The Austrian School Deception : Austerity , Economic Snake Oil and Genocide

[Magnumpi]

So if I were to bring up the constant inflation aspect again, as put forth by the Monetary Reform Act which you support, will you still act surprised, then say I don't know what I'm talking about? That... "essay" was amateur, lacked substance, and my 3rd grade teacher taught me the format. It's not worth the effort. Let's start with the term "brainwashed people"... And you want to be taken seriously?

What I don't get is how the value of gold, for thousands of years, has been consistent, and yet, astonishingly, it's inaccurate? Moreover, the single most absurd idea I've ever heard is that property values cannot be allowed to change. Or at least as best I understand this Disneyland economy? Because people starve if they get 30 year adjustables on 5X more than they can afford, which means, sadly, I can't trade in tangibles of "perceived" value in case I might distort the "market".

But that's not 'importent'. Colonizing Haiti with the darkies, expanding the Union, much 'importent' to because fend off bankers.

Oh yeah, and giving the Federal Reserve bankruptcy protection. Fantastic idea! Because illegal immunity just isn't good enough.

Now here's a scenario: can private individuals/companies compete with these uhh.. infrastructure projects, or is it yet another government, inefficient monopoly, as was proven with the beloved and holy railroads? More of the same, only the spelling is worse.

[Revolt426]

So if I were to bring up the constant inflation aspect again, as put forth by the Monetary Reform Act which you support, will you still act surprised, then say I don't know what I'm talking about? That... "essay" was amateur, lacked substance, and my 3rd grade teacher taught me the format. It's not worth the effort. Let's start with the term "brainwashed people"... And you want to be taken seriously?

What I don't get is how the value of gold, for thousands of years, has been consistent, and yet, astonishingly, it's inaccurate? Moreover, the single most absurd idea I've ever heard is that property values cannot be allowed to change. Or at least as best I understand this Disneyland economy? Because people starve if they get 30 year adjustables on 5X more than they can afford, which means, sadly, I can't trade in tangibles of "perceived" value in case I might distort the "market".

But that's not 'importent'. Colonizing Haiti with the darkies, expanding the Union, much 'importent' to because fend off bankers.

Oh yeah, and giving the Federal Reserve bankruptcy protection. Fantastic idea! Because illegal immunity just isn't good enough.

Now here's a scenario: can private individuals/companies compete with these uhh.. infrastructure projects, or is it yet another government, inefficient monopoly, as was proven with the beloved and holy railroads? More of the same, only the spelling is worse.

http://www.monetary.org/mengerrefutation.html

A REFUTATION OF MENGER'S THEORY OF THE “ORIGIN OF MONEY”

by Stephen Zarlenga

[Magnumpi]

Yeah, that's a no. Stick to the lightweights and mouth breathers.

[Revolt426]

By the way, for those that do not understand, the Federal Reserve is not a Bank, it is a Banking System (A parasitical one) therefor, putting the system into bankruptcy.

Do you think we can tell China "We aren't paying our debt, screw you" and avoid a war?. We are dealing with a Global Collapse of the entire world monetary system and we have the same clowns with the same non existent arguments .....

Bankruptcy Reorganization is the only Constitutional way to destroy all derivatives (You know, the 1.5 Quadrillion $ Worth that is destroying the entire planet) , once the FED system is ridded of the Derivative mess, you can go ahead and Nationalize it into the Treasury department and have a sovereign currency...

Ammended * It is also under bankruptcy judge supervision

[aerborne]

  f**k you asshole i never said i or austrians wanted fractional reserve shit.  All i said that i can think you may have gleaned over and not really read is that as the economy expands so does the purchasing power of gold. One need to look no farther than the price of gold today to see my point.  Revolt was arguing that there was not enough gold to represent the modern economy. All i was arguing was that the bigger the economy the more valuable the gold becomes. Say prices come down to where i want to buy a loaf of bread that costs half a coin that fractional notes could be made to represent such small amounts. Like if i wanted to buy something that cost 1/2 of cent wtf am i going to do i cant split the penny in half so as the economy adjusted to the gold standard you could have as many bills necessary to conduct manageable business yet still have the value of the notes pegged to gold and most importantly notes could not be made without gold to back them.

 In a nutshell  all im saying is that the economy would not be prevented from expanding due to scarcity of gold.

 If you know wtf you are talking about why didnt you counter that part of Revolt's argument?  Also if you know wtf you are talking about you need to express it better cause you suck at it.   I guess here's your big chance to lay it out clearly for all of us, What the f**k are you talking about?

When i said He i mean't revolt. I didn't refer to you in the 3rd person. You need to grow the hell up and stop flying of the hook. I've posted nothing but facts in support of austrian monetary reform, or did you forget who I was for a second there?

and furthermore your links had nothing to do with what we were talking about so apparently you dont know what the f**k you are talking about. Maybe you should figure it out before taking shots at me.

