SHITEGEIST 3: THE T[H]URD BOWEL MOVEMENT | OFFICIAL RELEASE | 2011

[mr anderson]

WTF?  Am I the only one that sees that Jacque's designs won't work in the real world?  It's a f**king joke.  They're going to use alternative energy but still centralize and ration it out.  Wind farms?  Useless idea.  Wind generator on your house, excellent idea.


And, who will give the computer the formula for figuring out the carousel "carrying capacity" of the planet?  Jacque?  Al Gore?  Peter Josephus?


Plus, you gotta love how the New Age Drones always have to label opinions they don't agree with as fundamental christian.    Fvcking give me a break.

Indeed.

a) I'm not a Christian or religious / non-religious in any fashion. However I will not denegerate the debate down to one's belief or disbelief to convince others that the Venus Project is the way of the future.

 ii) That being said I will not be hoodwinked by theosophical / new age indoctrination and allow others to be.

b) I'm not afraid of science or change, I am concerned about the misuse and exploitation of.

c) All beneficial ideas for humanity WILL at some stage be co-opted to mirror the very agenda of the manipulators.

d) The Venus project represents the theoretical applications and benefits for humanity, practical uses have yet and probably never will be realised.

 ii) If such a project is achieved it will take the form of the Venus Project but underneath will be NWO to the core, the black soulless core and TZM advocates will love it. Rest assured if the Venus Project is up and running you'll either join or die.

Oh you V & Z Troopers will say that's not true, it's not possible, violence is "ERADICATED" as if you have Jedi mind powers BUT fast forward decades ahead > you haven't met your fellow V & Z Trooper brethren who've been radicalised in the future enough to alter the ethos and genesis of what the Venus Project once stood for.

They'll offer people to accept the lifestyle of the Venus Project voluntarily, by re-education or by death.

The Venus Project is magnificent, visionary and heaven on Earth but it's not practical without force, coercion and death.

This is a new religion..

[lamourlady]

Indeed.

a) I'm not a Christian or religious / non-religious in any fashion. However I will not denegerate the debate down to one's belief or disbelief to convince others that the Venus Project is the way of the future.

 ii) That being said I will not be hoodwinked by theosophical / new age indoctrination and allow others to be.

b) I'm not afraid of science or change, I am concerned about the misuse and exploitation of.

c) All beneficial ideas for humanity WILL at some stage be co-opted to mirror the very agenda of the manipulators.

d) The Venus project represents the theoretical applications and benefits for humanity, practical uses have yet and probably never will be realised.

 ii) If such a project is achieved it will take the form of the Venus Project but underneath will be NWO to the core, the black soulless core and TZM advocates will love it. Rest assured if the Venus Project is up and running you'll either join or die.

Oh you V & Z Troopers will say that's not true, it's not possible, violence is "ERADICATED" as if you have Jedi mind powers BUT fast forward decades ahead > you haven't met your fellow V & Z Trooper brethren who've been radicalised in the future enough to alter the ethos and genesis of what the Venus Project once stood for.

They'll offer people to accept the lifestyle of the Venus Project voluntarily, by re-education or by death.

The Venus Project is magnificent, visionary and heaven on Earth but it's not practical without force, coercion and death.

This is a new religion..

Nice, Mr. Anderson and I don't say that from any particular point of view or bias.  These are all valid points and well stated.

[Michal Ptacnik]

Well, I just adressed an issue of the people who are fundamental christians and I dared to label them so. I don't see anything wrong with it.

Yes, it can be, and to an extend WILL be coopted. Everything is coopted to an extend. The question is if it will prevent the people from implementing those changes that could be positive and that could work soon for their own benefit; it is, in a sense, a choice between fear and daring hope. Heaven on Earth is not possible, but it is possible to be more effective in managing our existence here, just as it is now much more effective than it had been mere hundreds years ago. You would not want to live in sixteenth century Europe.

The same way, the "realpolitik" of VP will probably not be so sunny and rosy as Fresco and Joseph present them, but even if just the 20% of changes get implemented, it would be a success. Btw. They are really not into global centralization, did you not see the movie? They clearly state that settlements, although THEY should have a central computer, should produce their resources themselves, as much as humanly possible, to reduce the costs of shipping.

