Tips To Survive: What Will You Do When The Crap Hits The Fan?

[Toveri B]

If you plan to get some night vision equipment you should read this http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/nightvision.htm
The main thing is that old technology uses a infrared lamp which is like holding a flash light to someone that looks at you whit night scope. And most likely your enemy has some kind night vision, most likely they have newer technology which does not have this ir-lamp in them. So they can see you but you can't see them.

If you plan to live in wilderness in relative small area you should dig several dugouts, for example a days walk apart. These dugouts should have many exits and they must be camouflaged so well that someone can walk over them whit out detecting them. If you live in north this is only way in winter (lot better than tent).
This way you have many safe places to go. Lots of storage space so you don't need to carry all your stuff all the time (like when you go hunting). If one is found you don't loose all your stuff, you can even drop what you are carrying when you need to escape realy fast if you know that you have enough in storage.
If you got group of people allso dig trench and make traps for defense. Of course this makes it more easy to find you.
Estonian Voitka's brothers did flee army service to forest in 1986. Red army did not find them eventhough    hundreds of soldiers were seeking them. They were captured by Estonian police in year 2000. So it's    possible to live in dugouts for 14 years and not be found.

You need hot spice like chili in powder form. If you are chased by dogs throw that powder on ground and it 
will cover you smell. If it's hot enough spice it will even make dogs loose their sense of smell for a long time.

If you know something about electronics you can make a generator from car battery charger that works on power of your muscles (works every where and any time except under water). Only negative thing is that it's quite heavy (1-3Kg). But you got electricity for any device and it can make fire by spark or whit any resistor that does not melt (like iron nail).
Just put a crank or bicycle gear or something to car battery charger so you can rotate it.

Car spring can be used to throw grenade or molotov's coctail to about 100 meters.
(Polish resistance used this in WW2)

[basil_brush]

I highly recommend this book:

http://www.gardeningguild.com/tradingpost/lazy/veggie.asp

I read a copy from the library and I was amazed at how easy it is to get big crop yields even in the worst of horticultural conditions - like a stony soil with hardly any nutrition. The pot growing technique used fits nicely with what earlier poster said about raised beds and using tyres etc. Awesome book. Reading it will inspire you to try growing your own food even if you usually regard yourself as useless at growing stuff. The author also recommends using traditional seed varities, as opposed to the commonly available agriculture derived varities, as they are often superior in quality and tend to crop for a longer season - agri varities are bred to all crop at once in a short period, which for a home grower leaves them with the problem of how to store and preserve it all.

I also agree with mikekey, seeds will be crucially important for those seeking rural refuge.

But bear in mind most veges need a full growing season. If you need to be mobile and don't want to hang around in one area too long then plant something that will crop within 4-6 weeks, like pack choi or radish etc. Read seed packets familiarise yourself with the different growing requirements.

[jbrid1138]

Something in this regard popped into my head this morning (Sepember 11th. 2007) // yes, what IF the crap hits the fan as the subject so correctly ask? 

What would something like let's say like one or two or four nuclear-tipped cruise missiles being carried on a USAF airplane w/o anyone's knowledge (now who in their right mind can accept that as an answer?  Not me, right mind part, not the answer part).  What if that airplane had crashed into let's say -- Indianapolis, Indiana -- and of course our President reacting within the law as he has had it changed which allows him to take over complete control (more than he usually has) locking everything down under martial law in the case of an emergency // what would that martial law and the confusion of a nuclear explosion and the loss of a major mid-western city do to us truth seekers?

What would keep us together as a group, one that was in search of TRUTH and a better life for all?  Would knowing how to trap rain water in an open otherwise sanitary container do us much good then?  Don't know if anyone suggested that as a means of collecting drinking water -- but keep it in mind as it (the rain) floats down through that radioactive cloud that surrounds our land.

What would keep us together where we are as we are today? -- Maintaining hope for a better future and the day that the guilty in 9/11 can be brought to justice.  What if?