Oh? The Murray Rothbards essays the case for a genuine gold dollar and the case for a 100% gold dollar have nothing to do with your discussion?
I think they do if you're talking about a non nationalized free market currency. Chill out. My point was those are what revolt should be debunking, NOT the strawmen he's built up around the failed policies of the 1800s. He doesn't even KNOW the austrian position except from 3rd party hearsay from tarpley and zarlenga.

sure thing, anyone that read the essay would notice immediately, that i did not propose the expansion of the Government, but reforming the way it issues currency , and preventing countless people from being thrown on the street when their homes and currency deflates in value (On a Gold Standard) and the actual bubble denominated mortgage (or any loan outstanding, which is a lot of loans) stays the SAME........ Thus proving, the market does NOT correct everything, and is not infallable.....

You keep saying gold standard. Define what you're debunking here. Define you think austrians are proposing for monetary reform. You've continued to attack strawman after strawman, but have *YET* to define what it is you're opposing: Fractional reserve backed by specie? "Gold Standard" are words that could MEAN anything, and austrians don't believe in "the gold standard" as it was TRADITIONALLY in the 1800s.

http://www.monetary.org/mengerrefutation.html

A REFUTATION OF MENGER'S THEORY OF THE “ORIGIN OF MONEY”

by Stephen Zarlenga

http://www.axiomaticeconomics.com/zarlenga.php

[trailhound]

When i said He i mean't revolt. I didn't refer to you in the 3rd person. You need to grow the hell up and stop flying of the hook. I've posted nothing but facts in support of austrian monetary reform, or did you forget who I was for a second there?

 Oh my Im sorry aerborne I knocked a few beers back at a dinner party last night and came home and got on here.  I couldnt figure out why you were taking a shot at me! When i read it now i see what you meant and feel really dumb   Well i needed a good laugh this morning, sorry aerborne.   I did try to find stuff you posted in this thread i could rag on last night but as you noted we are seeing pretty eye to eye on the topic. 

 

[aerborne]

Hey, no problem =)

[planning4acrash]

Would people, particularly Revolting, and Globalist unLibertarian please stop posting garbage to bump this stupid post up?

[xTruthSeekerx]

Would people, particularly Revolting, and Globalist unLibertarian please stop posting garbage to bump this stupid post up?

could you grow up?

[Geolibertarian]

Would people, particularly Revolting, and Globalist unLibertarian please stop posting garbage to bump this stupid post up?

Would you stop being such an arrogant, self-righteous prick?

By the way, just to piss you off...

[planning4acrash]

Would you stop being such an arrogant, self-righteous prick?

At least I have a cock, unlike you, with your namby pamby fear of GOLD, economic FREEDOM and the ability of the citizen, emancipated, to make better decisions than FREAKING TARPLEY !!

[Geolibertarian]

At least I have a cock

Oh I'm sure you do -- in your mouth. 

[planning4acrash]

Oh I'm sure you do -- in your mouth. 

Yup, it reaches that far,

At least I don't talk out my ass

[xTruthSeekerx]

pissed off austrians are hilarious because they are wrong

[planning4acrash]

pissed off austrians are hilarious because they are wrong

Who else predicted this crisis ever since the break from gold in the 1970's then, hah? Fancy elaborating on your great theory about the world? Like, as if we would be in a better way if Webster Freaking Tarpley had been able to tax us to death to pay for maglevs we couldn't afford and to mine the moon for resources we could produce cheaper on earth, its ALL just aload of nonsense, to distract you from the truth,

Basically, when you argue against economic freedom, you are saying that you aren't capable of organizing your future, that you need an overlord, which is total crap,

[trailhound]

pissed off austrians are hilarious because they are wrong

 Well thats like your opinion man.

[Revolt426]

Who else predicted this crisis ever since the break from gold in the 1970's then, hah? Fancy elaborating on your great theory about the world? Like, as if we would be in a better way if Webster Freaking Tarpley had been able to tax us to death to pay for maglevs we couldn't afford and to mine the moon for resources we could produce cheaper on earth, its ALL just aload of nonsense, to distract you from the truth,

Basically, when you argue against economic freedom, you are saying that you aren't capable of organizing your future, that you need an overlord, which is total crap,

Austrian prediction method : If it's not the Austrian school (With all Austrian utopian fairy tale methods applied) , it's going to collapse (With no historical evidence at all)

And by the way, Webster Tarpley and LaRouche have been predicting this since the Carter Administration (Food for thought?), Along with numerous other economists (Not from the Austrian Cult)

I actually addressed forecasting in the original post, making a logical argument that statistical forecasting is utter bullshit because of the issue of dynamic events

A tip for you: hurling personal insults at people (or accusing them of lying in the face of actual evidence) does not prove anything.

