The Insanity of Electric Cars

[xereau]

So I have this little application installed on FireFox called StumbleUpon.

In short, SU gets you to choose from about 500 interests, things you want to view when you click the SU button in your browser.  I have things like cartoons, politics (left and right), gaming, astronomy, genetics, and about 2 dozen more topics selected.  I would say that more than half of the sites I get to come up on SU are of the hipster nihilist green zombie type, which span most or all of my interests.

Today I came upon this.  An innocent little green agenda article on the merits of a hemp built car with zero 'tailpipe' emissions, blah blah blah.

Now, I have had the following thoughts before, but I feel it necessary to lay out my rant on Prison Planet Forum to illustrate just why I nearly stroke out every time I use SU these days:

The zero emission hook is a LIE, a scam, and a total affront to all logic.

Consider the heavy metals used in the batteries in just one car.

A couple hundred kilograms of these metals, just for one car.

Consider just how much oil will be used to extract, refine, manufacture and distribute these metals to battery factories, probably all in Asia.

Consider just where all of these heavy metals are going to come from in the 1st place.

Irregardless of the truth behind CO2 and fossil fuel emmisions, doesn't it seem 'just slightly' hypocritical by these greenies to push the electric revolution?  Has any thought at all been put into their pea brains?  More CO2 will be burnt making the batteries than would be saved in the lifetime of the car.  INSANITY!

There is NOT going to be an electric car revolution.  PERIOD.  It is a devolution.  A dead end.

The logistics of creating 400 million electric cars, JUST for the USA is a ludicrous idea, let alone another 2 billion or more for the rest of the planet.

Extracting iron from an iron cored planet is one thing.

Extracting lead, and lithium, and cadmium, and who knows whatever other heavy metals, all of which are not common, not easy to get at, and dilute, is a completely different story.

This proposed avenue by the green agenda would put a much bigger, much more toxic footprint on the planet than the entire iron mining industry has to date.

Are they insane?

Deluded?

Or is this agenda about 1 more notch in the problem, reaction, solution bandolier of the NWO?

JUST SAY NO TO ELECTRIC CARS.

[Monkeypox]

Not to mention that to power all those electric cars, you'd need to produce more electricity, requiring the construction of more power plants - which electric car proponents don't want.

Proponents of electric cars seem to think that they somehow use no energy, as if they're powered by magic.  I've never heard them discuss the increased electrical generation requirements we'd need if everyone drove an electric car.

[Kilika]

True, they don't seem to discuss that increased demand. With energy, any kind of energy, it must come from somewhere. Batteries don't magically charge up to provide the power to an electric motor. So where do you get that power from? It seems that certain parties are on a mission to get us all hooked up to the new smart grid that will cover(supposedly) all our energy needs, including charging all those new electric car batteries.

And it's a great question; where all the raw matrials going to come from, and how, to make batteries? Not to mention all that extra energy being used to make all those new batteries and then charge and recharge them. And who will be getting paid for all that new energy consumption on their fancy new power smart grid? Think about it people.

Battery power has a place, but it's not a be-all solution. To some degree, combustion engines are part of the mix. It only makes since on smaller scales, and the fuels burned are getting more and more clean. The better solution I think would be a mix of technologies.

One problem mankind is running into in trying to manage itself is time. Man wants to do more and more faster and faster and society moves right along with that overall mindset so that technology dictates how we do things. We could outlaw automobiles as private transportation, and only allow beasts of burden as transport, overnight, by the decisions of the world's governments as a kind of group agreement, but that's not realistic nor how the world works in reality. The world is motivated by money, and money will dictate how things goes, depending on who is in control. Different solutions for different areas and different preferences dictates it must be a mix, but money has the final say, not logic.

Society moves too fast and is spread out too far without drastically changing the time scale that society operates on. Suddenly you would have all kinds of people that couldn't get to work on time riding a horse, unless they drastically changed their life schedule. No more a quick run down to the store that's 10 miles away. Either by bike or horse, it won't be a short venture for just a loaf of bread. Logic would dictate better planning and larger purchases that last longer. That kind of extreme change ultimately wouldn't hurt as it would slow things down a few notches, and be better I think, but it would take more time to make the transition back to horse and buggy days. You could, and most likely should, retain commercial vehicles, but limit commercial motorized vehicles to certain areas, which seperates them from the public to prevent horse and truck interactions where possible. No doubt traffic patterns would change in a huge way.