Wouldn't something like this (martial law) drastically restrict open and free exchange of ideas?   How will we survive that? 

Damn, I wish I wouldn't have such thoughts as this.   

[maddog3n]

Jbird- your right my friend that's is exactly what would happen.

[ﮐ≡≡ﮐ ŦħíИgﮐ]

if youre not in the darn fallout zone, and this only temporary emergency measure, digging down and making the earth condensation collector can give some water.. plastic, a rock, a collection cup.. but RAIN will wash rads into the soil.. and then what ?

if youre closer to the event, likely water you've stored has already been slammed, these "elite" dont care, they have their bunkers and supplies,
survivors should be darn sure to seal them in from the outside forever
because we'll know they are the ones who made it all happen.

I hate these terrorists, "our" government and the MIC.

[Bossgator]

It's an ugly thought jbrid, but it could happen. That's the point of doing your best to prepare, but you just can't prepare for everything or everywhere. That's the sucks part!

How do we stay together? First, we'll always be together in heart and mind, and from there, we just have to work it out at the local level. No easy answer I'm afraid.

[Cruise4]

I just want to congratulate everyone who is contributing to this thread. Regardless of what may or may not happen this is very interesting and useful information. Even if nothing bad happens some of this stuff can help get out from under 'corporate'.

[mikekey.com]

Some vermin have kevlar hides, how do I PUNCH THROUGH?

What are some nice rounds to stock pile that go through kevlar like butter?

[mikekey.com]

exploding rounds would be nice too

[Bossgator]

Since you ask, consider that it may well be best to not attack the defensive strength, but with a well-placed round, you can find the soft spots!

Also, remember, in combat, an injured soldier is just as good as a dead one. And actually, some times it's more effective because you effectively remove from battle more than just the injured, but also those attending and defending the injured.

"Spray and pray" can be very effective in some situations.

[SemperParatus]

For instance, did you know that the leaves of the Poke Plant are edible? Boil them up with a touch of salt, and they are really quite good (better than spinach IMHO). Just do not eat the berries, stalk, or roots of this plant, as it will make you extremely sick. Only the leaves are edible.

RWS

I'm new here and this is my first post if it goes through. In reading through posts by RWS I see a great desire to contribute and mostly it is very good stuff. However the above quote is my reason for registering. I am from the south and grew up eating pokeweed. It is a delicious green but it must be prepared properly or it is deathly poisonous. The red color in pokeweed is arsenic. You have to boil it and pour the water off and start over 3 times to remove that. It's not a big issue really if you do it properly and you have an adequate water supply. My grandmother ate pokeweed all her life. It was probably her favorite green. She lived to the ripe old age of 94 and the cause of death was not pokeweed poisoning. Just boil the arsenic out of it and pour that off and you'll be ok.

RWS, please don't think I'm flaming you. I'm not. I see in your posts a great desire to be of service. I'm sure that if you'd been aware of that fact you'd have posted it. I look forward to reading many more of your posts.

Respectfully,

Ed

[jbrid1138]

I'm new here and this is my first post if it goes through. In reading through posts by RWS I see a great desire to contribute and mostly it is very good stuff. However the above quote is my reason for registering. I am from the south and grew up eating pokeweed. It is a delicious green but it must be prepared properly or it is deathly poisonous. The red color in pokeweed is arsenic. You have to boil it and pour the water off and start over 3 times to remove that. It's not a big issue really if you do it properly and you have an adequate water supply. My grandmother ate pokeweed all her life. It was probably her favorite green. She lived to the ripe old age of 94 and the cause of death was not pokeweed poisoning. Just boil the arsenic out of it and pour that off and you'll be ok.

RWS, please don't think I'm flaming you. I'm not. I see in your posts a great desire to be of service. I'm sure that if you'd been aware of that fact you'd have posted it. I look forward to reading many more of your posts.

Respectfully,

Ed

I've been monitoring this thread (because of the true importance it has) and w/that said -- I'd like to say WELCOME SEMPERPARATUS // Excellent first post, that'd be an excellent any number (??) post.  You may very well have saved someone's life you sharing that knowlege.

