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Author Topic: Joe Stack IRS Suicide Pilot Conspiracy  (Read 5314 times)
michaelsuede
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« on: February 18, 2010, 08:59:42 PM »

I authored this article on Fascist Soup:

Oddities I notice:
How did anyone find out who the pilot was so quickly? - and how did the media find his obscure web site rant so quickly?

Then there’s this weirdness, how do you get stories this conflicting?

Quote
Stack, who moved to Austin from California a few years ago, complained he could not make a living with his software company, Embedded Arts.

Around 8 a.m., Stack's house in North Austin was set ablaze, officials said.

A neighbor rescued his wife, classical pianist Sheryl Housh Stack, a teaching assistant at the University of Texas, and her 12-year-old daughter, Margaux, according to KXAN-TV.

Other reports said the wife and daughter arrived home after spending the night in a hotel to find the house burning.

note, page since modified now reads as follows:

Quote
Witnesses told KXAN-TV they saw a neighbor rescue Stack's wife of two years - classical pianist Sheryl Housh Stack, a teaching assistant at the University of Texas - and her 12-year-old daughter, Margaux.



More weirdness:
Quote
Update: CNN reports that a federal official claims the pilot had set his house on fire beforehand, stole the plane and crashed it intentionally. The FAA said the plane departed Georgetown Municipal Airport, north of Austin, about 9:40 a.m., and that the pilot did not file a flight plan.

Opposed to:
Quote
Joe Stack, who owned a small plane, was missing…

The four-seat single-engine Piper Cherokee came in low, nearly hitting power lines, and was roaring at full throttle on impact, the witnesses said.

The tail number matched Stack’s plane, officials said.

Remarkably, though the plane hit a seven-story office building just before 10 a.m., sparking a 50-foot fireball and breaking most of the windows, only two people were injured.

Opposed to:
Quote
AUSTIN, Texas (CNN) – Austin fire officials say one person’s unaccounted for after a small plane crashed into an building that houses offices of the Internal Revenue Service. According to CNN, The pilot of the plane had set his house on fire beforehand, stole the plane and crashed it intentionally, a federal official told CNN.

The Federal Aviation Administration is reporting to CNN that the plane departed Georgetown airport north of Austin about 9:40 a.m. and was a Cirrus SR 22. The pilot evidently did not file a flight plan, according to reports. No flight plan is required because it is a VFR (visual flight rules) day, meaning clear weather.

Opposed to:
Quote
An Austin, Texas, resident with an apparent grudge against the Internal Revenue Service set his house on fire Thursday and then crashed [no mention of stole] a small plane into a building housing an IRS office with nearly 200 employees, officials said.

Federal authorities identified the pilot of the Piper Cherokee PA-28 as Joseph Andrew Stack, 53.


Now remember, this is a VITALLY important detail.

If Stack stole the plane, then there is no way to tie Stack to the crime.

It would be impossible to know who was flying that plane if the tail number didn’t tie back to Stack, at least until the rubble was searched and his burned body was identified.

There is also no way the press could have found and tied the suicide web note back to Stack so quickly unless he was identified by the tail number.

If the Fed’s go with the “stolen plane” route, then the entire thing is wildly suspect.

In his rant, Stack never mentions what exactly his plan was, so if someone just randomly found the web page and reported it to the media, there’s still no way to tie it back to Stack without knowing who the pilot was, being identified by the tail number.

Also, if Stack was under financial duress, how could he afford a plane? A seriously old beat up Cherokee will run you around 30K, not including maintenance, storage, and gas which are fairly outrageous. If the plane was a Cirrus SR 22, you're looking at a cool 250K for a used one. Thus, it makes the type of plane important.

Stack says he was wiped out and forced to dip into retirement savings before moving to TX, if you’re wiped out, typically you don’t keep a plane around.

Stack then says presently he had a boatload of undocumented income which caused him trouble with the IRS when he tried to report it. If its causing trouble with the IRS, then its not undocumented. And he must not have kept it in a bank or it would have been discovered. How did he pay for the plane, which he must have bought after moving out to TX, in order for his rant to make any sense?

Did he pay cash?

How long did he have the plane and when did he get his pilots license?



You know what else stinks?

Why did this guy set his house on fire?

1. Were his wife and kid at a hotel? Why where they there?
2. If they were in the house, why would he want to kill them?

If they were broke, what possible benefit to his family would it be to burn his house down?

Also, if you were going to kill yourself, would you bother to take any identifying information with you like a wallet? Wouldn't you leave your wallet where your wife would find it so she could keep the credit cards and money?

