Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?

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shirteesdotnet

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Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« on: July 08, 2009, 04:25:11 pm »
I was recently watching Michael Badnaricks Constitution classes over at:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4944712480955285875&ei=3XFCStfKL4G6qAPm6d3EBg&q=+constitution+class

In it he asks why we need a marriage "license" and what does that license do for us, that we couldnt already do without it? I dont know the answers. Does anyone know the benefit if any of having the license? Badnarick says the license came about 150 years ago when it was then unheard of whites marrying blacks, thus a marriage "license" came about to allow this to happen. It simply became normal for all marriages to require licenses after a while, I guess for payola money to the states? So what benefits do we get from having the license? Becuase now Im thinking about getting a divorce :) just so the government doesnt have control over me or my children.

Offline GhostofTsenzei

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2009, 04:29:19 pm »
The "License" now-a-days is needed primarily for tax breaks and legal recognition as family (and thus all the rights pertaining to a family member, like visitation, inheritance w/o a will, etc.).  Though some of those are phasing out.  Technically you don't need one to be married in a religious/technical capacity.  Though the way things are going, it wouldn't surprise me if it became illegal without a "License."
There is no "gray" when it comes to what is good or evil, it is always black and white.  People have the potential to be as evil as Hitler, or as good as Gandhi or MLK Jr.  However, most people are more like zebras.

Offline Freeski

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2009, 04:32:33 pm »
Another scam to get you to believe you need permission, and a money grab to boot?
"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." Martin Luther King, Jr.

deconstructmyhouse

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2009, 04:39:34 pm »
 
i've conducted three marriage ceremonies because I had a free card listing me as authorized to conduct the service. I got the card in a half a heartbeat and became registered as a (card-carrying) member of the Church of Spiritual Humanism online with the only question being name and addy.  Just click:  Ordain Me.   ;D

http://www.spiritualhumanism.org/ordained.php

I can also officially christen and name babies, I can affirm your love commitment  :-*, I can do funerals, conduct a religious ceremony; you name it.

after the three weddings, the county wanted to see my "credentials" to make sure the weddings I performed were "legal".  they checked it out and had no more questions.   lol

shirteesdotnet

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2009, 04:45:25 pm »
Before all of this license crap, people just got married in the church, and still do.

Offline hyperqube

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2009, 04:47:33 pm »
Quote
Does anyone know the benefit if any of having the license? Badnarick says the license came about 150 years ago when it was then unheard of whites marrying blacks, thus a marriage "license" came about to allow this to happen.


seems like it would be more of a case of the opposite to prevent unwanted marriages, ie a black and a white could NOT get a license and thus could not get married.

deconstructmyhouse

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2009, 04:47:42 pm »
5 Reasons Why Christians Should Not Obtain a State Marriage License

by Pastor Matt Trewhella

Every year thousands of Christians amble down to their local county courthouse and obtain a marriage license from the State in order to marry their future spouse. They do this unquestioningly. They do it because their pastor has told them to go get one, and besides, "everybody else gets one." This pamphlet attempts to answer the question - why should we not get one?

1. The definition of a "license" demands that we not obtain one to marry. Black’s Law Dictionary defines "license" as, "The permission by competent authority to do an act which without such permission, would be illegal."  We need to ask ourselves- why should it be illegal to marry without the State’s permission? More importantly, why should we need the State’s permission to participate in something which God instituted (Gen. 2:18-24)? We should not need the State’s permission to marry nor should we grovel before state officials to seek it. What if you apply and the State says "no"? You must understand that the authority to license implies the power to prohibit. A license by definition "confers a right" to do something. The State cannot grant the right to marry. It is a God-given right.

 

2. When you marry with a marriage license, you grant the State jurisdiction over your marriage. When you marry with a marriage license, your marriage is a creature of the State. It is a corporation of the State! Therefore, they have jurisdiction over your marriage including the fruit of your marriage. What is the fruit of your marriage? Your children and every piece of property you own. There is plenty of case law in American jurisprudence which declares this to be true.