Keep those life-saving ideas coming, folks.

[jbrid1138]

eat insects. grasshoppers and non venimous insects that is. worms and grubs like damp places but you can dig them up nearly anywhere. could save your life.

also.

plastic bags tied off around tree leaves after a few hours will perspire water. 50 plastic bags will keep you with drinking water.

live on the coast?> dig 50ft inland from waters edge and deep and you'll find fresh filtered water.

or.

dig a hole about 1ft deep, fill it with green leaves and a container in the center and put a sheet of plastic over it with a small rock in the middle and seal the edges with dirt, the container will fill with evaporation. you can urinate on the leaves and that will recycle the water to. DONT DRINK YOUR OWN URINE. thats gross and not needed.

most grass roots are edible.

to test if something is edible, take a small piece and smell it, smell okay? little taste, not bitter? eat a small amount very small wait 6 hrs no diarroea or vomiting? its safe to eat.

hot water systems have water when water gets turned off.

just a few ideas to survive.

On second thought, if you don't mind, I think I'll pass on that dinner invitation you extended.  Something's come up and I think it's my breakfast after reading all that.  Thanks for understanding.

You must be a Special Forces/Ranger/SEAL kind of guy.   Were snakes on that menu of yours -- did I miss seeing snakes for desert?  That's what they do, that's what they live on if necessary, as I understand it.  And here I go complaining and wanting to send my tomato soup back because there's a hair in it.  

[In_Formation]

Some vermin have kevlar hides, how do I PUNCH THROUGH?

What are some nice rounds to stock pile that go through kevlar like butter?

Federals have excellent stopping power with very low recoil, as far as thier ability to penetrate armor goes, I'm not entirely sure.

Typically your armor piercing ammo would be full metal jacketed rounds (steel or other hard metal core coated with copper, or teflon, the purpose of the coating is to protect the rifling groves that are cut into the bore and nothing to do with the penetrating power)

The hard steel core of the round is where the penetrating power comes from. I have seen FMJ's for sale on some sites, they are out there, just gotta look around a bit. The federals are easy to get, and they are as common as any other run of the mill ammo.

[jbrid1138]

I say we need to get us one of these puppies --
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hma_Bh45bD8

Then -- 'what will and what not' is likely to penetrate a vest is of no real consequence.

[Rock]

Nuff Said!  http://www.paintballzone.com/snipers_corner.htm


Rock

[laidbackguy1972]

     Hello everyone! This is my first post on this site. I have read many suggestions on this thread. A few thoughts came to mind... it is a great idea to be prepared, however if the first time you use your supplies is during an emergency, you could very well be your own worst enemy. If you purchase, trade, etc. for equipment get out and use it, find out if it truly works the way you hope it will. During an emergency is the wrong time to get familiar with your supplies. Better to find out now you or your equipments shortcomings, than when your family is looking to you for their survival and you're floundering with new equipment you have yet to use. Some have mentioned extravagant lists of equipment to bug out with, this in my opinion is foolish. The more non-essential garbage you drag along, the larger your footprint on the ground. Also some have mentioned growing food...the seeds you find in stores are genetically modified and will produce a crop for 1 year, and the seed from these plants WILL NOT allow you to grow a following crop. You have to find heirloom variety seeds of the veggies you would like, as only heirloom varieties will allow you to also harvest their seed for a following years crop. One last point of interest, some have mentioned their neighbors thinking they are "crazy" for stocking up on food and such...well first off, why would you jeopardize your families security by allowing the neighborhood to know what supplies you have. Most of our neighbors are nice people in our current environment, however in a true survival situation, everyone who knows of your "food prep" or coveted equipment can and will turn into your enemy if their family is not "making it" so well...anyhow just a few thoughts. Take care one and all.