One more thing! as i mentioned to you (about 5 times) we have not been on the Gold Standard since 1933! so your delusion that we had Gold Backed Currency in the 1970's is humorous (and arrogant)....... again, it  was an international gold standard that FIXED exchange rates, which your school OPPOSES.

[trailhound]

Austrian prediction method : If it's not the Austrian school (With all Austrian utopian fairy tale methods applied) , it's going to collapse (With no historical evidence at all)

 I was under the impression the US has been in bankruptcy since before i was born. Thats enough historical record for me.

 What caused the depression in the 1890's?

The Depression of 1893


In its impact on industry and employment, the depression of the 1890s was on a par with the Great Depression of the 1930s. In some places it began before 1890, in a deep agricultural crisis that hit Southern cotton-growing regions and the Great Plains in the late 1880s. The shock hit Wall Street and urban areas in 1893, as part of a massive worldwide economic crisis. A quarter of the nation's railroads went bankrupt; in some cities, unemployment among industrial workers exceeded 20 or even 25 percent.

Americans of different incomes experienced the depression in markedly different ways. In the bitter winter months, some poor families starved and others became wanderers. Unemployed "tramps" crisscrossed the countryside, walking or hiding on freight trains. Many appeared at the back doors of middle-class houses, pleading for work or food.

Despite the obvious structural crisis, many Americans blamed those who could not find work, accusing them of laziness or begging. Some among the unemployed blamed themselves, and stories of despair and suicide ran almost daily in many newspapers.

Many in the comfortable classes feared violence and anarchy. A series of bitter labor conflicts--such as the Homestead strike at the Carnegie Steel Works, and the Pullman strike in Chicago--captured the nation's attention before and during the depression itself. In such situations, many respectable Americans blamed violence on the strikers, though others sympathized with the plight of the underpaid and unemployed.

In 1894, Ohio businessman Jacob Coxey organized an "Industrial Army" to protest the federal government's inaction in the face of economic crisis. Coxey proposed many programs that would later win acceptance during the New Deal, but which were considered extremely radical in the 1890s. Most notably he advocated the creation of government jobs, through which unemployed men could improve the nation's roads and build public works, while also supporting their families. This project, he argued, could be financed through the issue of government bonds.

Coxey's Army picked up many allies and sympathizers on its march to Washington, but it also stirred panic among those who feared an insurrection of the unemployed. When the members of the Army reached Washington they were driven from the Capitol lawn. Coxey, who tried to read a prepared statement on the Capitol steps, was jailed for trespassing, though allies later read his speech into the Congressional Record. Coxey, who founded the newspaper Sound Money, went on to run for U.S. Representative from Ohio in 1894 (he lost to a Republican) and to serve as a delegate to the 1896 Populist convention. Because of his high profile in the party, many commentators associated Populism with "Coxeyism."

The depression remained severe in 1896, making economic conditions a crucial issue of the campaign. The sitting Democratic president, Grover Cleveland, was wildly unpopular because of the depression--a fact that helped foster a deep rift in the Democratic party, and also made Bryan's campaign an uphill battle from the start. During the first two years of McKinley's presidency the nation returned to prosperity, bringing new issues to the fore in 1898 and beyond.

[Revolt426]

I was under the impression the US has been in bankruptcy since before i was born. Thats enough historical record for me.

 What caused the depression in the 1890's?

The Depression of 1893

What caused that Depression? a reversal of Lincoln's policy of spending currency into productive infrastructure. And no, we've not been bankrupt (until mid 2007) since 1933. Even Ron Paul admits this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wz7yBRihxSM

Had James A Garfield AND McKinley (Who wanted to build railways to South America, and was a Lincoln nationalist greenbacker Republican) NOT been assassinated, that would not have even been a Depression, and McKinley's was succeeded by Teddy Roosevelt (Whom was the cousin of a British Intelligence officer) that re-instutued the Gold Standard (The opposite of what McKinley wanted) - however i am glad you brought this point up....

Since we have proven the privatized issuence of currency inevitably leads to chaos, you've actually highlighted the whole point in the Government issuence of currency, which is people have FAR MORE control over it than say, the Federal Reserve?.....

When an entity that issues currency can BYPASS Congressional appropriations, Executive signing and Treasury issuence of credit........ this leads to Weimar Germany, and Hitler. History repeats itself, it is good to not make the same mistakes over and over again.

[aerborne]

http://www.campaignforliberty.com/blog.php?view=13379

What caused that Depression? a reversal of Lincoln's policy of spending currency into productive infrastructure.

This is conjecture. What evidence do you have to back it up?

Had James A Garfield AND McKinley (Who wanted to build railways to South America, and was a Lincoln nationalist greenbacker Republican) NOT been assassinated, that would not have even been a Depression

Conjecture too.