With todays' technology, I suspect a buggy ride could be quite comfortable. Not to mention bicycle technology. But society would have to change over a period of time, and people want as much perceived comfort as they can get, so I don't see mankind being willing to make such a change.

[poncho]

Not to mention that to power all those electric cars, you'd need to produce more electricity, requiring the construction of more power plants - which electric car proponents don't want.

Proponents of electric cars seem to think that they somehow use no energy, as if they're powered by magic.  I've never heard them discuss the increased electrical generation requirements we'd need if everyone drove an electric car.

I'm all for electric cars.  We may never see them, because big oil and the existing car companies will never allow it.
Think of all the individual componant makers that go out of business.  Carberators, radiators, Pistons, crankshafts, catalytic converters, etc...
They all fight this progress.

But as to where the power comes from, it's the grid.  And the grid can mean power from windmills, hydoelectric dams, solar panels, even nuclear (whether you agree with it or not)
And thing that shaft's big oil is OK in my book.

[Anti-Globalist]

I think it's possible for electric cars to put Oil Barons out of pocket (not entirely though). I have an idea to make electric cars worthwhile with lots of grunt, that's sensible hoon free grunt 

[EvadingGrid]

To be really blunt Electric Cars don't work,( they are chronically inefficient ).

[Anti-Globalist]

To be really blunt Electric Cars don't work,( they are chronically inefficient ).

If an electric car can regenerate itself,then it's problem solved?

[EvadingGrid]

If an electric car can regenerate itself,then it's problem solved?

LOL 


Seriously, if it is going to have batteries it will weigh to much. Electric Cars, hmm... maybe with overhead power cables ?

Really, if given any serious thought rather than wish full thinking they simply don't work.

[Anti-Globalist]

LOL  


Seriously, if it is going to have batteries it will weigh to much. Electric Cars, hmm... maybe with overhead power cables ?

Not quiet overhead power cables.

The cars have been changing shape for fuel reduction.
Reshaping the car for electric regeneration is the key  

[EvadingGrid]

Not quiet overhead power cables.

The cars have been changing shape for fuel reduction.
Reshaping the car for electric regeneration is the key 

Where does the electricity come from ?

As to reshaping what on earth are you talking about.... Is the word aerodynamics missing ?

As to reshaping the car for electric regeneration, do you mean using the petrol engine to generate electricity ?

[Anti-Globalist]

Where does the electricity come from ?

As to reshaping what on earth are you talking about.... Is the word aerodynamics missing ?

As to reshaping the car for electric regeneration, do you mean using the petrol engine to generate electricity ?

Petrol or Gasoline (same diff) becomes obsolete.... Can't say too much more other than Aerodynamics is mostly scraped.

[EvadingGrid]

Petrol or Gasoline (same diff) becomes obsolete.... Can't say too much more other than Aerodynamics is mostly scraped.

Aerodynamics is 1930's technology.

Seriously, electric cars simply do not work. The desire for an electric car can not warp reality.

[Anti-Globalist]

Aerodynamics is 1930's technology.

Seriously, electric cars simply do not work. The desire for an electric car can not warp reality.

Shark skins are rough which enables them to have greater traction to attain greater ''spurts'' of speed to catch their prey. So one would think a shark skin would need to be smooth to attain lesser resistance..... Think outside of the box  Gotta leave this subject alone on the open forum before someone else called Oil Barons catch on... Though I have a few different ''mind models'' for backup against the Global Elite.

[EvadingGrid]

Shark skins are rough which enables them to have greater traction to attain greater ''spurts'' of speed to catch their prey. So one would think a shark skin would need to be smooth to attain lesser resistance..... Think outside of the box  Gotta leave this subject alone on the open forum before someone else called Oil Barons catch on... Though I have a few different ''mind models'' for backup against the Global Elite.

Old news, that is why not to polish the inside of your inlet from the carb to head.

[phosphene]

zero point energy eliminates the electricity production and storage problems, heh.