Why burn that house down?



From the suicide note:
Quote
"If you’re reading this, you’re no doubt asking yourself, “Why did this have to happen?” The simple truth is that it is complicated and has been coming for a long time. The writing process, started many months ago, was intended to be therapy in the face of the looming realization that there isn’t enough therapy in the world that can fix what is really broken.


Yet the creation date of the note CLEARLY states it was created 2 days ago, not several months ago.

That note was edited and saved 27 times in 2 days.



Hey, you know what else is weird?

As I stated earlier, Stack never mentioned his family in the suicide note.

That fact alone is mind blowing.

How many people write suicide notes and don't mention their family at all.

He doesn't say he hates them, doesn't say he loves them, doesn't wish them good bye, doesn't leave instructions to tell the kid, nothing.

Nada.

I have a hard time believing that's what a normal suicidal person does.

Never says his kids name, never says his wifes name, never says ANYTHING other that briefly mentioning he got divorced at some point in the past.

Never mentions anyone by name, not his bosses, IRS agents, no one.

No names.

The only people he mentions by name are politicians whom he's never met in person.



I found this article interesting.

A professional suicide note investigator commenting on typical suicide notes.

Stack's note contains multiple references to insanity.

Quote
Olsson's experience found that faked suicide notes reflected society's preconceptions about suicide victims being weak and unable to face their difficulties.

Those who forge such notes frequently use words such as 'crazy', 'cowardly' and 'selfish', but these are rarely found in the genuine items.

According to this reasoning, Sandra Weddell might well have killed herself, since her apparent suicide note made no reference to insanity or weakness.

Read more

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« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2010, 09:18:02 PM »

BUMP!

nice summary!   Smiley
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michaelsuede
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« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2010, 09:27:36 PM »

Stack writes:

Quote
To survive, I was forced to cannibalize my savings and retirement, the last of which was a small IRA.  This came in a year with mammoth expenses and not a single dollar of income.  I filed no return that year thinking that because I didn’t have any income there was no need.  The sleazy government decided that they disagreed.  But they didn’t notify me in time for me to launch a legal objection so when I attempted to get a protest filed with the court I was told I was no longer entitled to due process because the time to file ran out.  Bend over for another $10,000 helping of justice.

So now we come to the present.  After my experience with the CPA world, following the business crash I swore that I’d never enter another accountant’s office again.  But here I am with a new marriage and a boatload of undocumented income, not to mention an expensive new business asset, a piano, which I had no idea how to handle.  After considerable thought I decided that it would be irresponsible NOT to get professional help; a very big mistake.


So he's stating he was wiped out financially after moving to TX, which was just a few years ago that he made this move.

How can this guy afford a plane?

He's complaining about owning a piano?
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TheTimeToActIsNow
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« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2010, 09:29:27 PM »

Yes.  Kudos for asking all these questions and pointing out all the inconsistencies in the stories.  As always, there's more to these incidents then initially meets the eye.  Great post Wink
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« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2010, 09:32:09 PM »

Yes, and asking questions is what all Americans (and all people) must do! When you know the media and govts lie (as well as their elite controllers), you learn to always question everything!
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« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2010, 09:39:41 PM »

Yeah, nice summary.  The piano thing--a lot of people are stuck right now with possessions they can't sell.  Like houses.  Just not enough money around.  He was a professional musician, so he would have a lot of expensive equipment.  And if his wife is a classical pianist and makes her living at it, then it's a necessary tool of her trade.
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michaelsuede
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« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2010, 09:43:05 PM »

Yeah, nice summary.  The piano thing--a lot of people are stuck right now with possessions they can't sell.  Like houses.  Just not enough money around.  He was a professional musician, so he would have a lot of expensive equipment.  And if his wife is a classical pianist and makes her living at it, then it's a necessary tool of her trade.

Yeah but this guy is complaining about a piano, while he owns a plane.

How can a guy who is destitute go out and buy a plane?

If he's had it for a long time, why didn't he sell it if he was so broke?

Common sense says most people would sell the plane rather than dip into retirement savings.

Planes are really expensive to own out-right, even cheap ones like Cherokees.

Most people rent them.
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michaelsuede
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« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2010, 09:48:23 PM »

Also, I really want to highlight the fact that this guy never mentions his family in the suicide note.

Keep in mind, if he really did light his house on fire with them inside of it, he must have intended to kill them.

If he intended to kill them, he must have REALLY hated them.