In 1993, parents were upset here in Wisconsin because a test was being administered to their children in the government schools which was very invasive of the family’s privacy. When parents complained, they were shocked by the school bureaucrats who informed them that their children were required to take the test by law and that they would have to take the test because they (the government school) had jurisdiction over their children. When parents asked the bureaucrats what gave them jurisdiction, the bureaucrats answered, "your marriage license and their birth certificates." Judicially, and in increasing fashion, practically, your state marriage license has far-reaching implications.

3. When you marry with a marriage license, you place yourself under a body of law which is immoral. By obtaining a marriage license, you place yourself under the jurisdiction of Family Court which is governed by unbiblical and immoral laws. Under these laws, you can divorce for any reason. Often, the courts side with the spouse who is in rebellion to God, and castigates the spouse who remains faithful by ordering him or her not to speak about the Bible or other matters of faith when present with the children.

As a minister, I cannot in good conscience perform a marriage which would place people under this immoral body of laws. I also cannot marry someone with a marriage license because to do so I have to act as an agent of the State!  I would have to sign the marriage license, and I would have to mail it into the State. Given the State’s demand to usurp the place of God and family regarding marriage, and given it’s unbiblical, immoral laws to govern marriage, it would be an act of treason for me to do so.

4. The marriage license invades and removes God-given parental authority. When you read the Bible, you see that God intended for children to have their father’s blessing regarding whom they married. Daughters were to be given in marriage by their fathers (Dt. 22:16; Ex. 22:17; I Cor. 7:38). We have a vestige of this in our culture today in that the father takes his daughter to the front of the altar and the minister asks, "Who gives this woman to be married to this man?"

Historically, there was no requirement to obtain a marriage license in colonial America. When you read the laws of the colonies and then the states, you see only two requirements for marriage. First, you had to obtain your parents permission to marry, and second, you had to post public notice of the marriage 5-15 days before the ceremony.

Notice you had to obtain your parents permission. Back then you saw godly government displayed in that the State recognized the parents authority by demanding that the parents permission be obtained. Today, the all-encompassing ungodly State demands that their permission be obtained to marry.

By issuing marriage licenses, the State is saying, "You don’t need your parents permission, you need our permission." If parents are opposed to their child’s marrying a certain person and refuse to give their permission, the child can do an end run around the parents authority by obtaining the State’s permission, and marry anyway. This is an invasion and removal of God-given parental authority by the State.

5. When you marry with a marriage license, you are like a polygamist. From the State’s point of view, when you marry with a marriage license, you are not just marrying your spouse, but you are also marrying the State.

The most blatant declaration of this fact that I have ever found is a brochure entitled "With This Ring I Thee Wed." It is found in county courthouses across Ohio where people go to obtain their marriage licenses. It is published by the Ohio State Bar Association. The opening paragraph under the subtitle "Marriage Vows" states, "Actually, when you repeat your marriage vows you enter into a legal contract. There are three parties to that contract. 1.You; 2. Your husband or wife, as the case may be; and 3. the State of Ohio."

See, the State and the lawyers know that when you marry with a marriage license, you are not just marrying your spouse, you are marrying the State! You are like a polygamist! You are not just making a vow to your spouse, but you are making a vow to the State and your spouse.  You are also giving undue jurisdiction to the State.

When Does the State Have Jurisdiction Over a Marriage?

God intended the State to have jurisdiction over a marriage for two reasons - 1). in the case of divorce, and 2). when crimes are committed i.e., adultery, bigamy. etc. Unfortunately, the State now allows divorce for any reason, and it does not prosecute for adultery.

In either case, divorce or crime, a marriage license is not necessary for the courts to determine whether a marriage existed or not. What is needed are witnesses. This is why you have a best man and a maid of honor.  They should sign the marriage certificate in your family Bible, and the wedding day guest book should be kept.

Marriage was instituted by God, therefore it is a God-given right. According to Scripture, it is to be governed by the family, and the State only has jurisdiction in the cases of divorce or crime.

History of Marriage Licenses in America

 

George Washington was married without a marriage license.  So, how did we come to this place in America where marriage licenses are issued?

