primaries and caucuses that have already happened -- but we can win those yet to come.   To become the Republican presidential nominee, a candidate must have 1,191 delegates.  Iowa, Wyoming and New Hampshire determined only 32 delegates, so we have much opportunity remaining.

Today, I ask you to join me in focusing on the battles ahead as we continue our fight for liberty and our Constitution.

Sincerely,

Ron Paul

[sid]

Sounds to me like Ron Paul has accepted he isn't going to win anything and doesn't want to look like a sore looser.

[adissenter2]

  :-\where in the heck is the shaking head in confusion emotion?

GRRRRRRRRRR!  Dr Ron Paul, not even you will get me down!

Come on people, now is the time to double and triple our efforts!!!!!!!!!

RAWWWWWWWWWWWRRR !   Time to engergize people!  REVOLUTION! REVOLUTION!!!!

RON PAUL REVOLUTION!

[EthanAllen_TruthNet Radio]

Sounds to me like Ron Paul has accepted he isn't going to win anything and doesn't want to look like a sore looser.

I had a dog and his name was....

BINGO.

[Beefcake]

I'll give him a pass this time, not like my opinion matters.  I know there was vote fraud simply because Hillary and McCain won and they are the perfect military Industrial complex candidates.  I know Obama is a stooge too in fact everyone is except Ron Paul but Hillary and McCain are particularly unpopular so for them to come out on top is obvious deception.

If we see vote fraud again in Michigan then he has to say something because on super Tuesday its over what is it 25 states vote?  Try recounting that.  It needs to be entered into public consciousness again that our votes are at stake and that its not just something Bush did in 2000 and 2004.  No one in MSM is even talking about vote fraud not even Lou Dobbs damn i mean the guy is pushing Bloomberg these days.  I just don't know i hope he is just passing on NH because others are already doing it. 

Like i said i'll give him a pass on this one just because he is not globalist scum like the others but there gets a point where even if he is better than everyone else if i start thinking that my vote will get given to another candidate then best i not vote.  Some say best way to beat rigging is to have more people vote but i think these machines are pre-programmed with a result so i don't think it matters how many vote they just fix it.  So gl still i mean RP is still my man but  damn deep down i am disappointed.  He could challenge every primary and not lose a single supporter but not challenging them may lose him some.