Nikola Tesla had an Electric Pierce Arrow back in 1930, the ICE engine was replaced with an Electric Motor. The power source was a black box of radio tubes, in the glove compartment. The box had an antenna sticking out. Tesla would fool with some tuners and tune in the right frequency and got 240 volts delivered through the air to his car. The car ran almost silent. He had the car stashed in a barn near Niagara Falls. He was sending the energy from the Power Plant, some how. He said this power could be made possible for everyone. J.P. Morgan did not like the idea, because where do you put the meter? Morgan stopped funding and Tesla's Wardencliffe Tower was destroyed & taken down. Tesla sent a particle beam to the stratosphere and down to Siberia. soon after he leveled an estimated 60 million trees over 2,150 square kilometers, felling them radial outward from the blast center in Tunguska, Siberia, Russia in June of 1908. The tower would have made war obsolete. We were denied this FREE power and NO MOE WAR machine. We were denied the privilege, instead we get wars over false flag operations with so called pilot terrorists with no weapons of MD. Now we pay for gas & get to breath un-natural SMOG from burning dirty hydro-carbons along with 13 bad to breathe chemicals, know to cause cancer. We could be driving our cars with water as the gas, and steam in the tail pipes.

Here is the story : In 1930, Nikola Tesla asked his nephew, Petar Savo, who was born in Yugoslavia in 1899, to come to New York. Petar was 43 years younger than his uncle. Up to that date he had lived under stringent conditions in Yugoslavia, Tesla's country of birth. During the summer of 1931, Tesla took his nephew to Buffalo to unveil and test a new automobile. Tesla had developed it with his own personal funds.

It was a Pierce Arrow, one of the luxury cars of the period. The engine had been removed, leaving the clutch, gearbox and transmission to the rear wheels undisturbed. The gasoline engine had been replaced with a round, completely enclosed electric motor of approximately 1m in length and 65cm in diameter, with a cooling fan in front. Reputedly, it has no distributor. Tesla was not willing to say who had manufactured the engine. It was possibly one of the divisions of Westinghouse.

The "energy receiver" (gravitational energy converter) had been built by Tesla himself. The dimensions of the converter housing were approximately 60 x 25 x 15cm. It was installed in front of the dashboard. Among other things, the converter contained 12 vacuum tubes, of which three were of the 70-L-7 type. A heavy antenna approximately 1.8 meters long, came out of the converter. This antenna apparently had the same function as that on the Moray converter (see chapter on Radiant Energy). Furthermore, two thick rods protruded approximately 10cm from the converter housing.

Tesla pushed them in saying "Now we have power." The motor achieved a maximum of 1800rpm. Tesla said it was fairly hot when operating, and therefore a cooling fan was required. For the rest, he said there was enough power in the converter to illuminate an entire house, besides running the car engine. The car was tested for a week, reaching a top speed of 90 miles per hour effortlessly. Its performance data were at least comparable to those of an automobile using gasoline. At a stop sign, a passerby remarked that there were no exhaust gasses coming from the exhaust pipe. Petar answered "We have no motor." The car was kept on a farm, perhaps 20 miles outside of Buffalo, not far from Niagara Falls.

A few months after this automobile test, and because of the economic crisis at the time, Pierce Arrow had to stop production. It is very likely that the interconnection between the electric motor and the transmission had been performed there. Pierce Arrow's tools were taken over by Studebaker, in South Bend. Not quite 30 years later, that company also vanished to form American Motors, jointly with Nash. Later, some of its fans attempted to resuscitate the Pierce Arrow. Unfortunately, they were not successful.

Thus, today that company's name is in a mausoleum, together with others, such as Horch, Maybach, Hispano-Suiza, Bugatti and Isotta Fraschini.

[mbacolas]

Electric cars would be awesome in sunny areas. Just use solar power!!!!

[EvadingGrid]

Electric cars would be awesome in sunny areas. Just use solar power!!!!

Great for night time driving

[mbacolas]

Great for night time driving

couldnt solar power charge battery cells for night time electricity?

[Kilika]

couldnt solar power charge battery cells for night time electricity?