You should understand that human behavior is a tribal behavior, we are into small units of friends and relatives; this is exactly it. Those "cities" look like suited for no more than a few hundred people apiece. The city next to it will have it's own resources and computer, yes that will be centralized, and those cities will be connected to a more central level, for utility's sake, and there will be some central authority, for security's sake, but that is no more a control than what we have now when we are "connected" by ties that bind much more tragically - be they laws, need, or the madness of nationalism.

If you want anarchism, true anarchism, then go look over to la la land. You won't find it possible on this Earth without it quickly degenerating into feudal gangland. Some central authority over bigger lumps of resources is necessary, an authority strongly limited; and the realpolitik version of ZTM will have it or it will never survive; it will have both the authority and the strong limitation. Chaos is what made the middle ages so miserable to live in. Scientific (not cultic!) centrar authority is preferable to a central authority based only on charismatic or political power; central authority based on irrational fears of man; though these will certainly not go away, the computer control and the principles of science will be the next pillar to limit the govt from running amok.

As for violence going away, no it won't go away, at least not this way, but it will return to the levels of the "good ol' days" when you did not have to lock your door or your car. That is because ZTM actively seeks to eliminate stress from society, as much as possible, to circulmvent want and need and to channel these things into more productive uses. It uses rational principles based on human nature and natural tendencies. It is at times more optimistic than it ought to be but that's for propagation's sake; you don't smear the product you advertise for. Overall, I like that vision more than this reality.

[Djævlen]

Again, well stated MP.

To me the perfect scenario would be to implement TRUE environmentalist changes (solar, wind, recycling, hybridization, etc..) along with a TRUE Federalist nation and TRUE Laissez-faire capitalism.

 

[37]

I agree, Mr. Anderson, all movements will be co-opted, that's why I won't be taking part in this one.

The only way I would submit to the authority of a machine is if I'm the guy programming it.

Otherwise, it's just another slave master making me conform to something I find completely ridiculous.

No doubt we need to change something...my suggestion is make the family unit more self-sustainable and independent. 

Design and build houses that are more efficiently climate controlled...and produce their own water supply.

They should also be designed to produce some, if not all, of their own energy from the sun and wind.

[Cywar]

Just watch "Demolition Man" - see how wonderful it can be. 

[mr anderson]

Just watch "Demolition Man" - see how wonderful it can be. 

+ 1

Watch 'The Island, Brave New World, Aeon Flux, Equilibrium'

[Michal Ptacnik]

But ZTM is nothing like that and it is a reaction to the same spirit that would bring the world of that movies to reality. It could be co opted and then turn into a dystopia, but that would cease to be ZTM. It's like slandering the FFs for the NWO AmeriCorporation. They never wanted this. If ZTM gives us a country where it's principles will work for two hundred years with a reasonable degree of success, I won't complain.

[Cywar]

+ 1

Watch 'The Island, Brave New World, Aeon Flux, Equilibrium'

+ 2

[Aden]

What do ZM supporters think of this review of the film?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrR0mEkw_D4

[Michal Ptacnik]

As you wish.

Peter Joseph does, and alway has, used the usual marketing techniques to promote his ideas. He does this because these techniques work, whereas not using them will look unprofessional and won't catch. I have learned this the hard way, you have to offer the candy, and this is the candy of advertisement. Now to call it cultish is to confuse things, I'd call it advertisement. And believe me, I see it there and I don't like it. But you just can't succeed without it. You have to narrow down the problem into an example, drag the audience into it, make them picture themselves as a part of that problem, and then offer the solution. Otherwise, you won't deliver your point across, it will seem like "so and so and confusing and let's go watch something else." An experiment to prove it: Try advertising for something while not only using arguments but also counterargument and trying to hold a discourse with yourself on stage to disprove those. It does not work. People are not used to it. They will even think you stupid. Been there, done that. Why did they use a redneck guy? Because "the masses" would not find a real worthy oponent schematic enough, it would confuse the viewer.

Zeitgeist movies were never supposed to be substitutes for real scientific discourse, where that business with counterarguments has it's place, though still, it is not YOU the one with the thesis who presents them, but your oponent. The movies are propagation, and indeed, propaganda to an extend. But they are not all there is to Zeitgeist. And I have contacted the local chapter of ZM and they were not at all cultish in nature, as far as my experience goes. Once again, to use the term cultish is to use guilt by association: Cults use advertising technique, therefore all that uses them is a cult. Well, then McDonalds is a cult by this reasoning...