Since we have proven the privatized issuence of currency inevitably leads to chaos, you've actually highlighted the whole point in the Government issuence of currency, which is people have FAR MORE control over it than say, the Federal Reserve?.....(1)

When an entity that issues currency can BYPASS Congressional appropriations, Executive signing and Treasury issuence of credit........ this leads to Weimar Germany, and Hitler. History repeats itself, it is good to not make the same mistakes over and over again. (2)

This brings up a couple good points:
1) What exactly do you think the austrians propose. You've bashed them incessantly but haven't once gone over their proposals. You've bashed Jackson, and fractional reserve banking backed by specie, and lied about historical facts on the greenback. Austrian's agree that jacksons specie failed, (though you lie about the cause of 1837 depression and should have aimed for gresham's law in the 1850s), Austrians agree with you that fractional reserve failed (the entire history of money book details it's failures with factual numbers and financial data) and disagree with you on the greenback lies. In all fairness i can only assume you're not lieing so much as copy pasteing stephen zarlenga who IS lieing about the greenback.

2) You've hit on something austrians agree with too, Private banks shouldn't be able to create currency. Period. No one should. Not even congress. No one should have a monopoly on the money system. No one should be able to control interest rates. No one should be able to manipulate the money supply for any reason.


What exactly are you debunking again? You still won't tell us what you're debunking. No quotes, no citations, just various attacks on history and attributing the "opposing" side to austrians. But as we all know you have no data to support your theory (or should I say zarlenga's theory) on 1837 depression, though actual financial numbers are in murray rothbards and no doubt others austrian,keynes,friedman or what have you to fact check.

You pull this 1864 number but haven't told us HOW lincoln put a limit of 450M on it when in fact, he printed  150M$ three seperate times with three seperate acts of congressional approval. But it didn't stop with lincoln, infact, we've caught you in *ANOTHER* lie.

Had James A Garfield AND McKinley (Who wanted to build railways to South America, and was a Lincoln nationalist greenbacker Republican) NOT been assassinated, that would not have even been a Depressionand McKinley's was succeeded by Teddy Roosevelt (Whom was the cousin of a British Intelligence officer) that re-instutued the Gold Standard (The opposite of what McKinley wanted) - however i am glad you brought this point up....

McKinley FORMALIZED the gold standard, and Teddy Roosevelt PRINTED NEW GREENBACKS. Infact, even WIKIPEDIA says your wrong:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_McKinley

By the 1880s, McKinley was a national Republican leader; his signature issue was high tariffs on imports as a formula for prosperity, as typified by his McKinley Tariff of 1890. As the Republican candidate in the 1896 presidential election, he upheld the gold standard, and promoted pluralism among ethnic groups

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Note

United States Notes were used before the creation of the modern Federal Reserve System as a way of moderately influencing the money supply by federal government fiat. For example, during the panic of 1907 president Theodore Roosevelt attempted to increase liquidity in the markets by authorizing the treasury to issue more greenbacks.

In Fact. McKinley was a Rockefeller man, and roosevelt was a JPMorgan man. Roosevelt was a lincoln nationalist, HE EVEN PUT LINCOLN ON THE PENNY. A tradition that lives on today. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodore_Roosevelt%27s_Presidency
But maybe you've forgotten Teddy's biggest greenback funded public works project: THE PANAMA CANAL.

here's the wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panama_Canal

http://www.campaignforliberty.com/blog.php?view=13379

Also worth mentioning. Notice Jackson's position... And lincoln and roosevelt.

•10.   Theodore Roosevelt (1901-09)

High Tariffs, Revived Lincoln's Greenback in Order to Expand the Money Supply, Essentially Created the FDA, Anti-Trust Suits, The Attempted Square Deal, An Imperialist, Enhance Executive Power, Continued America's Empire, Private Welfare, Occupation of Panama, Price Fixing of Railroad Rates, Military Response to Coal Strike, Inheritance Tax, Expanded the Navy/Sent them to Japan (led to Japanese belief in a strong military/imperialism: WWII)

[Revolt426]

Since the only quote you made that didn't rely on the typical trollish paraphrasing of "You are a liar, back it up with more evidence, i have no counter argument" (As usual) , i'll respond to this one...

McKinley FORMALIZED the gold standard, and Teddy Roosevelt PRINTED NEW GREENBACKS. Infact, even WIKIPEDIA says your wrong:

And reality says you are wrong, Wikipedia obviously allows you to add your own version of history - however the fact remains Teddy Roosevelt instituted the Gold Standard and McKinley WANTED to build railways to South America, and Teddy Roosevelt was NOTHING LIKE LINCOLN AT ALL

Oligarchy vs. Republicanism
We went, during that period, from a nation, which, despite all our errors and follies, still had a residue of the legacy of President Franklin Roosevelt—. For example, look back at the historical setting which leads into the present: When Roosevelt came into the Presidency, virtually with a couple of exceptions, every President since the assassination of President McKinley, had been a national disaster. We allied ourselves with our traditional worst enemy, the United Kingdom, the Anglo-Dutch Liberal system. The killing of McKinley opened the gate, by bringing in the nephew of a Confederate traitor [James Bulloch], Teddy Roosevelt, into the government. Roosevelt marked the change. You had an intervention of a Taft Presidency which was not so bad, but the legacy of Teddy Roosevelt held over that. Then you had a man who was a passionate advocate of the Ku Klux Klan, and who re-launched the Ku Klux Klan's building as a mass movement from inside the White House: Woodrow Wilson.