Theoretically, yes. BUT, it seems your not quite understanding how much energy is used under load, and how much can be created via solar. Yes, they have test cars down in Austrialia for the solar car race that do run on solar power, but look at them! Unpractical at best, and that's the key, is it practical? Nope. Not yet, as electric motors burn up alot of energy, and batteries don't hold that much of a charge when compare to cost and life of the battery charge. Imagine what your home energy bill will be when your charging your car, or two cars every night, and most likely the way they charge is by a "trickle" charge that is a constant load ALL NIGHT. That could be potentially more expensive than running a central air unit full blast all the time in a desert. Now imagine a million homes all now charging their personal vehicles every night and the amount of energy that would require. That puts a huge additional load on the electric grid itself.

You really need to produce the energy yourself to make it practical. Putting reliance on a centralized power source is not wise. The whole eggs and basket thing.

[Anti-Globalist]

Theoretically, yes. BUT, it seems your not quite understanding how much energy is used under load, and how much can be created via solar. Yes, they have test cars down in Austrialia for the solar car race that do run on solar power, but look at them! Unpractical at best, and that's the key, is it practical? Nope. Not yet, as electric motors burn up alot of energy, and batteries don't hold that much of a charge when compare to cost and life of the battery charge. Imagine what your home energy bill will be when your charging your car, or two cars every night, and most likely the way they charge is by a "trickle" charge that is a constant load ALL NIGHT. That could be potentially more expensive than running a central air unit full blast all the time in a desert. Now imagine a million homes all now charging their personal vehicles every night and the amount of energy that would require. That puts a huge additional load on the electric grid itself.

You really need to produce the energy yourself to make it practical. Putting reliance on a centralized power source is not wise. The whole eggs and basket thing.

Yeah produce your own power via wind energy or solar to charge your own battery bank for your self electrical generating car  

[Kilika]

Yeah produce your own power via wind energy or solar to charge your own battery bank for your self electrical generating car  

That would be the idea. However, due to the many different living accommodations people have, it's not realistic for many, such as in apartments or in these subdivisions ruled by HOA's with tiny lots and no room for solar on that scale. Lots of hurdles, not to mention the city building codes you have to deal with.

I wouldn't put it past a city to fine somebody for having a power plant in a residential district because it's not zoned for comercial operations or something. Power utilities have ALOT of say in the community because many cities have contractural agreements for power, so citites have a vested interest in keeping things a certain way too. And some cities even operate their power utilitites. They lose all those power customers and they lose the income for the city.

Technology is a minor factor in the real world.

[PeaceAndFreedom]

Yeah produce your own power via wind energy or solar to charge your own battery bank for your self electrical generating car  

Yes, and more importantly, tweak and refine all these alternative car technologies. While electric cars carry the design deficiencies noted by Evading Grid, that doesn't mean they can't be fixed over time. The evolution of the technology has been inhibited, because Big Oil blocked any mass introduction of electric autos to the market. The gas powered car got a clear path to improve itself over the last half century, what if electric cars had gotten the same fair chance to develop?

[poncho]

Aerodynamics is 1930's technology.

Seriously, electric cars simply do not work. The desire for an electric car can not warp reality.

Why do you think electric cars don't work?

They have already made electric dragsters that have speeds of 290 mph.
The US military uses electric Humvees because they have an extremely low infared heat signature.  Plus they explode less to boot. 
Electric cars have 100% Torque!

[usefulidiot,uselesseater]

Great for night time driving

Shouldn't you be @ home during the night anyway cuz of the NWO curfew? 

[xereau]

Why do you think electric cars don't work?

They have already made electric dragsters that have speeds of 290 mph.
The US military uses electric Humvees because they have an extremely low infared heat signature.  Plus they explode less to boot. 
Electric cars have 100% Torque!

Read my post above?

Electric cars work.  The raw materials needed to make several billion cars worth of batteries, is almost guaranteed to be completely unfeasible.

Heavy metals used to make the batteries are rare, dilute, and hard to get at.

The environmental impact from harvesting these metals would dwarf the gulf oil spill, burning of rain forests, and global coal strip mining.

Now consider, [if] once the 2 billion sets of car batteries are created, how are these batteries going to be powered?

More batteries from solar?  More nuclear plants, something that hasn't expanded in the US since the 70's?  More coal, an energy source that is being phased out world wide?  More natural gas, for which the extraction process ruins massive tracts of ground water basins?