Now make no mistake, I don't like advertising techniques one bit. Indeed, this is one of the reasons I support ZTM, because they promise a world where they will be made obsolete to an extend. But while man is man, they won't leave us, and they certainly are with us now, when the movie is made and when success with it is sought. Indeed I had to use some in this very post myself, because otherwise you would find it confusing and long; and I feel I was not using them nearly enough to fully prevent this from hapening.

End of part one.

[Michal Ptacnik]

The Emotionaly Weak Individual Problem: It is a bit different, yet similar to the advertising problem, but let's adress it for the sake of the difference. Close to that is the Magic Pill argument, and the Redneck Guy, but I believe that is too similar to the whole advertisement issue and can be resolved by my previous post.

So to the EWIP: First and foremost, the guy and I differ in this; I did not see it there. What I saw was showing collective problems of mankind and individual guilt and so and so were only minimally pointed at; indeed, these collective problems are seen in the subculture this is targetted at and indeed it would be plain stupid not to point at them. They are the "common lingo" of the subculture, they are something we all understand and kind of believe in. So they do not point at YOU, they point at your environment and show a way how to improve it. This is not guiltmongering and a cultish technique, this is communication within a group of one's peers... or supposed peers anyways.

For me, the magic is in showing that it is thinkable to think completely out of the box and that it seems workable. This is in no way, shape or form Satanism. It could be called Luciferianism, that is much harder to refute, but Satanism? Satanism is ego worship (or outright demon worship), but ZTM has nothing in common with either. It is using the worldly tools to better the lot of mankind, with all the flaws and implications of that. But if you want to think like a secularist for a moment, they don't have anything better.

As for the "same shit" and the "human antfarms," well, have you ever noticed that the circular cities are small? And that they are self sustaining? They are much more free, for the individual, than the cities of today, they are in fact a controller's nightmare? People are united in natural tribes which pretty much negates propagandization, they are strong in this natural non imposed unity, stronger than they would be isolated, and they have at their hands a working environment which produces most resources locally. I would not want to be faced with the issue of enslaving those people. Yes, as I've stated above several times, if it was tweaked a bit, then it would end up being a huxleyan distopia, but if we do not engage in speculation and just look at what is offered in content, this is miles and miles from that point, ZTM offers freedom and efficiency and rationality to rule the human condition, as opposed to particularism and corruption. Sorry, but neither the capitalism-cultists, nor the patriots have done or shown me anything that could be even measured up to that ideal.

To dirty my hands in the type of argumentation that goes on here, since that is probably a language that will be understood, nationalism and patriotism has been coopted many times for horrific ends, I don't think Hitler needs mentioning, but look at WWI as even a more deceptive and perhaps even more sickening example; and unlike most of the guilt by association that passes for argumentation here, this is even rather direct and logical, because those really were the fruits of nationalism, it's logical evolution, while the Hitler+Theosophy=>Theosophy <=> Evil is full of holes, imperfect facts and untruths (for instance Hitler was not into Theosophy, he basically made fun of his colleagues that were).

[Michal Ptacnik]

Wow... that ended up being longer than I intended it to be...

[37]

What do ZM supporters think of this review of the film?

Zeitgeist: Moving Forward - Using Cult Indoctrination Techniques
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrR0mEkw_D4

And, we already know what cult Josephus is indoctrinating us into...or, at least, propagandizing"advertising" for.




It's not National Socialism...




Let's see, in his first film he presents the Theosophical view of religion.  In the second film he offers us learned wisdom from a man raised by the Theosophical Society to be the World Teacher and the third film seems to be just part two of the second film. 

He makes sure to flash their gang signs in the first ten minutes...





No offense, I think Left Behind is a bunch of crap, too...religious propaganda usually is.

[Kilgore Trout]

"There is no religion higher than truth"

What exactly is bad about Theosophy?

[37]

"There is no religion higher than truth"

What exactly is bad about Theosophy?

That they channel superhumans...how is that different than Christianity?

[Kilgore Trout]

That they channel superhumans...how is that different than Christianity?

I'm not sure what you mean , What does Christianity have to do with it? It seems that theosophy is saying wisdom can be found in every religion...but that no religion can offer more than the truth one can find within each.

