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chris geo
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« on: September 13, 2009, 02:12:20 AM » |
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I was just wondering what you guys thought about the Freeman On The Land idea. It seems that every source I find from Jordon Maxwell, to the Anti-Terrorist to Rob Menard all leave it pretty vague in order for you to do your own research. I've heard someone here mention it (don't want to mention names) but never really paid mind. Well, I've put in about 12 hours so far and did quite a bit of research. Everything seems in order thus far aside from one MAJOR point They claim a person is NOT a human being however every online law dictionary I find clearly states the definition as 1. a human being.
I will mention I don't have a physical copy of Black's Law Dictionary and they claim that as the ultimate end all source for legal definitions (as does Black's Law Dictionary's website). I will also mention that the internet defines Motor Vehicle as "any self propelled vehicle not traveling on rails" but the actual definition is "any self propelled vehicle not traveling on rails and engaged in commerce". The omitted information completely changes the meaning don't ya think??
So. Anyone researched this? What are your thoughts? They are really interesting concepts, but in a world run by criminals.... well you know the rest.
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Mike Philbin
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« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2009, 02:59:01 AM » |
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mankind (in the twenty-first century) are (for the first time since apes grew a proper frontal lobe) nothing more than slaves ... slaves to the feudal corporations. Why on Earth should a human's initial thought be, "How on Earth am I going to be able to afford..." new car, new house, new phone, new? I think humanity really screwed up some basic societal rules somewhere down the history or our warring-idiot nations. And it's time to completely reappraise, for the sake of humanity's freedom. for me, it's time to reclaim our planet, it's FREE and it belongs to us, to You The People. You The People - reclaim your planethttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-hJ5Mpp2N8 |
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phosphene
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« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2009, 05:57:32 AM » |
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bottom line, if the gov has u in their crosshairs, they gonna git u. No matter what language you use in the courtroom, or what petition you file, or what treaty you studied. All rights stem from owning property. But the government owns all your land. All the freeman theories conclude that that the system is fixed, then they proceed to engage the system. They get owned every time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAOA0-YYztg |
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"A strange game. The only winning move is not to play."--Joshua
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Mike Philbin
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« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2009, 07:21:20 AM » |
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Great video Mike!
Your words did however spark new thoughts but unfortunately in a negative way. There are so few of us who are consciously evolved therefore we become an even smaller minority in the scope of things. There are few of us on the planet who've broken the human instincts of greed, selfishness, the need to control others and horde the resources.
But how did we (mankind) get to be where we are (governed and enslaved)? We created it ourselves. From the beginning of time. Being half American Indian and half Greek I can say that both of my heritages are some of the oldest cultures in history. Both of my heritages banned in separate tribes/cities, fought amongst each other for resources and who knows what else and created a need to be governed. Unfortunately that goes for just about everyone on this earth. And that's where the majority of the world seems to be. They are still stuck in the same place we were when in the beginning of time. The only difference is we have more toys to distract us from our bondage. It's a Brave New World but instead of a drug, it's Ipods, sex and flat screen TVs.
It is what it is I guess. Thanks for provoking some interesting thoughts my friend!
No worries. Erm, WE didn't allow it. Some thugs called ROYALTY or FEUDAL MOB BOSSES decided to take control and (because we like an easy life rather than fighting for our continued freedom) enslave us all .. hey, it started with the Egyptians, the Sumerians .... makind has been living in a Prisoin Planet for millennia. Just because that's how it is doesn't mean it should be allowed to stay that way. This is a chance for REAL CHANGE to the detriment of the Global Bankers and the advantage of HUMANITY. |
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Waltraut
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« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2009, 10:02:07 AM » |
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are you familiar with the pre-civilization or anti-civ philosophies?
Most of North America was partially agricultural before the 1500s. Most areas had some crops (squash, bulbs, berries maize) which were tended (which only works well if families and individuals are able to protect their plot and harvest), but because most food was nonagricultural they generally only intermediate levels of personal property rights. Larger tribal groups shared hunting and fishing over large regions, and would fight other tribes, but parceling out individual fields for fish and game doesn't work well. The Aztecs with corn in southern Mexico were a real civilization, and maybe the Inca's with potatoes.
The agricultural economy or lifestyle of europeans conflicted with this quite a bit. After they deliberately spread diseases to kill off lots of indians, they still engaged in warfare to drive indians off of lower value arid lands in places like Montana and Nebraska, onto reservations.