Electric vehicles at BEST is going to be part of the strictly controlled Agenda 21 public transport plan, after personal transport is made illegal.

[Joseon]

So I have this little application installed on FireFox called StumbleUpon.

In short, SU gets you to choose from about 500 interests, things you want to view when you click the SU button in your browser.  I have things like cartoons, politics (left and right), gaming, astronomy, genetics, and about 2 dozen more topics selected.  I would say that more than half of the sites I get to come up on SU are of the hipster nihilist green zombie type, which span most or all of my interests.

Today I came upon this.  An innocent little green agenda article on the merits of a hemp built car with zero 'tailpipe' emissions, blah blah blah.

Now, I have had the following thoughts before, but I feel it necessary to lay out my rant on Prison Planet Forum to illustrate just why I nearly stroke out every time I use SU these days:

The zero emission hook is a LIE, a scam, and a total affront to all logic.

Consider the heavy metals used in the batteries in just one car.

A couple hundred kilograms of these metals, just for one car.

Consider just how much oil will be used to extract, refine, manufacture and distribute these metals to battery factories, probably all in Asia.

Consider just where all of these heavy metals are going to come from in the 1st place.

Irregardless of the truth behind CO2 and fossil fuel emmisions, doesn't it seem 'just slightly' hypocritical by these greenies to push the electric revolution?  Has any thought at all been put into their pea brains?  More CO2 will be burnt making the batteries than would be saved in the lifetime of the car.  INSANITY!

There is NOT going to be an electric car revolution.  PERIOD.  It is a devolution.  A dead end.

The logistics of creating 400 million electric cars, JUST for the USA is a ludicrous idea, let alone another 2 billion or more for the rest of the planet.

Extracting iron from an iron cored planet is one thing.

Extracting lead, and lithium, and cadmium, and who knows whatever other heavy metals, all of which are not common, not easy to get at, and dilute, is a completely different story.

This proposed avenue by the green agenda would put a much bigger, much more toxic footprint on the planet than the entire iron mining industry has to date.

Are they insane?

Deluded?

Or is this agenda about 1 more notch in the problem, reaction, solution bandolier of the NWO?

JUST SAY NO TO ELECTRIC CARS.

Well thought out thread Xereau.

Electric cars can not be made for everyone and only 'wealthy' people are going to be able to afford them. More likely the electric car is for the rich human being that has won the labyrinth of resource management, or financial luck, to able to drive these darn electric cars in a signficantly reduced human population around the world.

[Paranoid Puppet Master]

Another thing about the power consumption of electric vehicles, is that the power lines in the "grid" are not 100% efficient. So a certain amount of power is created at the power plant. By the time it gets to your giant lead-acid battery powered car, some of the energy has been lost along the way.

I'll bet that when they say the car gets an equivalent of a certain MPG, that's based on how much energy is being used at the car, and not how much energy actually had to be produced at the power plant to deliver the required amount of energy to the car.

Plus, there's the lead poisoning. Doesn't sound likes it's so good for the environment, but it does seem to fit the "green" agenda:


China Lead Poisoning: Over 600 Sickened In Latest Incident, Including 103 Children
06/12/11 05:29 AM ET

BEIJING -- More than 600 people, including 103 children, have been sickened in China's latest case of mass lead poisoning, state media reported Sunday.

China has suffered widespread problems in recent years from heavy metal contamination, with thousands of children affected by lead poisoning in several provinces in 2009 and 2010 because they lived near metal smelters or battery factories.


more:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/12/china-lead-poisoning-over_n_875605.html

[Brocke]

Where would we be now and what kind of technology would we have if battery powered electric automobiles had been developed to their potential rather than combustion engines...


Electric Car Timeline 1832 and 1839

1832-1839
Scottish inventor Robert Anderson invents the first crude electric carriage powered by non-rechargeable primary cells.

1835
American Thomas Davenport is credited with building the first practical electric vehicle -- a small locomotive.

1859
French physicist Gaston Planté invents the rechargeable lead-acid storage battery. In 1881, his countryman Camille Faure will improve the storage battery's ability to supply current and invent the basic lead-acid battery used in automobiles.