So from 1901 to that time, you had a degeneration of the U.S. political scene, and of the mentality of our people. This was reflected in the 1920s, by the so-called Flapper Age. While the U.S. economy continued to stumble along into the middle of the 1920s, it actually was on the way down, and by the time of 1929, the whole thing began to collapse.

So from 1901, with the date of the assassination of McKinley, until the entry of Franklin Roosevelt into the White House in early March of 1933, our country was run, largely dominated by a corrupt clique centered on London and what was called Wall Street. These were the guys who, at the time that Roosevelt went into office in 1933, the leaders in Wall Street, such as the grandfather of the current President of the United States, were pro-Hitler! It was Prescott Bush, the granddaddy of George W. Bush, who signed the paper issued to a bank in Germany to release U.S.-controlled funds to revitalize financially the Nazi Party in time for Hitler to be made the dictator of Germany. This was typical of the wealthy families associated with Wall Street, all tied to London....

..............
http://www.larouchepub.com/lar/2001/2844lar_berlin.html

In 1901, with the assassination of McKinley, that changed, for the worse. The changes had already begun by about 1892, in France and elsewhere, around the Dreyfus case, and other things. But in 1901, the assassination of the last pro-patriotic President of a series—William McKinley was assassinated by assets of the Theodore Roosevelt family—caused Theodore Roosevelt to become President, and a fundamental change was made in U.S. policy and U.S. relations to Europe.

Prior to that, under all patriotic Presidents, and patriotic currents in the United States, the chief foreign partners of the United States had been—since the time of the American Revolution—influences in Germany, and especially the Classical circles; influences in Russia, which had been part of the League of Armed Neutrality; and, Japan had also become an asset of the United States against the British interests. And the United States was in opposition to the Anglo-Dutch interests internationally.

This continued despite other changes until 1901 and the assassination of McKinley, at which point the United States entered into a new system of relations. It broke its attachment to the Russia of Witte and of Mendeleyev; it broke its attachment to Germany; and became an integral part of an international maritime alliance, the so-called transatlantic alliance, between the British monarchy and the United States. And with the Dutch monarchy added in as part of the pattern........................


The Darien Gap project—which would link up rail routes stretching through North and Central America, with South American corridors extending down to Argentina's Tierra del Fuego—is almost as critical. Doing this involves crossing a 60-mile stretch of dense jungle along the border between Panama and Colombia, which has never even had a highway built through it, let alone a railroad—despite the fact that detailed plans for the construction of a Pan American Railway, including the Darien Gap, were drawn up as far back as the administration of U.S. President William McKinley (1897-1901).

The Darien Gap has been newly studied by the highly qualified American rail engineer Hal Cooper. In a paper prepared for delivery in October at an international conference in Turkey (an advance copy of which was made available to EIR), Cooper presents two distinct, viable routes for the project.

"The Darien Gap railway connector would be approximately 85 to 95 miles (136 to 152 km) long and could go by either a central lowland route, parallel to the uncompleted Pan American Highway, or by an elevated hill and mountain route to the east of the Pan American highway," Cooper proposes. The former route would run "through thick tropical rain forests in parallel to the Chucunaque and Tuira Rivers where heavy rainfall, thick jungles, insects and snakes, plus frequent flooding, would be major problems over much of the year.... The alternative eastern mountain route would go over the Serranía del Darién Mountains to the Atlantic drainage side over relatively gentle grades through rolling hills with maximum elevations of 1,500 to 2,000 feet (455 to 610 meters) through heavy tropical forests."

"A significant challenge would be involved no matter what routes were chosen," Cooper notes. "The western lowlands route would be shorter in length, but would go through flood prone areas with heavy rainfall, and would have to be built through a national park. The eastern highland route would be longer, but would be able to avoid much of the flood prone areas and would probably not need any tunnels, and would not have to be built on an elevated course way."

In Figure 2, we present EIR's proposed routes for the South American portion of the World Land-Bridge, including both the small number of existing rail lines, as well as new lines to be built. These will be high-speed, standard-gauge rail lines, that will be double-tracked for most of the route. They will have to be entirely electrified, and/or magnetic levitation lines, which will, in turn, require a major increase in the availability of power—which can only come from the large-scale development of nuclear energy.

Once the rail line has crossed the Darien Gap into Colombia, it will branch into three, major North-South continental corridors. The Western Corridor will run south from Bogotá through Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia, Paraguay, and into Argentina. This route will run along the eastern foothills of the Andes Mountains, laying the basis for opening up the entire undeveloped interior of the continent, which runs from the Andes to the Atlantic coast.