If he was mad enough to try and kill them, you'd think he would have said at least SOMETHING in his suicide note about them.

This has got to be a first for suicide notes - no mention of anyone by name and no mention of the family?
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jeremystalked1
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« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2010, 10:31:25 PM »

Also, I really want to highlight the fact that this guy never mentions his family in the suicide note.

Keep in mind, if he really did light his house on fire with them inside of it, he must have intended to kill them.

If he intended to kill them, he must have REALLY hated them.

If he was mad enough to try and kill them, you'd think he would have said at least SOMETHING in his suicide note about them.

This has got to be a first for suicide notes - no mention of anyone by name and no mention of the family?


Was his house insured?  Did he have a big life insurance policy?

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michaelsuede
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« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2010, 10:33:05 PM »

more facts emerge:

Quote
Officials said they were evaluating an antigovernment manifesto posted on the Internet earlier Thursday, signed "Joe Stack," which suggested he planned the crash. "Violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer," the author wrote toward the end of a tirade against the IRS posted at 9:12 a.m. on a Web site registered to Mr. Stack. He described himself as a contract software engineer.

By late Thursday night, emergency crews had found two bodies in the wreckage, the Associated Press reported. Authorities said earlier that the pilot who crashed into the building was presumed dead and that one worker in the building was missing. Thirteen people were injured, including two who remained hospitalized for critical injuries. More than 100 IRS employees work at the building.

Thus we know a couple of key things, assuming the WSJ got its story right.

Stack's body was not discovered until late this evening. - thus the ONLY way he could have been identified so early was by the tail number of the plane.

It also provides us with the time he made his post public.

This drives me nuts.

How the hell did the media know who he was and find his web post so fast?


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Letsbereal
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« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2010, 11:04:26 PM »

All good points. Have a look at this:

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/02/18/texas.plane.crash/index.html

(CNN) -- The latest news as it comes in to CNN from the scene of the crash of a small plane in Austin, Texas. (All times are ET, one hour ahead of local Austin time.)

12:38 p.m. The pilot of the plane had set his house on fire beforehand, stole the plane and crashed it intentionally, a federal official told CNN.

11:36 a.m.: A small airplane crashed into a building in Austin, Texas, Thursday morning, according to Lynn Lundsford of the Federal Aviation Administration.



The guy did not steal the plane, he owned it.  He burned the house down last night and the child and mother spent the night in the hotel.

Evidently a radio station in Texas had an interview with the aunt of the child and she spent the night with the mother and child in the motel.  She said his car was at the hanger and that the plane was not there. She also stated that the description of the plane matched the description of his plane.


http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/news/texas/100218-austin-plane-crash-house-fire-connected


Updated: Thursday, 18 Feb 2010, 12:08 PM CST
Published : Thursday, 18 Feb 2010, 11:52 AM CST

DOUG DELONY

HOUSTON - In an interview with KLBJ radio, a woman says she believes the plane that crashed into an Austin office building on Thursday is that of an in-law who burned his house down the night before.

"My little niece is his step daughter," said the woman in an interview with KLBJ radio. "He burned their house down last night. My sister had gone over there last night to get them out of the house. They spent the night in a motel."

The woman, whose name was not immediately clear, went on to say the man's plane is now missing. She says the incident started as a domestic dispute.

"They checked before ten o'clock. His plane is gone. His car is at the hangar in Round Rock."

The woman says the description of the plane that crashed in Austin matches the description of the woman's family member.

Round Rock is located about 25 miles north of the crash site.

Federal officials tell FOX in Austin they are looking into the possibility the crash may not be an accident, however, Homeland Security has ruled out any possibility of terrorism.


So lets say she checked 9:45 which is before 10:00 O' clock - Plan crashes at 11:36 --> He flew around for 1 hour and 51 minutes - almost 2 hours which doesn't make sense.

Say he just left at 10:00 he still would be 1 hour and 36 minutes in the air at the minimum.
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« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2010, 11:14:25 PM »

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8522746.stm


"The White House said the crash did not appear to be an act of terrorism.

White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said President Barack Obama had been briefed about the incident.

The Department of Homeland Security was investigating the crash, he added.

As a precaution, the North American Aerospace Defense Command scrambled two F-16 fighter jets from Houston, Texas, to patrol the area."

but they didn't scramble any during 9-11?   
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michaelsuede
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« Reply #12 on: February 19, 2010, 12:39:01 AM »

Was his house insured?  Did he have a big life insurance policy?