Historically, all the states in America had laws outlawing the marriage of blacks and whites. In the mid-1800’s, certain states began allowing interracial marriages or miscegenation as long as those marrying received a license from the state. In other words they had to receive permission to do an act which without such permission would have been illegal.

Blacks Law Dictionary points to this historical fact when it defines "marriage license" as, "A license or permission granted by public authority to persons who intend to intermarry." "Intermarry" is defined in Black’s Law Dictionary as, "Miscegenation; mixed or interracial marriages."

Give the State an inch and they will take a 100 miles (or as one elderly woman once said to me "10,000 miles.") Not long after these licenses were issued, some states began requiring all people who marry to obtain a marriage license. In 1923, the Federal Government established the Uniform Marriage and Marriage License Act (they later established the Uniform Marriage and Divorce Act). By 1929, every state in the Union had adopted marriage license laws.

What Should We Do?

Christian couples should not be marrying with State marriage licenses, nor should ministers be marrying people with State marriage licenses. Some have said to me, "If someone is married without a marriage license, then they aren’t really married." Given the fact that states may soon legalize same-sex marriages, we need to ask ourselves, "If a man and a man marry with a State marriage license, and a man and woman marry without a State marriage license - who’s really married? Is it the two men with a marriage license, or the man and woman without a marriage license? In reality, this contention that people are not really married unless they obtain a marriage license simply reveals how Statist we are in our thinking. We need to think biblically.  (As for homosexuals marrying, outlaw sodomy as God's law demands, and there will be no threat of sodomites marrying.)

You should not have to obtain a license from the State to marry someone anymore than you should have to obtain a license from the State to be a parent, which some in academic and legislative circles are currently pushing to be made law.

When I marry a couple, I always buy them a Family Bible which contains birth and death records, and a marriage certificate. We record the marriage in the Family Bible. What’s recorded in a Family Bible will stand up as legal evidence in any court of law in America. Early Americans were married without a marriage license. They simply recorded their marriages in their Family Bibles. So should we.

(Pastor Trewhella has been marrying couples without marriage licenses for ten years. Many other pastors also refuse to marry couples with State marriage licenses.)

This pamphlet is not comprehensive in scope.  Rather, the purpose of this pamphlet is to make you think and give you a starting point to do further study of your own. If you would like an audio sermon regarding this matter, just send a gift of at least five dollars in cash to: Mercy Seat Christian Church 10240 W. National Ave. PMB #129 Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53227.

www.mercyseat.net)

 


deconstructmyhouse

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2009, 04:49:27 pm »
According to Lambda Legal Defense, more than 1,400 legal rights are conferred upon heterosexual married couples in the United States. By not being allowed to marry, gays and lesbians are denied these rights. Even in the state of Massachusetts, the only US state with legalized gay marriage, most of the benefits of marriage do not apply, because the Defense of Marriage Act states that the federal government only recognizes marriage as "a legal union of one man and one woman as husband and wife".

Here are some of the legal rights that married couples have and gays and lesbians are denied:

   1. Joint parental rights of children
   2. Joint adoption
   3. Status as "next-of-kin" for hospital visits and medical decisions
   4. Right to make a decision about the disposal of loved ones remains
   5. Immigration and residency for partners from other countries
   6. Crime victims recovery benefits
   7. Domestic violence protection orders
   8. Judicial protections and immunity
   9. Automatic inheritance in the absence of a will
  10. Public safety officers death benefits
  11. Spousal veterans benefits
  12. Social Security
  13. Medicare
  14. Joint filing of tax returns
  15. Wrongful death benefits for surviving partner and children
  16. Bereavement or sick leave to care for partner or children
  17. Child support
  18. Joint Insurance Plans
  19. Tax credits including: Child tax credit, Hope and lifetime learning credits
  20. Deferred Compensation for pension and IRAs
  21. Estate and gift tax benefits
  22. Welfare and public assistance
  23. Joint housing for elderly
  24. Credit protection
  25. Medical care for survivors and dependents of certain veterans

These are just a few of the 1400 state and federal benefits that gays and lesbians are denied by not being able to marry. Most of these benefits cannot be privately arranged or contracted for within the legal system.

deconstructmyhouse

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2009, 04:50:56 pm »
there was also the issue of the spread of STD's
(sexually transmitted diseases)

used to be, I'm not sure if it still is...
that you had to have a blood test to get married

Offline Clyde Barrow

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2009, 04:56:09 pm »
So people like you can't have seven wives!