[Revolt426]

While McKinley may have advocated a Gold Standard, there is no doubt he was a Lincoln Nationalist - he wanted to build a railway to South America (Or Ibero America), Teddy Roosevelt came in and reversed that ideal and added a lot of kookery (In other regards , not economics).

[Revolt426]

By the way, it is noteworthy to mention Lincoln did the exact opposite in regards to foreign relations , and Teddy Roosevelt had British Traitors all over his immediate family.

Actually, without Lincoln allying with the Czar of Russia, the Civil War would have destroyed the United States.

Teddy Roosevelt was put in to destroy relations with certain countries to pave the way for WWI

[Revolt426]

I forgot about War Plan Red, (Although i concede it has nothing to do with economics).... This also occured after McKinley was killed, and we do know Lord Palmerston of Britain was responsible for the Confederacy seceeding..... War Plan Red actually led to Pearl Harbor. So we have Lincoln, 100% enemy of Britain, and Teddy Roosevelt 100% ALLY of Britain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red

......War Plan Red was created because Americans knew Britain was locked in a strategic alliance with Japan, the Anglo-Japanese Alliance of 1902. American planners thought that Britain’s imperial reach would bring it into conflict with the US. In 1935 War Plan Red was updated and specified which roads to use in the invasion. "The best practicable route to Vancouver is via Route 99" (Carlson, 2005). Further, in 1935 Americans planned to build three military airfields near the Canadian border and disguise them as civilian airports. "In February 1935, the War Department arranged a Congressional appropriation of $57 million dollars to build three border air bases for the purposes of pre-emptive surprise attacks on Canadian air fields" (Berlin Glasnost, 1992-2007). The airfields were to be kept secret but their existence were accidentally published on the front page of the New York Times on May 1, 1935.

[Revolt426]

I love how the Campaign for liberty website lies about everything, since this forum has debunked that Lincoln had ANYTHING to do with creating the Civil War and it was Lord Palmerston of Britain - And McKinley actually OPPOSED the Spanish American War.....? And bashing Kennedy? WTF? Re-Written  history at it's best, bravo!

http://www.campaignforliberty.com/blog.php?view=13379
The Worst (Starting with the Worst)

•1.       Abraham Lincoln (1861-65)

Caused the Civil War, Burned the South, Started the First Draft Ever, Huge Protection Tariffs, Income Tax, Corporate Welfare, Cotton Trade Takeover, Huge Deficits, US Bank/Ended the Gold Standard with the Greenback, Censorship of the Press, Imprisonment/Deportation of Political Opponents, Deported African-Americas to Liberia


•7.       William McKinley (1897-1901)

Spanish-American War, The Blatantly Imperialistic Philippine War, Imprisoned Political Opponents, Huge Tariffs, Intervened in the Boxer Rebellion, Expansionist/Imperialistic Policies like Annexing Hawaii, Puerto Rico, Cuba, the Philippians, and Guam, America's Asian Empire, which ultimately led to Pearl Harbor and WWII

 •14.   John F. Kennedy (1961-63)

Bay of Pigs, First NonWar/Recession Deficit, Sent troops to Vietnam, Cuban Missile Crisis (almost caused Nuclear War), Iraq Coup (Helped the Rise of Saddam Hussein), Created the Peace Corps, Planned and Pushed for All of the Great Society Programs


OMG, *AMMENDED* IT SAYS CALVIN COOLIDGE (Who allowed Andrew Mellon to orchestrate the Crash of 1929) is the 8th BEST PRESIDENT:

•8.       Silent Calvin Coolidge (1923-29)

Noninterventionist, Opposed the League of Nations, Lower Taxes, Vetoed Farm Subsidies/Bailouts, Paid Debt, Gave Native Americans Citizenship, Free Market, BUT: Continued Prohibition/the Federal Reserve

[sig_garrett]

Revolt426 - Thanks for publishing the articles.   

The headline caught my attention.

I don't have anything to contribute but I am compelled to say that diversity of opinion and perspective should be held sacred. I appreciate the hard work and information you are sharing.

Regardless of any particular economic theory, corruption always seems inevitable. Perhaps the root of the problem exists in the hearts of men?

[Revolt426]

Revolt426 - Thanks for publishing the articles.   

The headline caught my attention.

I don't have anything to contribute but I am compelled to say that diversity of opinion and perspective should be held sacred. I appreciate the hard work and information you are sharing.

Regardless of any particular economic theory, corruption always seems inevitable. Perhaps the root of the problem exists in the hearts of men?

There will always be corruption, but it AMAZED me to see that on the Campaign for Liberty website!, good lord.

Teddy Roosevelt's Rough Riders started the god damned spanish american war - McKinley was opposed to it , Roosevelt started it.......