[sharpsteve]

Zeitgeist: Moving Forward - The Freedomain Radio Review
Stefan Molyneux
The good, bad and mad of Marxism with Robots!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pg5K07c72Tw

[Ruth]

I'm wondering when this organisation is going to turn round and say "Aliens are here to 'help' us".     Hasn't happened yet, I just wondered how long we had to wait.

[mr anderson]

I'm wondering when this organisation is going to turn round and say "Aliens are here to 'help' us".     Hasn't happened yet, I just wondered how long we had to wait.

Who magically provide the "automated" computers. That's probably coming in Zeitgeist IV: Age of Aquarius, which will premiere in late 2012. 

[Michal Ptacnik]

Insert Quote
"There is no religion higher than truth"

What exactly is bad about Theosophy?

Exactly. Ifyou want to hear my take on it, Blavatski and a few people around her were honest folk... and I am sure many modern theosopists are as well; but then came people who did not understand the message and begun using it to their own ends.

I'm not sure what you mean , What does Christianity have to do with it? It seems that theosophy is saying wisdom can be found in every religion...but that no religion can offer more than the truth one can find within each

This is one thing theosophy has, even logically, right, whereas Christianity as you define it is in 18th century about it. Of course God would not specially reveal Himself only once, only to one people. God is the God of all. Theosophy has a valid point here. How could be God good if he would keep His light to Himself where it could help so much, only because the vessels were not Jewish? This is almost like some kind of western supremacy, and those where the ideas that promulgated such theology.

I'm wondering when this organisation is going to turn round and say "Aliens are here to 'help' us".     Hasn't happened yet, I just wondered how long we had to wait.

If you subscribe to the Aliens = Nephillim then you would be correct that the ZTM people would probably not react in a christian way. But they would ask questions about the Alien visitors if they were to be asked. If the deception were too good and only those with the HS could discern it, obviously they'd be decived as every other non Christian; but if it for instance was just a Haarp based fake invasion, they would be critical. Also, I don't really feel them being all that pro alien, for lack of a better term, I feel they are humanists and big time into humans helping themselves, so they would not just jump on the bandwagon, they would accept help, but without asking questions first.

[mr anderson]

Exactly. Ifyou want to hear my take on it, Blavatski and a few people around her were honest folk... and I am sure many modern theosopists are as well; but then came people who did not understand the message and begun using it to their own ends.

She's honest alright....

The devil is now called Darkness by the Church, whereas, in the Bible he is called the "Son of God" (see Job), the bright star of the early morning, Lucifer (see Isaiah). There is a whole philosophy of dogmatic craft in the reason why the first Archangel, who sprang from the depths of Chaos, was called Lux (Lucifer), the "Luminous Son of the Morning," or man-vantaric Dawn. He was transformed by the Church into Lucifer or Satan, because he is higher and older than Jehovah, and had to be sacrificed to the new dogma." (7)

7.) Helena Blavatsky, The Secret Doctrine, [Quest Books, 1993], p. 70, 71

"And now it stands proven that Satan, or the Red Fiery Dragon, the "Lord of Phosphorus"... and Lucifer or "Light Bearer" is in us... it is our mind... [our] Redeemer, our intelligent liberator and Savior from pure animalism." Blavatsky, H. P. "The Secret Doctrine." Vol 2 Theosophical University Edition p. 513

"The shadow of the Unknown and Incognizable Deist in Space. But in antiquity and reality, Lucifer, or Luciferus, is the name of the angelic Entity presiding over the light of truth as over the light of day... Demon est Deus inversus: that is to say, through every point of Infinite Space thrill the magnetic and electrical current of animate nature, the life-giving and death-giving waves, for death on earth becomes life on another plane. Lucifer is divine and terrestrial light, the "Holy Ghost" and "Satan," one at the same time." Blavatsky, H. P. "The Secret Doctrine" Vol. 2 pp. 512-513

"... the shadow of the Unknown and Incognizable Deity in Space. But in antiquity and reality, Lucifer, or Luciferus, is the name of the angelic Entity presiding over the light of truth as over the light of the day." (1)

1.) Helena Blavatsky, The Secret Doctrine, [Quest Books, 1993], p. 512

"Demon est Deus inversus: that is to say, through every point of Infinite Space thrill the magnetic and electrical currents of animate Nature, the life-giving and death-giving waves, for death on earth becomes life on another plane. Lucifer is divine and terrestrial light, the "Holy Ghost" and "Satan," at one and the same time." (2)