;-)
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Offline freeflying

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2009, 05:38:51 pm »
Before all of this license crap, people just got married in the church, and still do.

And when I get married in a few months it will be in a church and without a license, screw them, their fees and blood tests. 

xfahctor

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2009, 05:45:50 pm »

i've conducted three marriage ceremonies because I had a free card listing me as authorized to conduct the service. I got the card in a half a heartbeat and became registered as a (card-carrying) member of the Church of Spiritual Humanism online with the only question being name and addy.  Just click:  Ordain Me.   ;D

http://www.spiritualhumanism.org/ordained.php

I can also officially christen and name babies, I can affirm your love commitment  :-*, I can do funerals, conduct a religious ceremony; you name it.

after the three weddings, the county wanted to see my "credentials" to make sure the weddings I performed were "legal".  they checked it out and had no more questions.   lol
ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Too damn funny.....and actualy pretty cool, I'm going to sign up myself.  The Reverand X

shirteesdotnet

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2009, 05:46:46 pm »
5 Reasons Why Christians Should Not Obtain a State Marriage License

by Pastor Matt Trewhella

Every year thousands of Christians amble down to their local county courthouse and obtain a marriage license from the State in order to marry their future spouse. They do this unquestioningly. They do it because their pastor has told them to go get one, and besides, "everybody else gets one." This pamphlet attempts to answer the question - why should we not get one?

Hey!  That was a pretty good read, thanks. Very informative.

shirteesdotnet

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2009, 05:51:00 pm »
ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Too damn funny.....and actualy pretty cool, I'm going to sign up myself.  The Reverand X

Thats a pretty good biz for tax right offs too :) Ohh honey, we have to perform a marriage in Hawaii again. Again Larry? Yes, Bethany... Again. Life sure sucks doesnt it. :)

Names have been changed to protect the innocent of course :) I used the name Larry from the Leisure Suit Larry games.

shirteesdotnet

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2009, 05:53:35 pm »

i've conducted three marriage ceremonies because I had a free card listing me as authorized to conduct the service. I got the card in a half a heartbeat and became registered as a (card-carrying) member of the Church of Spiritual Humanism online with the only question being name and addy.  Just click:  Ordain Me.   ;D

http://www.spiritualhumanism.org/ordained.php

I can also officially christen and name babies, I can affirm your love commitment  :-*, I can do funerals, conduct a religious ceremony; you name it.

after the three weddings, the county wanted to see my "credentials" to make sure the weddings I performed were "legal".  they checked it out and had no more questions.   lol

Deconstruct... I hate to inform you of the bad news, but you are not allowed to conduct exorcisms (circumcision and animal sacrifice for that matter). :(

deconstructmyhouse

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2009, 06:09:14 pm »
Deconstruct... I hate to inform you of the bad news, but you are not allowed to conduct exorcisms (circumcision and animal sacrifice for that matter). :(

i do ritual animal sacrifices in my garden on a regular basis
(slugs)

so go ahead, burn me at the stake
just don't burn me as a "steak"

luckee1

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2009, 06:16:48 pm »
I was recently watching Michael Badnaricks Constitution classes over at:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4944712480955285875&ei=3XFCStfKL4G6qAPm6d3EBg&q=+constitution+class

In it he asks why we need a marriage "license" and what does that license do for us, that we couldnt already do without it? I dont know the answers. Does anyone know the benefit if any of having the license? Badnarick says the license came about 150 years ago when it was then unheard of whites marrying blacks, thus a marriage "license" came about to allow this to happen. It simply became normal for all marriages to require licenses after a while, I guess for payola money to the states? So what benefits do we get from having the license? Becuase now Im thinking about getting a divorce :) just so the government doesnt have control over me or my children.