1891
William Morrison of Des Moines, Iowa builds the first successful electric automobile in the United States.


Thomas Edison and an electric car. Photo courtesy of the Smithsonian

1893
A handful of different makes and models of electric cars are exhibited in Chicago.

1897
The first electric taxis hit the streets of New York City early in the year. The Pope Manufacturing Company of Connecticut becomes the first large-scale American electric automobile manufacturer.

1899
Believing that electricity will run autos in the future, Thomas Alva Edison begins his mission to create a long-lasting, powerful battery for commercial automobiles. Though his research yields some improvements to the alkaline battery, he ultimately abandons his quest a decade later.

1900
The electric automobile is in its heyday. Of the 4,192 cars produced in the United States 28 percent are powered by electricity, and electric autos represent about one-third of all cars found on the roads of New York City, Boston, and Chicago.

A Ford Model T
1908
Henry Ford introduces the mass-produced and gasoline-powered Model T, which will have a profound effect on the U.S. automobile market.

1912
Charles Kettering invents the first practical electric automobile starter. Kettering's invention makes gasoline-powered autos more alluring to consumers by eliminating the unwieldy hand crank starter and ultimately helps pave the way for the electric car's demise.

http://www.pbs.org/now/shows/223/electric-car-timeline.html

[Rebelitarian]

There's a solution it is called the Newman Generator.

If the US Gov't would grant him a patent our energy needs would be solved.

However since the Dept. of Energy is run by robber barons...   

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3484490731703421398&pr=goog-sl#

[maximumbrainpower]

The zero emission hook is a LIE, a scam, and a total affront to all logic.

Consider the heavy metals used in the batteries in just one car.

A couple hundred kilograms of these metals, just for one car.

Consider just how much oil will be used to extract, refine, manufacture and distribute these metals to battery factories, probably all in Asia.

Consider just where all of these heavy metals are going to come from in the 1st place.

Irregardless of the truth behind CO2 and fossil fuel emmisions, doesn't it seem 'just slightly' hypocritical by these greenies to push the electric revolution?  Has any thought at all been put into their pea brains?  More CO2 will be burnt making the batteries than would be saved in the lifetime of the car.  INSANITY!

There is NOT going to be an electric car revolution.  PERIOD.  It is a devolution.  A dead end.

The logistics of creating 400 million electric cars, JUST for the USA is a ludicrous idea, let alone another 2 billion or more for the rest of the planet.

1. I have seen this Documentary titled: WHO KILLED THE ELECTRIC CAR? which is all about how a major Automobile Company in America built a good electric car, proved that it was better than gasoline cars, and then turned around and recalled all of them- which they could do, because they only leased them to those whom they gave them to to test- and quietly destroyed every one of them, except one or two put on display somewhere.

They did this so that they would keep selling gasoline cars, and keep the public in bondage to Oil.
The idea that they would Save the Planet by reducing carbon emissions was not a consideration.

The Electric Car is feasible. It has been done.

2. Considering the Heavy Metals used in a Battery:

Yes, so? There is plenty of Lead, Zinc, Copper and whatever else you want to use to make a battery.
If Electric Cars came into vogue, Battery Technology will improve. Much better Batteries will be invented, or come out into the light.
There are more ways to make a battery than are currently in use. There are plenty of minerals to do so. Do you know that there are nuggets of Manganese just laying around on the Sea Bed? That is just the one mineral. All these things will get tapped.

3. How much oil will be used to make one battery?

I do not believe that it can possibly be "more oil than the electric car saves in its entire life."
What do you think this is- a Golf Cart? This Technology will save using thousands of gallons per year, if Green Power Sources are used.
Its about time they trotted out the Solar Furnace. What's the record for Solar Mirror Furnace? 3,000^oC?

I don't know why people just assume that no one else can solve technical problems that they can't!
Don't you know by now, that there is always someone smarter than anyone you can lay hand on?

4. The logistics of creating 400 million cars:

All these people who were put out of work when their factories were outsourced, that your talk show hosts and guests kept mourning.
They didn't all get sent to Guantanamo, did they? (Sorry for that.) I keep thinking of the productivity of your factories during World War II.
Americans can build any amount of anything, if they want to. Especially when they think they're gonna die if they can't pull this off!

All they have to do is to not give the contract to you, is all.