2.) Helena Blavatsky, The Secret Doctrine, [Quest Books, 1993], p. 513

"Lucifer is divine and terrestrial light, the “Holy Ghost” and “Satan,” at one and the same time, visible Space being truly filled with the differentiated Breath invisibly; and the Astral Light, the manifested effects of the two who are one, guided and attracted by ourselves, is the Karma of humanity, both a personal and impersonal entity: personal, because it is the mystic name given by St. Martin to the Host of divine Creators, guides and rulers of this planet; impersonal, as the Cause and effect of universal Life and Death." (3)

3.) Helena Blavatsky, The Secret Doctrine, [Quest Books, 1993], p. 513

"... like the great teacher H.P. Blavatsky, for whom they had enormous respect, sought to elicit a deeper understanding of the sacrifice made by Lucifer. Alice and Foster Bailey were serious students and teachers of Theosophy, a spiritual tradition which views Lucifer as one of the solar Angels, those advanced Beings Who Theosophy says descended (thus “the fall”) from Venus to our planet eons ago to bring the principle of mind to what was then animal-man. In the theosophical perspective, the descent of these solar Angels was not a fall into sin or disgrace but rather an act of great sacrifice, as is suggested in the name “Lucifer” which means light-bearer." (4)

4.) www.lucistrust.org/en/arcane_school/talks_and_articles/the_esoteric_meaning_of_lucifer (Lucis trust as in Lucifer trust.)

[Michal Ptacnik]

Zeitgeist: Moving Forward - The Freedomain Radio Review
Stefan Molyneux
The good, bad and mad of Marxism with Robots!

Straw man arguments, ad hominem... no, this does not convince me. And the statement that "consumers decide" what things are like is downright laughable. Also that the consumers decide how long things last. Consumers are decided by language of advertisement, consumers are

Central planning will work if it is able to be fast enough in it's reaction system. You can allocate most resources efficiently by producing them on demand (which you simply learn by people telling you what they want to buy) and then on statistical extrapolating that. There are some few goods that will be problematic, but even if they stayed in the free market system, and only the basic needs were met like this, it makes a great sense and would improve the lot of mankind greatly. Scarciy... well, not all resources are functionally scarce if you sufficiently authomate and you create enough production power. They really are scarce, but it will never show.

No you don't want routes to be built by the free market or oil to be produced by the free market. Free market is darwinian. In free market, the weak will be left behind.  And, free market does not work. We don't have truly free market now, but that is not because of a conspiracy, it is because it has degenerated, power and money coagulated, just like by gravity and became something else, something actually more stable; it is really entropy. By entropy, capitalism first slides into socialism (because of the violent reactions from the exploited labourers, or their advocates) and then into feudalism because real power is held by the few and they begin to rule the people and create new political means to keep power in the hands of their descendants. Political power will always follow real power. And in degenerated capitalism, real power does bring in a NWO like structure, by law.

Marxism with robots? Well, yes. But most people do not realize that communism is not socialism. Communism is not statism either, or red terror. Communism is a system where social war has ceased and people are equal, under no or minimal government. It is acrually not a bad system, and no one really attempted to seriously institute it without getting co opted in the very beginning by power hungry elitists; Soviet Russia was not communism, it was an autocratic dictatorship. So, communism with robots? Yes, and not a bad thing too.

The only real question remains, what to do with resources that only have personal value? What to do with fillatelists, and sommeliers and those people who simply like collecting stuff on arbitrary distinction of that staff being a special kind of stuff, old enough, etc. The only solution that I see is in allowing for a limited market there, but that most consumables would not be allowed to enter that market, since they would be under the central system of distribution. But yes, this is not in any way, shape or form a good solution and I hope the Z-people will come with a better one, one not involving "consciousness shift from material cares" or whatever nonsense. They have shown their brilliance in the past.

[Michal Ptacnik]

Ad Blavatski quotes: Most of these quotes are aimed at people who actually study the theosophical doctrines and they have more complex meanings than what they seem to be when taken out of their books without context. For instance, Lucifer is not really the "good guy" as far as I know, theosophy considers Lucifer to be the prevailing force here, the thing that connects us, the "powers in the air," and it actually seeks to liberate us from Lucifer (and then perhaps liberate Lucifer with us), pointing at the fact that most Churches really do worship Lucifer when they engage in a primitive worship and "praying for things," etc.. Therefore this is why she states that "Lucifer is (their version of) Holy Spirit," etc. And Lucifer is in fact our mind and the bearer of (false) light, until a greater light is accessed; until we realize that little earthly good and earthly evil all stem from one cause, one tree, and find the means (Christ) to evade and escape that cause... if you really examine those texts with open mind, you'll see that theosophy is not half as satanic as it is portrayed in the mainstream conspiracy media; they take the verses at their primitive face value, but they were never meant to be taken as such.