I couldn't get the idea of what that guy was talking about on the youtube, but does he think people should go homesteading? Given that low value lands were fought over, I don't know how it will really be free for everyone to spread out from the cities onto BLM or forest service land
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Mike Philbin
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« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2009, 10:13:48 AM » |
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I don't know about 'that guy on youtube - the 10 parter' but I certainly think it's time we f**king GREW UP. We're not children anymore with our stupid guns of mass control. Put down those marketing weapons and face facts. This is our planet, as adults. This is a place upon which it should be fre to live. We just gotta tend it - and by that I DO NOT mean becoming farmers, we're not all farmers. But we can contribute to the future of our free planet in our own unique ways. Every one of us has something to offer the great free life. We just need to agree that we no longer wanna live as slaves of the corporations. From that point we can move on and start to reorganise six billions people to get the best out of them at minimal cost to ourselves and our home, this small round blue spaceship.  Mike |
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John Bannon
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Posts: 169
Thinkfree.ca
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« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2009, 03:38:11 PM » |
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When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one
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Freeski
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« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2010, 07:25:45 PM » |
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Amazing stuff. Just saw Bursting Bubbles of Government Deception... an hour and a half well-spent! |
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"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.
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changedname
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« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2010, 02:51:13 AM » |
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This concept is also what the Restore America Plan is about too!
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phosphene
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« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2010, 11:23:34 AM » |
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Menard offers some neat ideas and concepts. But the nuts and bolts aren't there.
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"A strange game. The only winning move is not to play."--Joshua
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goforward
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« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2010, 12:14:36 PM » |
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this freeman on the land stuff is next wave semantics but that's law still to much fluoride in the brain for me to stand under-understand atleast diving into this stuff will make you choose your words more carefully here are some more resources http://www.statusisfreedom.com/resources.htmhttp://www.creditorsincommerce.com/resources.php |
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Matthew 5:11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
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Freeski
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« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2010, 07:47:34 PM » |
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Menard offers some neat ideas and concepts. But the nuts and bolts aren't there.
Agreed. But he's probably just not interested in nuts and bolts himself. Maybe that's someone else's job. |
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"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Freeski
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« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2010, 07:49:09 PM » |
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I beg of you to repeat that in English. |
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"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Freeski
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« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2010, 10:05:55 PM » |
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Here's a 10-minute testimonial of a guy's encounter with cops, using the freeman/common law angle. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71z3zLjtSdY |
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"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Freeski
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« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2010, 10:51:34 PM » |
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This is the passive resistance - we need shitloads of challenges (ongoing challenges) to "their" authority. (re the video, wow! too bad the cops probably thought the guy was crazy - they missed the point) |
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"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Kilgore Trout
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« Reply #17 on: November 07, 2010, 09:51:20 PM » |
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I'm sorry to say this but any notions we have about liberty and personal freedom are null and void. The fact that the government can suspend your constitutional rights through martial law , that means they also grant your rights , which means your liberty and freedom is beholden to them , in essence they own you , and you have no rights beyond the illusions you've been fed to keep you a viable source of income through sweat equity.
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"I do not believe that there were, at the Council of Nicea,
three persons present who believed in the truth of what was set down.
If there were, it was on account of their ignorance."
J. M. Roberts, "Antiquity Unveiled", 1892
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africknamerican
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« Reply #18 on: May 22, 2011, 05:49:56 PM » |
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I'm sorry to say this but any notions we have about liberty and personal freedom are null and void. The fact that the government can suspend your constitutional rights through martial law , that means they also grant your rights , which means your liberty and freedom is beholden to them , in essence they own you , and you have no rights beyond the illusions you've been fed to keep you a viable source of income through sweat equity.