[In_Formation]

[ollie1]

Hi everyone,
Newbie here.  After reading through the entire thread, I've become a little anxious and scared.  I'm a single Mom of 2 little girls and I have an aging Mother. We cannot go run and hide and I am not the type to own a hand gun.  (Peace-loving, tree-hugging sap that wears her heart on her sleeve, brings home strays, etc............but, luckily I'm not stupid.  Being prepared is always wise.

Someone mentioned a Co-op. I  had visions of Jim Jones.
How about if we could organize different areas or zones?  Then have a designated spot or two for people to meet-up.  There is safety in numbers.

I hate having to think of all the different scenarios!!!  Gotta go puke now..........lol.   

[laidbackguy1972]

A very interesting subject for all to check out are solar ovens. They can be made from anything from cardboard and tinfoil to premade units, and are used in many 3rd world countries for daily cooking. They can be used from stews, to bread, to canning. They also require no gathering of a fuel source and give off no smoke. Obviously the more sun in the area you live the more hospitable this idea would be for you. Take care everyone!

http://www.solarcooking.org/images/gallery-box.htm

[laidbackguy1972]

Is there any sort of Camo out there that can hide your heat at night while you sleep?
Getting spotted by a unmanned scout drone at night would be a pain, especially if it drops a bomb on me.

Not sure on Infra-red blocking camo, but here is a product that is definitely worth a look at, and it could be incorporated into a shelter or clothing. Sold in different length rolls, and blocks 97% of your heat signature.

http://www.discount-hydro.com/productdisp.php?pid=552&navid=33


I think you'll find this would suit you well for what you seek, good day!

[beelzebush]

help !!!   http://info.detnews.com/feedback/lettersindex.cfm?topic=GOP_debate_1009&forum=dnletters

[wilson]

Hi everyone,
Newbie here.  After reading through the entire thread, I've become a little anxious and scared.  I'm a single Mom of 2 little girls and I have an aging Mother. We cannot go run and hide and I am not the type to own a hand gun.  (Peace-loving, tree-hugging sap that wears her heart on her sleeve, brings home strays, etc............but, luckily I'm not stupid.  Being prepared is always wise.

Someone mentioned a Co-op. I  had visions of Jim Jones.
How about if we could organize different areas or zones?  Then have a designated spot or two for people to meet-up.  There is safety in numbers.

I hate having to think of all the different scenarios!!!  Gotta go puke now..........lol.   

 I wouldn't worry about collapse or any of that apocalyptic stuff.  People have been saying this since carter was president and before. People who arranged their lives based on the end of the world didn't do very well. 

Now I grant that the totalitarian takeover of what once was a republic is  in place, most likely because that is the purpose and outcome of having a government at all, rather than some grand design. Could be wrong. If I am,the effects will be pretty much identical.


I do think it prudent to have a plan. If it is possible you could move to one of the "free states"  Wyoming or New Hampshire. Or Montana.

Or join some of the other freedom forums such as www.thementalmilitia.com  They have meetups.

I think it is important to seek out like minded people.  It is kind of difficult because in my experience most people are so heavily brainwashed that they are completely unable to have a thought that wasn't placed in their minds.

[bmga1776]

ok, here goes. 

You must decide on what you need that will work for you.  Most items will work for most people, but you may have different circumstances.  Here is my ideas/lists/thoughts.

1.  Must have as much storeable food as you can afford.  You can do it somewhat cost effective with new 5 gallon paint
     containers, mylar bags, and oxigen absorbers. Or you can go to efoods directs or freeze dry guy.  Best, do a little of
     everything.  At least one year supply but 3 or 5 years is better.  Freeze dry guy has great articles on what to have.
     This is for sheltering in place.

2.  Put together three sets of bags. (if you want my list, I already have it and can email it to you if you want)
     A Bag - Only what you can carry on your back (one for every member of your family)
     B Bag - What you can load in your vehicle in about 20 min or so and bug out.  (A Bag included. You may have to
                abandon your vehicle.
     C Bag - You can get some sort of trailer (camping, uhaul, etc...) load it up with as much food, blankets, Guns, Ammo,
                Camping equipment etc...as you can. Then bug out.