The Lincoln issue has been debunked IN DETAIL numerous times on this forum, Lord Palmerston , Prime Minister of Britain wanted to cut the United States in half. So he funded the Confederacy, gave them free trade agreements for cheap slave cotton and sent in military advisors like CONFEDERATE GENERAL ALBERT PIKE.

And the Bashing of John F Kennedy, as if he was responsible for the CIA hitting Cuba behind his back.... he actually attempted to DESTROY the CIA.

Then the final oddity, Calvin Coolidge (Of all people) ranked 8th BEST President, the guy responsible for allowing his Treasury Secretary to create a bubble (Andrew Mellon) that was imploded in 1929.......

I Just can't believe what i am seeing here......

[Revolt426]

Here is your Panama Canal:
http://www.larouchepub.com/other/1995/2245_colombia_uraba.html

With Urabá, the history of Panama may be repeated. In 1903, Panama "won" its independence from Colombia thanks to the intervention of U.S. Marines, deployed by the British-run President of the United States, Teddy Roosevelt. Immediately afterwards, Panama signed a treaty with the United States in which Panama granted a chunk of its territory for the United States to build an interoceanic canal.

The Gulf of Urabá is one of the only routes possible for a new, sea-level interoceanic canal. Only 100 kilometers separate Urabá on the Atlantic Ocean from the Pacific. It also borders on the Darién National Park of Panama, a narco-terrorist refuge. Urabá has some of the most fertile land in Colombia, and is also a natural sea outlet for Medellín, Colombia's most industrialized city. However, there is currently no decent highway between Medellín and Urabá, much less a railroad.

In the late 1960s, Urabá was converted into banana plantations under United Fruit Co. EIR's book Dope, Inc. identifies United Fruit, later United Brands, as a front for the international drug trade. United Fruit invented the technique of transporting cocaine to the United States packed in banana skins.

During the 1970s, United Fruit decided to sell its Urabá land, to dedicate itself exclusively to banana transport. That period precisely coincides with the creation of the so-called Medellín Cartel, which got its start stuffing cocaine into bananas for export. Since that time, violence has grown in the area, until it now serves as the pretext the United Nations needs to dismember Urabá from Colombia.

...............

Under Roosevelt, the nation was told that the western frontier was closed; that "conservation," rather than agro-industrial development, was the future. Government land was withdrawn from public use; steps were taken to overturn Lincoln's programs to create family farms, railroads, and mines. British-backed financier Edward H. Harriman illegally used vast land grants for speculation, with Roosevelt's blessing, then paid for Roosevelt's election in 1904. British-run financier J.P. Morgan seized control over the great industries--steel, electricity, railroads--that had been created by Lincoln's nationalists; Morgan's trusts were undisturbed by Teddy Roosevelt, despite his false "trust-buster" reputation. And, TR flouted U.S. laws calling for cooperation with Ibero-American nations, using Morgan's and Harriman's employees and agents for a proxy war that broke off the province of Panama from Colombia, to build a canal on terms pitting the United States against its southern neighbors.

[planning4acrash]

I love how the Campaign for liberty website lies about everything, since this forum has debunked that Lincoln had ANYTHING to do with creating the Civil War and it was Lord Palmerston of Britain - And McKinley actually OPPOSED the Spanish American War.....? And bashing Kennedy? WTF? Re-Written  history at it's best, bravo!

http://www.campaignforliberty.com/blog.php?view=13379

You condescending TWIT, that was a MEMBERS post, from a blogger. It was their FIRST EVER post. And blogrolls are not censored on campaignforliberty. Why not argue with him.

You go to say that Ron Paul (he owns the site) lies about everything, but in actual fact he is just giving people freedom of speech. You are free to criticise that SINGLE blogger. One wonders whether this was not a REVOLTING426 False Fag. Because you managed to pick up the first ever blog of a single person to "DEBUNK" the entire Ron Paul Movement.

You are a disgusting idiot.

[planning4acrash]

And, back in reality, whilst Ron Paul gathers over 180 co-sponsors to audit the Feral Reserve, and publicly speak with great authority on torture http://www.infowars.com/torturing-the-rule-of-law/ .

,, whilst, back in LA LA LAND, Revolting finds, or maybe creates a single straw man blogroll post by himself, or a patsy campaingforliberty blogger.

[Geolibertarian]

An intelligent onlooker might, upon reading planning4acrash's reactionary drivel, conclude that that particular poster is both a

condescending TWIT

...and a

disgusting idiot.

And he'd be right.

[EvadingGrid]

An intelligent onlooker might, upon reading planning4acrash's reactionary drivel, conclude that that particular poster is both a

...and a

And he'd be right.

I think he qualifies as a Troll.
 

[Revolt426]

You condescending TWIT, that was a MEMBERS post, from a blogger. It was their FIRST EVER post. And blogrolls are not censored on campaignforliberty. Why not argue with him.