If you had watched that whole series.  You wouldn't need to ask.  The fact is the 14th Amendment when passed enslaved all Americans, by making all Americans get permission or licenses.  So instead of truly freeing the slaves it elevated the "privledges" of former slaves and reduced free Americans to citizens.  I recommend you watch the whole thing over and take notes so you can teach others.  If you hadn't noticed they do not teach civics in classes anymore.

And I think Decontruct is pulling our leg   :D

Offline egypt

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #17 on: July 08, 2009, 06:21:17 pm »
there was also the issue of the spread of STD's
(sexually transmitted diseases)

used to be, I'm not sure if it still is...
that you had to have a blood test to get married

The original reason for the license was blood tests -- but not for STDs.  It was for the RH factor in our blood.  The negative & the positive.  Because two negatives resulted in deformed children.

Offline thenewsonsofliberty

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2009, 06:46:54 pm »
it all comes back to natural person and artificial person. a marriage license represents the corporation that you and your wife occupy. by that i mean, you cant take away the rights of a natural person, but if you agree to represent this entity, this artificial person.. they have no rights. and can be taxed and slaved.

chekc out the names of license. ALL CAPS means artificial person on any document.

shirteesdotnet

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #19 on: July 08, 2009, 06:48:46 pm »
The negative & the positive.  Because two negatives resulted in deformed children.

So are you saying two negatives dont make a right?

luckee1

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #20 on: July 08, 2009, 06:53:01 pm »
The original reason for the license was blood tests -- but not for STDs.  It was for the RH factor in our blood.  The negative & the positive.  Because two negatives resulted in deformed children.

But that masks that they have been collecting and collating bllod types for many years.  It was supposedly also to keep from incestuous marriages.

http://www.childbirthsolutions.com/articles/preconception/rhesus/index.php

Simple Explanation:

Whatever our blood type (ie. A, B AB, O), we all have two Rhesus genes, called D or d, depending on whether we are Rhesus positive or negative and babies inherit one of these from each parent.

A person is Rh(D) negative if they have inherited a d gene from each parent (d/d)

A person is Rh(D) positive if they have inherited either of the following:

- a D gene from each parent (D/D)

- a D from one parent and a d from the other (D/d or d/D)

This is why it is possible to have a Rh(D) negative child if the mother is Rh(D) negative and the father Rh(D) positive. If the father has both a negative and a positive gene, the baby may inherit this negative gene and, as all Rh(D) negative women have two negative genes, the baby will definitely inherit a negative from her.

PLEASE NOTE: If a negative woman is absolutely sure that her partner is Rh(D) negative, they will surely produce Rh(D) negative offspring and no harm can come to the baby from any Rhesus antibody the mother`s blood may contain, even if she had already developed Rhesus Iso-immune disease before the pregnancy.

Rh(D) positive blood contains the D antigen which stimulates Rh(D) negative blood into producing antibodies against it. Anti-Rh(D) is also the name of the injection given after delivery (more commonly known as `anti-D`).

PLEASE NOTE: A Rh(D) positive woman would never produce an antibody against a Rh(D) negative child, as positive blood does not produce `anti-d` - there is no anti-Rh(d).

Offline Monkeypox

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #21 on: July 08, 2009, 07:01:37 pm »
The funny thing is ALL you need to be married is the license.  My understanding is that as long as you file the marriage license, you're "legally"married - even if you never went through a ceremony.

Vice-versa, if you go through a marriage ceremony, but never file the license, you're NOT "legally" married.
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Offline Freeski

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #22 on: July 09, 2009, 01:25:13 am »
And when I get married in a few months it will be in a church and without a license, screw them, their fees and blood tests. 

+1
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Offline heavyhebrew

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Re: Why Do We Need a Marriage "License"?
« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2009, 01:28:10 am »
Main reason for a marriage license is...
We work jobs we hate to pay for stuff we don't need to impress people we don't like. Am I the crazy one here?