3.  If you live in a city or not way out in the wilderness, MAKE at least 7-10 escape routes out of the area.  Travel those
     routes and get to know them intemately.  You life will depend on it.

4.  Get maps (topo) of all the areas you plan to go.  Go to those areas and camp out, have a picnic in them, hike the
trails, look
     at any cabins, shelters, caves, fallen trees, etc....you can use to shelter.  Don't expect to stay in one place, have
     alternate places to go.

[JConner]

What, is everyone 'preparing' to live like refugees??

Forget that. The plans we need to make are the plans for restoring the Republic, not living like Palestinians.

Folks, tune in to WTPRN www.wtprn.com.32k.asx 4-6 pm CST every weekday and listen to the Intelligence Report.

You'll find solutions.

Also, get the book 'Patriots: Surviving the Coming Collapse' by James Rawles ( www.survivalblog.com ) and read it - it's a novel written for the purpose of disseminating survival-preparedness information.

And remember - the phrase 'Resistance is futile' is a bunch of poppycock.

[GapeDrape]

Hello everyone...great thread!!!  I have been thinking about these scenarios for over 7 years now and I hope nothing happens but these people are like f#$cking rabid wild dogs who are backed in a corner right now and they are scared of US!!!  It will be very unpleasant for us here if it happens this winter I'm afraid.  See we live at 9,000ft and there is already a foot of snow on the ground with more on the way.  I can probably bushwack to lower altitudes but it could take weeks of postholing through waste deep snow with very little or no food to offer till spring.  Water is no problem...snow and lack of animals during winter is what concerns me.  Also what about tracks?  Big postholes are easy to see from planes or helicopters.  Aaaaargh!!!.....I wish I was in a warmer place!!!!

Anyway, I have some ideas I will share later for more survival tips..

[wtaylor]

3.  If you live in a city or not way out in the wilderness, MAKE at least 7-10 escape routes out of the area.  Travel those
     routes and get to know them intemately.  You life will depend on it.

And if you live in Houston (like I do)... you're screwed.  We saw a wonderful picture of how impossible it is to leave this city when the proverbial pooh hits the fan and everyone panics back in 2005 with the hurricane rita (engineered) fiasco.

This is a great thread, it's going to take me days to read through all of the ideas posted here.  I think I recognize some of you all from the similar thread that was posted on ron paul forums the other day ;-)

But what I'd really like to see... is ideas on surviving, defending, etc. if you're stuck *in* the city.  There are more of "us" in the cities than we realize sometimes, I think...

[PatriotX]

With regards to why all this hasn't come crashing down on us "yet" - all I got to say is that eventually the sky really does fall.....And all the indicators are that it will be much sooner than later!  But if you are immersed in the system via debt and every conceivable "worldly" interest, you are going to have an awful time getting out of the hole you are digging for yourself...as they ratchet up the pressure incrementally.  So yes, try to enjoy life (a real part of the mental survival aspect), and get yourself and family in a position to leave the system if and when necessary.  Taking the RFID implants should not be an option.  Fight the good fight unto the very end.


Patriot X

[independentWV]

Hey Folks I can provide plant names for medicinals and post pics expert in this area but might need thread just for that because they are so many. What does everybody think about that idea? Also, need to keep your location in mind what grows in my area might not grow in yours. One thing, start now making seed bank and store in freezer.

[zdux0012]

The AreoGrow it's a hydoponic toaster (it grows food)

[PatriotX]

Hey IndepentdentWV.

Go ahead and start your own thread.  That is what you're here for.  Share the love.


Patriot X 

[jamba]

There are lots of great ideas here, but I've been thinking that for many, bugging out isn't going to be the best option, or the option of first resort. Families with small children, and other various family configurations may well do better laying low and living as closely to normal as possible. I think it's far easier to go unnoticed laying low in your own home than running around with 6 little kids commando style. 