Insurance wouldn't pay out for intentionally burning down your own home.

Life insurance would pay out to who?  His dead wife and kids?

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michaelsuede
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« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2010, 06:49:15 AM »

Just received this in an abovetopsecret reply to a thread I started there.



Hey guys. I know Joe's wife through a family member. I can answer all of your questions.

Joe got word of the IRS disaster (well, this round of it) earlier in the week. He seemed to keep it to himself and then it appeared to eat at him as he got more and more angry as the days went by. On Wed, he pretty much blew up and got violent, causing Sheryl to leave with her daughter (his step-daughter). They went to a hotel for the night. Days before that, she changed her email address to a private host instead of sharing his mail server (she never explained why, just that it was "effective immediately"). Clearly, things were not going well at home.

I'm guessing the reason why the family wasn't mentioned is that they'd been married about three years, he wasn't really bonded with the girl, and he was upset with Sheryl leaving. He then turned that rage towards the IRS and boom.

The money goes deeper than you think, though. Yes, it's an expensive house (and was a nice one), but it was also full of new furniture and that delicious grand piano for Sheryl to teach with (she ran lessons out of the home; that's the undocumented income). The plane, he's had that for years. He wouldn't sell it because they used it practically every weekend to relax and be together. It had a lot of emotional value to them all.

So anyway, they were at the hotel overnight and in the morning she went home and found the house on fire. She went into a neighbor's house while the firefighters did their job. That's where the "and a neighbor saved her" or whatever BS came from. She was just ducking out to have a breakdown.

The "theft" of the plane was from journalists. Because there was no flight plan, some dip# presumed it was stolen, unaware of any situation were one might not need to be filed. So, it was his plane all along and the hangar was even in his name (and another fellow, unrelated to this incident).

So ... what else? This is just a case of a good guy having too much crap happen to him. He's no martyr and there's no grand conspiracy.   


The conflicting accounts of the house fire and plane crash should not be surprising to anyone since it is commonplace, especially in cases involving traumatic incidents, to find wildly divergent eyewitness reports. That these unfiltered versions get reported without corroboration is illustrative of the current state of what passes for journalism these days.

As for the pilot's financial status, it is not at all unusual for a person to possess high value assets while, simultaneously, be on the verge of bankruptcy. If his debts far exceed the value of his assets, then he would be forced to file in order to protect at least some of what he owns.

There are many people who have found themselves in this kind of precarious situation through no fault of their own due to illness or being un/under-employed. I certainly have sympathy for them.

This coward tried to game the system and then, when he got caught, tried to paint himself as some altruistic patriot, willing to sacrifice himself for a greater good. In reality, he lacked the fortitude to fight the battle he started and, even worse, attempted to take others with him.

We are better off with him removed from the world. I hope other like-thinking individuals learn from Stack's gutless deed. He is going to be remembered as a weak loser who took the easy way out.

If that's how you want to be remembered, then by all means, go find a plane. If not, show some courage and face the music.   




Now that makes sense and answers my questions.

For some reason I believe the guy.


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agentbluescreen
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« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2010, 06:55:01 AM »

In case nobody noticed the CIA Mafia and it's Glenn Beck Republicrat "radical tea-baggers movement" is inciting civil war at home here in America. It claimed it's first victim in Austin Texas yesterday.
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« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2010, 07:06:29 AM »

In case nobody noticed the CIA Mafia and it's Glenn Beck Republicrat "radical tea-baggers movement" is inciting civil war at home here in America. It claimed it's first victim in Austin Texas yesterday.

Doesn't it seem like people are time bombs going off one at a time ?...
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« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2010, 07:07:43 AM »

"He wouldn't sell it because they used it practically every weekend to relax and be together. It had a lot of emotional value to them all."

Baloney, if you need money, then you start selling stuff, especially the big things that suck up money.  Sorry it doesn't pass the common sense test for me.
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michaelsuede
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« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2010, 08:48:59 AM »

Yeah, but this guy is speaking with certainty on the facts that I question, and each answer falls into the "makes sense" category.

For example, he said the plane was Joe's, this has been confirmed now.
We know Joe was a pilot, confirmed now.
He says he didn't try to kill his family, he just burned the house down.
He says he wasn't entirely broke, and explains the unreported income and piano comments in a reasonable way.

If what he says all checks out, I'm satisfied with that version.

To me, it just looks like a lone nut at this point, assuming his factual statements all prove to be true.


What bothers me is that the FBI knew what was going to happen ahead of time.