I agree. Power comes down to consent. And consent is obtained through fear, force, and fraud. They will take exactly as much of our freedom as we allow them to. I'm all for resisting arbitrary abuses of power. But, most of the stuff out there claiming to have magical word-formulas for instant freedom are bullshit. It's not that easy. Don't read "freeman" literature promising magic cures. Read the Constitution, Anti-Federalist Papers, read Bastiat's "The Law," read the Declaration of Independence, the Magna Carta, the Bible. The things that government are supposed to do are very few and easy to understand. Everything else is our business. You don't have to know every arcane detail of the Uniform Commercial Code, liens, "strawmen," maritime law, etc. to understand what should be the limits of government power. The Founding Fathers did not spout all this gobbledygook. The list of grievances in the Declaration is simple and straightforward to understand -- read it. Their solution also was simple and straightforward. Do: educate people as to what freedom is about, and as to why we need to get overbearing government out of our lives. Do: organize people at your local level, etc. By all means, if you get in trouble, use all means or "tricks" legally available to get out of trouble -- as long as they are founded in real law and not patriot wishful thinking. Don't count on "freeman" magic formulas, unless you want to gamble that maybe your gobbledygook about "commercial law" and "redemption" will annoy, baffle or shame them into letting you slip by this time ... or maybe they'll just ignore you and clap your ass behind bars as they have to so many others. |
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africknamerican
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« Reply #19 on: May 22, 2011, 06:19:46 PM » |
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I will mention I don't have a physical copy of Black's Law Dictionary and they claim that as the ultimate end all source for legal definitions (as does Black's Law Dictionary's website). I will also mention that the internet defines Motor Vehicle as "any self propelled vehicle not traveling on rails" but the actual definition is "any self propelled vehicle not traveling on rails and engaged in commerce". The omitted information completely changes the meaning don't ya think?? Laws aren't made by Black's Law Dictionary, they are made by legislators, bureaucrats, and judges. As much as I would like to get out of all my traffic-related travails by waving a Black's Law (I have been jailed for minor traffic offenses and expired licenses, and shelled out $1000s of dollars on those and other tickets), it's just not gonna happen. Judges don't follow that. They don't follow common law. They follow custom, precedent and "administrative law." If you're going to overturn decades of law and precedent and a huge part of the revenue-generating machine of States, which they justify under their "police powers" granted to them in their Constitutions, then I wish you all the best. Get ready to bring a major lawsuit. You're not going to get out of it by reading from Black's and following some ancient definition of "vehicle," even if true. The best thing to do is to research and use every tool, procedure, filing, appeal, etc. available to you within the current corrupt system. For instance, most people don't know that in traffic court, you can cross-examine the cop. Or, you can make him provide evidence that his laser gun was correctly calibrated. Those types of things are real, not patriot voodoo. If you know your rights and rules of evidence, and know that the cop violated them, well then you can take appropriate remedies there, too. Freeman talk might be able to get you out of trouble with a cop or judge who privately agrees with you that the laws are stupid. They may let you off the hook just because they personally sympathize. Or, they may simply consider you too much trouble to deal with, and so discreetly throw your case out. Didn't mean the arguments actually had substance; it was a matter of their personal discretion, or laziness. Beyond that, we do have to raise hell. We have to work to change the system. We should go to our city councils and protest the red-light cameras. We should talk to cops, give them a Citizens Rule Book, ask them if they got into law enforcement just to be a glorified tax collector. Work on them personally. Subversion is great! Just do it effectively, not naively. Also, particularly with regard to driving, realize this is a major State and local revenue source. Instituting a geolibertarian Single Taxsystem would really drive down the immense pressure on cops and revenuers to grab and squeeze motorists for every penny they can get. With an alternative source of revenue, the relative importance of draconian traffic enforcement would diminish. Then, it might be possible to change some of the more tyrannical and money-grubbing laws and regs. |
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Freeski
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« Reply #20 on: May 22, 2011, 06:22:22 PM » |
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And consent is obtained through fear, force, and fraud.
Then it's not consent. Consent has to be voluntary. You can't acquire it through extortion. –noun 3. permission, approval, or agreement; compliance; acquiescence: He gave his consent to the marriage. 4. agreement in sentiment, opinion, a course of action, etc.: By common consent he was appointed official delegate. 5. Archaic . accord; concord; harmony. [/size] |
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"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Amos
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« Reply #21 on: May 22, 2011, 06:51:53 PM » |
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It fits but Canada and USA are two different worlds.
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africknamerican
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« Reply #22 on: May 22, 2011, 10:12:56 PM » |
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Then it's not consent. Consent has to be voluntary. You can't acquire it through extortion.
–noun
3. permission, approval, or agreement; compliance; acquiescence: He gave his consent to the marriage.
4. agreement in sentiment, opinion, a course of action, etc.: By common consent he was appointed official delegate.
5. Archaic . accord; concord; harmony. [/size]
Yeah, "obedience" or "compliance" would have been more accurate maybe. Although some might say that if you do not resist force, then you are implicitly consenting.... but as to the legal definition, you are correct. |
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africknamerican
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« Reply #23 on: May 23, 2011, 01:17:49 PM » |
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I'm not opposed to the sovereign citizen concept. Heck, we should all be striving to become a little more "sovereign" each day, and take back our liberties AND responsibilities, and encourage our neighbors to do so as well. But, "be wise as serpents and harmless as doves." There aren't any secret legal formulas that you can utter to magically protect yourself against bad laws or corrupt judges. You can choose to try to outwit them but you just may be bringing a knife to a gun battle. But if you want to see it as a protest, then do it as a protest and realize you may be persecuted for it. Otherwise, our best bet is to work through recognized legal remedies, and to otherwise work to educate. inform, and change the system.
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Freeski
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« Reply #24 on: May 23, 2011, 07:58:20 PM » |
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Although some might say that if you do not resist force, then you are implicitly consenting...
Yeah I've wondered about that too... sort of like my signature line, He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it.
He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it.Martin Luther King, Jr. |
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"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.
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