I could do the same with the Bible, putting some verses out here out of their context and building accusation has been the staple of false teachers over the ages. The Secret Doctrine is much more prone to that since it presumes the reader to be versed in the symbols of their mysticism. If he is not, he will see the writings in wrong... well, light, in this case, in the light of Lucifer and with him as the explanation. I would summ up the message into: "Popular christians and humanists really serve Lucifer," which is something you usually hear from fundamental christians these days... believe me, you have more friends than you know it.

Remember me saying that true Christianity is much more a spirituality than a religion? Well, here you have another proof.

[Michal Ptacnik]

* consummers are decided. To say that consummers decide is like to say that the sheep decide they take a walk to the butcher.

[mr anderson]

* consummers are decided. To say that consummers decide is like to say that the sheep decide they take a walk to the butcher.

Or.........not walk to the butcher and be picked up by a weirdo with candy in a van extolling promises of additional candy.   

[Michal Ptacnik]

Still they will not be butchered for certainty that way, and if there is only this choice, I take the weirdo before instant death any day in the week.

Anyways, ZTM is not a trap, not yet anyways. It could become one when it gains power, and it is the job of it's adherents not to depart from the principles of critical thought and reason and the purity of purpose... and that is no mean feat, to be sure. As I'd said before, I do believe even in the most optimistic scenario that it would entail some compromises, and not all would be rosy, but still it could be better than what we have now. It is currently an idea, so why oppose it as if it were an organization and a power that seeks to crush you.

[mr anderson]

Still they will not be butchered for certainty that way, and if there is only this choice, I take the weirdo before instant death any day in the week.

Anyways, ZTM is not a trap, not yet anyways. It could become one when it gains power, and it is the job of it's adherents not to depart from the principles of critical thought and reason and the purity of purpose... and that is no mean feat, to be sure. As I'd said before, I do believe even in the most optimistic scenario that it would entail some compromises, and not all would be rosy, but still it could be better than what we have now. It is currently an idea, so why oppose it as if it were an organization and a power that seeks to crush you.

Because we've seen it all before and know something about individualism; 6.5billion inhabitants cannot be assigned to one system or lack of system.

I only oppose what it'll become though.

[Kilgore Trout]

I just want to give a short interpretation of the Blavatsky quotes:

Before "Lucifer" the "Light bearer" man was in an "pet" like state. Knowing not "Good from evil" , the bible seems to explain as much , it also seems to indicate that after the tree of knowledge was eaten of man became conscious of himself , the reason for the fig leafs. It seems logical to conclude that the consciousness brought by the tree of knowledge was the very thing that brought man out of the "pet" state and into a consciousness that is more attuned to the divine.

I know that idea seems to run contrary to orthodox views but when one considers looking at these ideas with a sort of detachment required for reason it seems evident what is being said. To depart from the strong emotions fostered by the church is the way to see this truth. It is afterall only our proximity to perceived conflict that allows us to recognize any such strife at all. it is no coincidence that the "Light bearer" should have been the one to bring man into the light of greater consciousness. If , like the church seems to suggest , you abhor your humanity and value a diminished conscious state , then yes more light and wisdom would seem a negative thing. if on the other hand you value a fuller state of consciouses than "Lucifer" has brought that , for the good.

I am so far removed from the doctrines and strong delusions laid down by orthodox "thought" that I am not at all phased by the false paradigm that pits "God against Satan" , so to see this more objectively is not that hard to do.

[mr anderson]

[Kilgore Trout]

Way to reinforce those ignorant stereotypes informed by the government sanctioned church.

[37]

I'm not sure what you mean , What does Christianity have to do with it? It seems that theosophy is saying wisdom can be found in every religion...but that no religion can offer more than the truth one can find within each.

Just saying that I'm not going to join either cult.

They are both based on ridiculous tenets.

"A superbeing is going to come save us...just wait around for it." (Theosophy believes this as well as every other religion)

"Listen to me, while I tell you why you should listen to no one else."    Okay, Manson, clue me in...