I know stocking our basic first aid kit for the extra contingencies has been on my mind. Lots of triple-antibiotic ointment. I also keep fresh garlic for antibiotic purposes, 2-5 whole cloves a day works well to fight infection.

I've also been thinking...anyone married, hoping to marry, or hoping one day to fornicate should be prepared for unassisted childbirth in case the natural course of life unfolds. Not everyone's sterile yet. 
So maybe cord clamps and a book on childbirth (or rudimentary knowledge of it) should be a part of everyone's first aid kit.

[Zed]

Federals have excellent stopping power with very low recoil, as far as thier ability to penetrate armor goes, I'm not entirely sure.

Typically your armor piercing ammo would be full metal jacketed rounds (steel or other hard metal core coated with copper, or teflon, the purpose of the coating is to protect the rifling groves that are cut into the bore and nothing to do with the penetrating power)

The hard steel core of the round is where the penetrating power comes from. I have seen FMJ's for sale on some sites, they are out there, just gotta look around a bit. The federals are easy to get, and they are as common as any other run of the mill ammo.

That depends on what kind of Armour you need to Penetrate.
(FYI: FMJ is not a AP Round, and as an FYI for those who don't know Purpose Made AP Ammo is not restricted by most states)

If it's Body Armour, Most FMJ Hunting Calibers will do it (7mm+).
If it's Vehicle Armour, you will need at least a .50BMG with Raufoss or SLAP Rounds. (See this Video)
(The best is a LAW with a Shaped Charge AP Round)

[dystopia]

Also, why the hell are all of you going to go run out into the woods when Martial Law comes? You'll be the first weirdos they round up. The resistance is always in the midst of the occupation, not hiding in the woods.

That's true, you'd be 10x more effective if you blend in. The most difficult resistance to deal with is that which melts back into the population.

Why not go all the way? Become a fed or a cop.

[PatriotX]

What, is everyone 'preparing' to live like refugees??

Forget that. The plans we need to make are the plans for restoring the Republic, not living like Palestinians. - J Conner


I think we need both.  Don't know that "refugee" would be the correct choice for the part we must play.  "Overcomer", "Survivor", sounds more like it!

I recommend spending more time researching the survival part.  Unless you intend to be "chipped".  From what I can tell, it is coming sooner than later.  They are probably going to just skip the intermediary steps altogether due to the "awakening" that is happening across the land....

They will knock down the grid, force rations of food, instigate martial law, and you must get "CHIPPED" or you will not be able to buy or sell.  Hardly sounds like a restoration process if this is indeed where we are headed. 


Patriot X

[predictionsarchive]

  What happened to the "hope for the best, plan for the worst" category?

[Kpezzy]

awesome firearm trading and purchase site     http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=14

[Kpezzy]

The best of the best, this is the same as our men and women are wearing over seas With VERY low prices $225 for a Bullet prof Vest, i hope this helps for people that are in the market for personal protection..... http://www.qm-supply.com/zenstore/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=12_13

[Kpezzy]

The best of the best, this is the same as our men and women are wearing over seas With VERY low prices $225 for a Bullet prof Vest, i hope this helps for people that are in the market for personal protection..... http://www.qm-supply.com/zenstore/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=12_13

P.S. i suggest the Military issue Interceptor vests! very nice tried and tested armor

[epinlasvegas]

It is definitely better to die on your feet than live on you're knees.Have a place ,and a plan to meet-up if things go south have supplies but stay and fight.I think people should be blending in and showing Endgame or things to people.Try and convert them especially the police.I train with police as well as PSD guys(yes some of my buddies worked with Dyncorp, Blackwater as well as trinity and others).Heres a secret,THEY ARE JUST LIKE MOST OF US! I am trying to get a training course started with some of the PSD guys for people like us as we speak.Top of the line up to date Close quarter battle techniques are crucial.You need to train on at least a biweekly basis, firearms skills are perishable skills (as are martial arts skills).If you're not prepared and constantly training you're lost.Just my 2 cents