I can almost chalk this up to our surveillance police state.

Some super secret NSA software monitoring phone calls, web sites, computers, etc.. etc.. alerting them.

If that's the case, then the FBI/NSA are going to have some explaining to do.



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jeremystalked1
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« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2010, 10:57:14 AM »


What bothers me is that the FBI knew what was going to happen ahead of time.

I can almost chalk this up to our surveillance police state.

Some super secret NSA software monitoring phone calls, web sites, computers, etc.. etc.. alerting them.

If that's the case, then the FBI/NSA are going to have some explaining to do.

He may have been targeted.  In which case he would have been under 24/7 surveillance and they would have been prodding him in this direction using the personalized psychological warfare TI's are familiar with.  Once he formulated a plan... they devised their own to profit from it.  TI's are much more likely than the general population to "go postal", and thus they are all potentially valuable components in state sponsored mass psychological operations.

Or, he may be an intelligence operative and in exchange for getting to fake his death and retire, he's doing this one last operation (or so he thinks; as with the Mafia, you never really leave the CIA).
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« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2010, 11:10:50 AM »

This is the absolute key point.  THERE IS NO POSSIBLE WAY THAT THAT PLANE CAUSED THAT KIND OF DESTRUCTION AND A "BIG FIREBALL".

Link that to the fact that NO ONE KNEW OF STACK AS POLITICAL.  He was taken, killed, put in a remote controlled plane and flown into the building.  His website was hacked and the false manifesto was posted.  They torched his house.  There was no participation in this by Joe Stack whatsoever.  He was simply identified and profiled as a likely patsy and then set up.

The plane was either packed with explosives or the building was rigged.  Note:  the building was half empty.  Note: the was a much larger IRS building in the area that would have made a much better target for the supposed purpose. 

TOTAL, CLASSIC FALSE FLAG!
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jeremystalked1
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« Reply #20 on: February 19, 2010, 11:16:29 AM »

He was taken, killed, put in a remote controlled plane and flown into the building.  His website was hacked and the false manifesto was posted.  They torched his house.  There was no participation in this by Joe Stack whatsoever.  He was simply identified and profiled as a likely patsy and then set up.

Except, why did his family stay elsewhere while his house was torched?

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michaelsuede
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« Reply #21 on: February 19, 2010, 12:01:08 PM »

Yeah, Stack could have been targeted, he could have been mind controlled, and agents could have remote controlled the plane into the building.

BUT

I see no hard evidence has yet surfaced to support any of this.

Also, I'm looking at the political aspects of this and I don't see anyone trying to make a move based on this.  I don't see legislation immediately pending or proposed.  I don't see trading scams profiting as a fallout from this.  I don't see any money or power being gained by any particular individual by this as of yet.

All things we saw with the 9/11 attacks.

The evidence to suggest the 9/11 attacks were staged is overwhelming IMHO, but there is no hard evidence to suggest that this was anything more than a lone nut.

If more evidence comes forward suggesting as much, I'd be willing to re-evaluate my stance.

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jeremystalked1
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« Reply #22 on: February 19, 2010, 12:05:11 PM »

The evidence to suggest the 9/11 attacks were staged is overwhelming IMHO, but there is no hard evidence to suggest that this was anything more than a lone nut.

The only evidence that this is not what it seems is the suicide note.  Maybe the crisis response teams were a little too quick to show up.

It's why the first thing I thought of was the insurance angle.  (Life insurance, and maybe house insurance if they can't prove he did it.)
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michaelsuede
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« Reply #23 on: February 20, 2010, 12:56:29 PM »

One other important item of note:

Quote
Stack's father-in-law, Jack Cook, said he was aware Stack had a "hangup" with the IRS.

He said Stack's wife had become increasingly fearful of the software engineer's bouts of anger in recent weeks. He also struggled to find a job after moving from California to Austin.

Cook said Sheryl had checked herself and her 12-year-old daughter into a hotel Wednesday night and returned home Thursday to find it ablaze and Stack gone.

this really raises the hairs on my neck.

Its so coincidental.

Joe says he was writing about this for months, and the create date on the web site says the document was first created 2 days before the crash.

Thus, its so coincidental that he creates the document 2 days before the crash, and the night before the crash, he and his wife get into a fight that causes her to leave for the night.

This almost makes it appear as if his wife was complicit in his actions.

If she made reservations for a room, rather than just doing a walkin, it would implicate his wife as being an accessory.

I doubt our glorious leaders will look into that though.   
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