That's a cult.  Plus, have you ever read Blavatsky?  She quotes more Bible than Jim Jones.

Let's see what the Theosophical Society thinks...

Although recognized by H. P. Blavatsky and her teachers as one of the Elder Brothers, Master Kung has been accorded relatively little attention by Theosophists. That is unfortunate, because his teachings are wisely Theosophical. Of all the great spiritual traditions of humanity, Confucianism is the closest to Theosophy in certain respects. Many religious traditions think of this world as a place to be escaped from. But Confucianism and Theosophy think of it as a place where self-realization can be achieved.

...(^^^ So, it is a religion...at least, to it's followers.)   

We should not, however, think of the latter group as some­how “second class” Masters. They too are Elders, far ahead of us in evolution. Our species is now in a stage of its evolution known in Theosoph­ical literature as the Fourth Round. Blavatsky, however, explains (Secret Doctrine 1:162) that Confucius and Plato are Fifth-Rounders because they have evolved psychically, men­tally, and spiritually to the level that will be the norm of humanity in the next round after our cur­rent one—ages in the future. In making this observation, Blavat­sky was quoting one of her teach­ers, Koot Hoomi (or K.H.), who wrote: “Plato and Confucius were fifth round men and our Lord [Buddha] a sixth round man” (Mahatma Letters, chronological letter 66, 3d ed., 14).

http://www.theosophical.org/component/content/article/42-quest-magazine/2153-blavatsky-and-confucius


So, that's the big truth, Kilgore?  That we're fourth rounders.  That we're second class souls.  Doesn't sound like the truth to me.

Plus, Blavatsky had a teacher, so she didn't arrive at the truth on her own, did she?

These people are liars.  Why would you trust someone with such a low opinion of humanity?

Don't be afraid, if you die, you just might come back as a fifth rounder... 

(sigh)awesome... 

[lovkarpin]

that quote is pretty nice 37.

My biggest worry about New-Ageism and especially Theosophy is that through their writing and philosophy they attack the "non-followers" and "profane" as part of the issue that causes the world not to evolve into the spiritual dimension they believe we should be, or that the world's population or whatever is not vibrating to the frequency they want us to vibrate etc...

I'm pretty sure Christians can find peace in their religion without everyone else on the planet being Christians, while most New Age cultists are in the opinion that it is the rest of us that are in their way of their spiritual enlightenment.

[tritonman]

I find the zeitgeist crowd to be extremely troublesome and sacary for much the same reason.  Their hatred of all things Christian seems creepy and deranged most times.  I would put nothing beyond them and given the power they hope to hold over others?  Thanks and no thanks.   It makes you wonder just what kind of life they must have led to think like that.  Good grief.

[Ragtop]

I'm wondering when this organisation is going to turn round and say "Aliens are here to 'help' us".     Hasn't happened yet, I just wondered how long we had to wait.

I love the people who say "There is no God. It's all a myth. blah blah" but they believe in little green men and can't wait for the aliens to come down and visit them

A lot easier to believe there's a Creator than aliens. The Creator's fingerprints are all around.

[Kilgore Trout]

that quote is pretty nice 37.

My biggest worry about New-Ageism and especially Theosophy is that through their writing and philosophy they attack the "non-followers" and "profane" as part of the issue that causes the world not to evolve into the spiritual dimension they believe we should be, or that the world's population or whatever is not vibrating to the frequency they want us to vibrate etc...

I'm pretty sure Christians can find peace in their religion without everyone else on the planet being Christians, while most New Age cultists are in the opinion that it is the rest of us that are in their way of their spiritual enlightenment.

Ther is hardly any "Cult" more "New Age" than Nicean creed Christianity.

[ekimdrachir]

I no longer have any doubt Zeitgeist is a truther trojan horse. Its enough for the sheep who are waking up and don't want to venture into the rabbit hole. They get the 'solutions' they want to hear and that's enough for them. What a nightmare.

[37]

Ther is hardly any "Cult" more "New Age" than Nicean creed Christianity.

Is that like Gnostic Christianity?

[Kilgore Trout]

Is that like Gnostic Christianity?

No that's todays christianity , Gnosticism is far older and runs through the true teachings of every religion. To know the self is to know God , this is the basic idea.

[37]

   Older, but just as ridiculous...