You go to say that Ron Paul (he owns the site) lies about everything, but in actual fact he is just giving people freedom of speech. You are free to criticise that SINGLE blogger. One wonders whether this was not a REVOLTING426 False Fag. Because you managed to pick up the first ever blog of a single person to "DEBUNK" the entire Ron Paul Movement.

You are a disgusting idiot.

did you realize your friend aeorborne used that as a source before that knee jerk reaction bypassed your brain ? did i say a word about ron paul ......can you do anything but use ron paul as some sort of argument and insult people ?

[aerborne]

Since the only quote you made that didn't rely on the typical trollish paraphrasing of "You are a liar, back it up with more evidence, i have no counter argument" (As usual) , i'll respond to this one...

And reality says you are wrong, Wikipedia obviously allows you to add your own version of history - however the fact remains Teddy Roosevelt instituted the Gold Standard and McKinley WANTED to build railways to South America, and Teddy Roosevelt was NOTHING LIKE LINCOLN AT ALL

Did I wiki edit this page? Did i make up the gold standard act of 1900? Did i make up the date of march 14th
http://www.historycentral.com/Documents/GoldStandard.html

McKinley fomalized the gold standard, and TR Built the panama canal off the greenback. You're just flat out WRONG.

Lets recount:

You're wrong on the 450M$ limit, you're wrong on the 1837 depression, You're wrong on privately funded railroads, (James J Hill's company was one of the few to not only survive the 1893 depression but increased it's net worth during the depression by 10Mil) You were wrong on the 1980 gold price. You were wrong on gold in the great depression, And here you are trying to save face on McKinley/Roosevelt by accusing me of editting the wiki. McKinley formalized the gold standard. You're full of lies and half truths. You seem to have the conclusion first and cherry pick history to support it.

 

[trailhound]

Did I wiki edit this page? Did i make up the gold standard act of 1900? Did i make up the date of march 14th
http://www.historycentral.com/Documents/GoldStandard.html

McKinley fomalized the gold standard, and TR Built the panama canal off the greenback. You're just flat out WRONG.

Lets recount:

You're wrong on the 450M$ limit, you're wrong on the 1837 depression, You're wrong on privately funded railroads, (James J Hill's company was one of the few to not only survive the 1893 depression but increased it's net worth during the depression by 10Mil) You were wrong on the 1980 gold price. You were wrong on gold in the great depression, And here you are trying to save face on McKinley/Roosevelt by accusing me of editting the wiki. McKinley formalized the gold standard. You're full of lies and half truths. You seem to have the conclusion first and cherry pick history to support it.

 Thats what you do when you and your partner have an agenda.

[planning4acrash]

did you realize your friend aeorborne used that as a source before that knee jerk reaction bypassed your brain ? did i say a word about ron paul ......can you do anything but use ron paul as some sort of argument and insult people ?

You used the source as "proof" that campaignforliberty was snake oil, Ron Paul IS Campaignforliberty

[planning4acrash]

Go get em Burmey:

TODAY ON THE ALEX JONES SHOW: "Jason also talks with libertarian political commentator, activist, proponent of the Austrian School of economics, and chairman of the Ludwig von Mises Institute, Lew Rockwell. "


Wohooooo!!!!!

[aerborne]

The Lincoln issue has been debunked IN DETAIL numerous times on this forum, Lord Palmerston , Prime Minister of Britain wanted to cut the United States in half. So he funded the Confederacy, gave them free trade agreements for cheap slave cotton and sent in military advisors like CONFEDERATE GENERAL ALBERT PIKE.

So lincolns massive tarrif acts and blockade of their ports to collect revenue had nothing to do with splitting the us at all? Lincoln's government was policies were a huge part in splitting the US, and he destroyed state's rights, and consolidated massive federal power.

to quote lincoln on the blockades after southern states refused to pay 47% tariffs:

"Whereas an insurrection against the Government of the United States has broken out in the States of South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Florida, Mississippi, Louisiana, and Texas, and the laws of the United States for the collection of the revenue cannot be effectually executed

But you act as if either, that justifies the following, or that the following DIDN'T happen. Which is it?
Burned the South, Started the First Draft Ever, Censorship of the Press, Imprisonment/Deportation of Political Opponents, Deported African-Americas to Liberia.

[donnay]

Go get em Burmey:

TODAY ON THE ALEX JONES SHOW: "Jason also talks with libertarian political commentator, activist, proponent of the Austrian School of economics, and chairman of the Ludwig von Mises Institute, Lew Rockwell. "


Wohooooo!!!!!

Yes, it was a great interview! 

[Freeski]

Go get em Burmey:

TODAY ON THE ALEX JONES SHOW: "Jason also talks with libertarian political commentator, activist, proponent of the Austrian School of economics, and chairman of the Ludwig von Mises Institute, Lew Rockwell. "


Wohooooo!!!!!

Outstanding!